RLWC21 Legacy

[Tosh]

Win or lose what could the potential legacy of a Samoa appearance in the final of the RLWC21 be for the pacific?

Obviously the ridiculous calls for a combined “pacific” team based in New Zealand entering the NRL as the 18th team will only grow.

Personally I’d like to see the “PacifiqueXIII” team idea renewed and possibly a similar combined Samoa&Tonga team playing in either the NSW cup or Queensland cup.

[Tosh]

Also would a potential England win or Samoa win been bigger for the sport as a whole?

[Man of Kent]

There won’t be any of that Tosh.

No money in it. That said, there will be increased popularity of RL among Samoans and the Samoan diaspora.

There will be more Tests involving Samoa, maybe even a Test in Samoa.

If anything, I’d like to see more Samoa v Tonga games, which are not far off Origin style grudge matches.

[Tosh]

9 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

There won’t be any of that Tosh.

No money in it. That said, there will be increased popularity of RL among Samoans and the Samoan diaspora.

There will be more Tests involving Samoa, maybe even a Test in Samoa.

If anything, I’d like to see more Samoa v Tonga games, which are not far off Origin style grudge matches.

Im not so sure MOK.

The potential of the Australian government or maybe even the New Zealand government funding such a bid has already been floated before the RLWC21 started and with Samoa reaching the final it can only see the calls for such a team grow louder.

Edited November 12, 2022 by Tosh

[Jughead]

The legacy is games next year. The momentum created needed fixtures for people to get excited about. There was, we were told, a big uplift in ticket sales after the England v Samoa group game, why we’ve not had games lined up and announced in advance to make the most of this momentum is stupid. 

[Tosh]

4 minutes ago, Jughead said:

The legacy is games next year. The momentum created needed fixtures for people to get excited about. There was, we were told, a big uplift in ticket sales after the England v Samoa group game, why we’ve not had games lined up and announced in advance to make the most of this momentum is stupid. 

Aren’t NZ supposed to be touring next year?

[Colin James]

The legacy of this World Cup is in the women's and wheelchair games.

 

[Jughead]

4 minutes ago, Tosh said:

Aren’t NZ supposed to be touring next year?

Nothing confirmed, as yet. Ideally, as well as the World Cup tickets, we could and should have had tickets available for games next year, too. 

If we had NZ, for example, next year at St James’, in the aftermath of the Samoa demolition, we’d have sold a load of tickets for that. Quite possibly the same for a game in London in 2023 after today’s game. 

[Colin James]

Just now, Jughead said:

Nothing confirmed, as yet. Ideally, as well as the World Cup tickets, we could and should have had tickets available for games next year, too. 

If we had NZ, for example, next year at St James’, in the aftermath of the Samoa demolition, we’d have sold a load of tickets for that. Quite possibly the same for a game in London in 2023 after today’s game. 

That requires the kind of forward thinking that simply doesn't exist in our sport. We've been live on the BBC night after night for a month and as far as I can see haven't used it to sell anything beyond the current tournament.

[The British Lion]

58 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

There will be more Tests involving Samoa, maybe even a Test in Samoa.

If anything, I’d like to see more Samoa v Tonga games, which are not far off Origin style grudge matches.

I hope this does happen. All credit to Samoa, Tonga previously, and PNG who beat us (GB / England) pe-pandemic. They SHOULD have a regular Pacific cup tournament scheduled bi-annually perhaps - but, Ive yet to se RL capitalize on a World Cup after its completed, sadly.

[tiffers]

2 minutes ago, Jughead said:

The legacy is games next year. The momentum created needed fixtures for people to get excited about. There was, we were told, a big uplift in ticket sales after the England v Samoa group game, why we’ve not had games lined up and announced in advance to make the most of this momentum is stupid. 

I very nearly started a thread along these lines before the game today... In the hope of an England win today and anticipating a WC final buzz to be all over the media. It's the hope that kills you.

Do we really think that the RFL would've been able to capitalise on an England world cup win?

In my opinion at least, not a cat in hells chance would they have...

We have really struggled to turn positive viewing figures into ticket sales across the tournament for a whole host of reasons (geographic saturation / terrible user journey on websites / pricing policies to name a few). We are also yet to have any confirmed news about the next international window in 12 months time... If we don't act now, literally in the next 24-48hrs, we will be losing serious momentum from the WC. Particularly with all the other international sport happening this autumn.

Given everything I have seen so far with this world cup, I don't understand how the RFL could possibly harness a leap in interest. We haven't got the basics in place to do that... No active campaigns to drive players participation at clubs, no marketing plans in place to drive engagement with international calendars for next year, no direct link into professional clubs for viewership.

I don't understand how the RFL would have the resources or the where with all to take advantage... There is no legacy plan for the WC. Yes the national lottery have put some money into existing facilities and absolutely that is great to see. But it is for an already established audience. It's not driving the new interest and audiences we have just built up, nor is it lead by the RFL. That's the bit that is missing for me.

It's brilliant to get 1mln watching on BBC One. But if we aren't pointing people in how they can get involved with the game then it is purely a transactional relationship that misses the best opportunity to grow RL in the UK for a long time to come...

[Man of Kent]

1 minute ago, The British Lion said:

I hope this does happen. All credit to Samoa, Tonga previously, and PNG who beat us (GB / England) pe-pandemic. They SHOULD have a regular Pacific cup tournament scheduled bi-annually perhaps - but, Ive yet to se RL capitalize on a World Cup after its completed, sadly.

I’m hopeful this time around because the current ARLC have often spoken about the growth potential of the international game. The AFL doesn’t have what we have etc.

[Jughead]

3 minutes ago, tiffers said:

I very nearly started a thread along these lines before the game today... In the hope of an England win today and anticipating a WC final buzz to be all over the media. It's the hope that kills you.

Do we really think that the RFL would've been able to capitalise on an England world cup win?

In my opinion at least, not a cat in hells chance would they have...

We have really struggled to turn positive viewing figures into ticket sales across the tournament for a whole host of reasons (geographic saturation / terrible user journey on websites / pricing policies to name a few). We are also yet to have any confirmed news about the next international window in 12 months time... If we don't act now, literally in the next 24-48hrs, we will be losing serious momentum from the WC. Particularly with all the other international sport happening this autumn.

Given everything I have seen so far with this world cup, I don't understand how the RFL could possibly harness a leap in interest. We haven't got the basics in place to do that... No active campaigns to drive players participation at clubs, no marketing plans in place to drive engagement with international calendars for next year, no direct link into professional clubs for viewership.

I don't understand how the RFL would have the resources or the where with all to take advantage... There is no legacy plan for the WC. Yes the national lottery have put some money into existing facilities and absolutely that is great to see. But it is for an already established audience. It's not driving the new interest and audiences we have just built up, nor is it lead by the RFL. That's the bit that is missing for me.

It's brilliant to get 1mln watching on BBC One. But if we aren't pointing people in how they can get involved with the game then it is purely a transactional relationship that misses the best opportunity to grow RL in the UK for a long time to come...

The way England RL are run is one of the reasons that I’m not an England fan. The missed opportunities previously and lack of accountability or attempts of change has lead me to always believe that a World Cup win would not be capitalised upon and that’s a long held opinion of mine. 

Of England’s attendances of approximately 150,000, 83k of that figure have been in Newcastle and London, two cities without professional clubs and no plans in place to return in the immediate future, despite such attendances.

[tiffers]

2 minutes ago, Jughead said:

The way England RL are run is one of the reasons that I’m not an England fan. The missed opportunities previously and lack of accountability or attempts of change has lead me to always believe that a World Cup win would not be capitalised upon and that’s a long held opinion of mine. 

Of England’s attendances of approximately 150,000, 83k of that figure have been in Newcastle and London, two cities without professional clubs and no plans in place to return in the immediate future, despite such attendances.

Completely agree with the lack of accountability. There just is no tangible link-up between the WC happening in England and how we turn that into longer-term demand and participation.

It's criminal to have such massive attendances and not be working those newly built audiences in those cities with no strategic growth plans. It smacks of short-term thinking.

Any one worth their salt would be looking at scenarios of England losing at various stages of the tournament and now actively kicking into driving demand for the (yet to be confirmed) NZ test series next autumn. I suspect we won't hear anything at all until after the final. It wouldn't remotely surprise me if we don't hear anything for weeks afterwards... then wonder why we have to work so hard to sell tickets again next year...

[Tosh]

7 hours ago, Jughead said:

Nothing confirmed, as yet. Ideally, as well as the World Cup tickets, we could and should have had tickets available for games next year, too. 

If we had NZ, for example, next year at St James’, in the aftermath of the Samoa demolition, we’d have sold a load of tickets for that. Quite possibly the same for a game in London in 2023 after today’s game. 

If it is to be NZ then.

1st test st James park newcastle 

2nd test arsenal or spurs London depending on availability 

3rd test Etihad Manchester or Anfield Liverpool 

[Tosh]

7 hours ago, Colin James said:

The legacy of this World Cup is in the women's and wheelchair games.

 

Sure but I was thinking more about the pacific region specifically.

[Tosh]

7 hours ago, Man of Kent said:

I’m hopeful this time around because the current ARLC have often spoken about the growth potential of the international game. The AFL doesn’t have what we have etc.

Honest question here but do you not think that the ARL fear the PI nations getting even stronger in terms of players born in Australia of PI heritage choosing to represent over Australia?

[Tosh]

The NRL along with the governments of both NZ and Australia need to fund a RL academy in Samoa.

In fact I’d open similar ones in Fiji, Tonga, New Caledonian, Vanuatu and the Solomon Islands etc with the pitch to both NZ and Australian governments being stopping the rise of Chinese influence in the region through sport.

[Tosh]

7 hours ago, The British Lion said:

I hope this does happen. All credit to Samoa, Tonga previously, and PNG who beat us (GB / England) pe-pandemic. They SHOULD have a regular Pacific cup tournament scheduled bi-annually perhaps - but, Ive yet to se RL capitalize on a World Cup after its completed, sadly.

Everything has to be catered around state of origin unfortunately.

Thats how dumb our sport is.

[Big Picture]

As @Man of Kentsays there's no money in any of that.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: those tiny, poor countries bring nothing of consequence to the sport and that's the way it is.

[Anita Bath]

1 hour ago, Tosh said:

Everything has to be catered around state of origin unfortunately.

Thats how dumb our sport is.

dumb?  Thats what generates the big bucks…not mid season exhibition games against ‘exiles’.

[MatthewWoody]

1 hour ago, Tosh said:

Everything has to be catered around state of origin unfortunately.

Thats how dumb our sport is.

Or how Origin is strong. 

[Tosh]

44 minutes ago, Anita Bath said:

dumb?  Thats what generates the big bucks…not mid season exhibition games against ‘exiles’.

You don’t think a tournament between Australia, NZ, Tonga and Samoa could generate “big bucks”?

[Tosh]

41 minutes ago, MatthewWoody said:

Or how Origin is strong. 

Too strong.

origin is a behemoth holding back the game.

[Eddie]

10 hours ago, Tosh said:

Win or lose what could the potential legacy of a Samoa appearance in the final of the RLWC21 be for the pacific?

Obviously the ridiculous calls for a combined “pacific” team based in New Zealand entering the NRL as the 18th team will only grow.

Personally I’d like to see the “PacifiqueXIII” team idea renewed and possibly a similar combined Samoa&Tonga team playing in either the NSW cup or Queensland cup.

Why are calls for them to combine and go into the NRL ridiculous, yet you’d like to see them in the Q Cup? I’d like to see League wipe Union off the map in Samoa as a result of this, that would be a great legacy.