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Time for a third Welsh Team?


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31 replies to this topic

#1 Mumby Magic

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 09:17 AM

With Crusaders acheiving good crowds for a first season in virgin territory and South Wales Scorpions in a league position higher than expected supported by bigger crowds than so called "traditional " clubs isn't it a good time to implement a third Welsh club within our ranks? With Thomas looking to be the first of many Welsh RU players ready to step over the great divide and the Welsh RU not in the grand position it once was i feel we should strike whilst the iron is hot.

Some of the doom-mongers will point towards Crusaders last two attendances but there average this season will be better than Salfords and Harlequins at least.

Others will state that it's not easy to set up a Club from scratch.

1) Do they have to? Are the seeds not in place at a NRC club to make the step up? (Weren't Crusaders grown from the seeds of Bridgend?

2) South Wales Scorpions have managed it haven't they?

The game in Wales needs to be hit head on with great momentum else we'll be left with yet another era of half hearted efforts.

Viva Wales
cool.gif

Lilly, Jacob and Isaac, what my life is about. Although our route through life is not how it should be, I am a blessed man.


#2 RP London

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 09:29 AM

wasnt there talk of 2 before the scorpions started up.. was just a timing to get them both up and running pre the season starting.. so they concentrated on one.. or am i way off here and it was just a board rumour?

#3 Lobbygobbler

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 09:38 AM

Two areas which spring to mind with no fully pro RU:

- Bridgend/Pontypridd
- Merthyr and the Valleys

A third team would be superb and would help reduce costs

hopefully we can move to a regionalised third tier

#4 shrek

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 09:42 AM

I see the merits of three teams but will be happy if there are still two in existence come the start of next year.

How much of the TV money were Crusaders advanced? They touched on it during Sundays Rugby coverage on GMR, saying they had had an advance payment but I didn't hear them going into detail.

#5 bowes

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 11:13 AM

QUOTE (RP London @ Aug 3 2010, 10:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
wasnt there talk of 2 before the scorpions started up.. was just a timing to get them both up and running pre the season starting.. so they concentrated on one.. or am i way off here and it was just a board rumour?

There were 2 proposals yes, but I don't think there was ever the player base for 2 sides, so more a case of either or. The other proposal were to be Bridgend based. Blackwood Bulldogs considered it at one point but they can't even fulfil their fixtures as it is

#6 bowes

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 11:16 AM

QUOTE (Mumby Magic @ Aug 3 2010, 10:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
1) Do they have to? Are the seeds not in place at a NRC club to make the step up? (Weren't Crusaders grown from the seeds of Bridgend?

You mean Rugby League Conference?

No, most of the games are now getting called off presumably because some players would rather go to RU pre-season 6-8 weeks before the season starts than play rugby league. Maybe between all the clubs you could get something but I'd rather start off with a Scorpions reserve team before we look at another pro side

#7 a.n Other

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 11:17 AM

QUOTE (Mumby Magic @ Aug 3 2010, 10:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
With Crusaders acheiving good crowds for a first season in virgin territory and South Wales Scorpions in a league position higher than expected supported by bigger crowds than so called "traditional " clubs isn't it a good time to implement a third Welsh club within our ranks? With Thomas looking to be the first of many Welsh RU players ready to step over the great divide and the Welsh RU not in the grand position it once was i feel we should strike whilst the iron is hot.

Some of the doom-mongers will point towards Crusaders last two attendances but there average this season will be better than Salfords and Harlequins at least.

Others will state that it's not easy to set up a Club from scratch.

1) Do they have to? Are the seeds not in place at a NRC club to make the step up? (Weren't Crusaders grown from the seeds of Bridgend?

2) South Wales Scorpions have managed it haven't they?

The game in Wales needs to be hit head on with great momentum else we'll be left with yet another era of half hearted efforts.

Viva Wales
cool.gif


Think its a great idea, who's paying for it?


#8 Matt J

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 11:54 AM

give it another 2 years...

Cummins Out.


#9 Trojan

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 12:57 PM

They could play at Newtown
http://maps.google.c...ved=0CB8Q8gEwAA
Then we wouldn't need to wonder why their crowds were cr4p - we'd know.
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#10 skep155

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 03:15 PM

QUOTE (Trojan @ Aug 3 2010, 01:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
They could play at Newtown
http://maps.google.c...ved=0CB8Q8gEwAA
Then we wouldn't need to wonder why their crowds were cr4p - we'd know.


The crowds of Celtic Crusaders and South Wales Scorpions both hold up favourably compared to many heartlands Championship clubs. A few more succesful Welsh sides at Championship level could strengthen the leagues considerably.

I believe there have been proposals for a team in Bridgend and Carmarthenshire. Three sides in the Championship leagues averaging 700+ and hopefully one in Superleague averaging 5,000 plus should get us decentish coverage in Wales, even if its just articles in local newspapers a lot more people will be aware that RL is active down there.





#11 indomitable

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 04:01 PM

Sadly crowd figures are not very good, certainly at Wrexham, if the results they have reached this season had been in S Wales then the crowds would have been doubled. Un fortunately around Bridgend there is a feeling of being let down following the move to N Wales, and I regularly meet former loyal supporters who now don't go to RL games.

#12 Mumby Magic

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 04:34 PM

QUOTE (indomitable @ Aug 3 2010, 05:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Sadly crowd figures are not very good, certainly at Wrexham, if the results they have reached this season had been in S Wales then the crowds would have been doubled. Un fortunately around Bridgend there is a feeling of being let down following the move to N Wales, and I regularly meet former loyal supporters who now don't go to RL games.



Based on??? O yes the no previous seasons there! huh.gif

The latter part of yourpost is one of the reasons why we should try our best to strike before the bridges are well and truly burnt down.

Lilly, Jacob and Isaac, what my life is about. Although our route through life is not how it should be, I am a blessed man.


#13 Mumby Magic

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 04:37 PM

QUOTE (a.n Other @ Aug 3 2010, 12:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Think its a great idea, who's paying for it?

Hoenst question who, if anyone is paying for South Wales Scorpions. How have they done it. Crusaders are now competeing in SL and hasn't there backer been long gone?

Lilly, Jacob and Isaac, what my life is about. Although our route through life is not how it should be, I am a blessed man.


#14 a.n Other

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 04:44 PM

QUOTE (Mumby Magic @ Aug 3 2010, 05:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hoenst question who, if anyone is paying for South Wales Scorpions. How have they done it. Crusaders are now competeing in SL and hasn't there backer been long gone?



I have no idea - but someone will be.

#15 bowes

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 05:16 PM

QUOTE (skep155 @ Aug 3 2010, 04:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The crowds of Celtic Crusaders and South Wales Scorpions both hold up favourably compared to many heartlands Championship clubs. A few more succesful Welsh sides at Championship level could strengthen the leagues considerably.

I believe there have been proposals for a team in Bridgend and Carmarthenshire. Three sides in the Championship leagues averaging 700+ and hopefully one in Superleague averaging 5,000 plus should get us decentish coverage in Wales, even if its just articles in local newspapers a lot more people will be aware that RL is active down there.

The Carmarthenshire proposal is a suggestion for CPC Bears who are one of the weaker Premier Division sides, and the theory was based on them having 4 feeder sides this year. All 4 turned out to be fictitious, but they managed to get something by effectively a forced merger of all 4 sides. Don't think they'll get anywhere, maybe we could get 2 good proper amateur clubs in Wales feeding into the Scorpions (one to be Bridgend or Pontypridd based, the other could be somewhere Monmouthshire/Gwent I guess) playing in a better competition, with the Welsh Conference below that as a way of introducing RU players into the game

#16 bowes

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 05:17 PM

QUOTE (Mumby Magic @ Aug 3 2010, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Based on??? O yes the no previous seasons there! huh.gif

You do realise that first seasons in a new location are almost certainly better crowd wise than a second season? Plus lack of history won't pay the bills.

I hope Crusaders survive in Wrexham, but I'm not as sure they will as I was a couple of months ago

Edited by bowes, 03 August 2010 - 05:18 PM.


#17 Mumby Magic

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 07:09 PM

QUOTE (bowes @ Aug 3 2010, 06:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You do realise that first seasons in a new location are almost certainly better crowd wise than a second season? Plus lack of history won't pay the bills.


I do but that's not always the case. In addition the crowds could have been alot worse.

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#18 Cardiff Cymru

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 07:21 PM

QUOTE (Mumby Magic @ Aug 3 2010, 05:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hoenst question who, if anyone is paying for South Wales Scorpions. How have they done it. Crusaders are now competeing in SL and hasn't there backer been long gone?


Scorpions are financed by Phil Davies, a local businessman, who also is on the board of Port Talbot FC. However the club isn't far off being self-financing.
About time I updated this.

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#19 Cardiff Cymru

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 07:28 PM

QUOTE (indomitable @ Aug 3 2010, 05:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Sadly crowd figures are not very good, certainly at Wrexham, if the results they have reached this season had been in S Wales then the crowds would have been doubled. Un fortunately around Bridgend there is a feeling of being let down following the move to N Wales, and I regularly meet former loyal supporters who now don't go to RL games.


Which is a shame but the good thing is that a lot from Bridgend are still going to Crusaders, Scorpions or both. Some may feel let down but those are the people who didn't see the bigger picture - the crowds weren't coming to Bridgend and the club was suffering. The move to Wrexham not only saved the club but opened up a gap for a new one which has done a lot in the space of a few months in developing new Welsh born players. The academy sides are still being run from South Wales and they are producing improving talent every week as proved by the win at Hull FC by the under 18s this week. There was an under 16 side again and under 15 for the first time. The scholarship sides are still running too.

By not going to watch rugby league any more, especially Wales, they are the ones who are missing out. New fans have been recruited in both north and south Wales and hopefully the old ones, the real loyal ones, will eventually come back, maybe for Wales internationals in October.
About time I updated this.

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#20 Methven Hornet

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 07:32 PM

QUOTE (Cardiff Cymru @ Aug 3 2010, 08:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Scorpions are financed by Phil Davies, a local businessman, who also is on the board of Port Talbot FC. However the club isn't far off being self-financing.

Could that be repeated elsewhere in (south) Wales, in your opinion? Creating sustainable C1 sides is a bit like the search for the holy grail, and could lead to widespread expansion throughout Britain.
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