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Essai Machine

Holbrook's Saints - Ferrari or Vauxhall Astra ?

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1 hour ago, Essai Machine said:

So why didn't they win on Saturday ?

The original point made in this point was that Saints AREN'T the best team in Super league despite their league position , and this is backed-up by their failing to win the last 2 Challenge Cups or the last (and next ) Grand Final .

Which super league team are better than them then? You keep avoiding the very simple question. 

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2 hours ago, Bod said:

So a team winning it from fifth place miles behind on points deserve to be Champions? Not only does it weaken the sport it skews the sports history books.

The sports history shows the title of champions has been decided by a play off final a lot more than the team sitting top of the league at the end of the regular season.

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17 minutes ago, Eddie said:

Which super league team are better than them then? You keep avoiding the very simple question. 

The one that wins at Old Trafford in October,now can you 2 get a room.

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1 minute ago, Davo5 said:

The one that wins at Old Trafford in October,now can you 2 get a room.

So if a team wins every league game and then loses the GF to a team that scrape into 5th place you think the winners are the better team over that season? I give up. 

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I am going to say something really controversial now...

The team that finishes top of the league have proved themselves to be the best and most consistent over the course of the season.

and.

The team that that wins the Grand Final are the champions.

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16 minutes ago, Eddie said:

So if a team wins every league game and then loses the GF to a team that scrape into 5th place you think the winners are the better team over that season? I give up. 

Agreed. In effect we play an end of season top five Knock out competition which could result in a team not worthy of the title of Champions. How can anyone not see it as anything but a stupid way to decide Champions.

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4 minutes ago, Bod said:

Agreed. In effect we play an end of season top five Knock out competition which could result in a team not worthy of the title of Champions. How can anyone not see it as anything but a stupid way to decide Champions.

Because people have different opinions, these are allowed.

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36 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

Because people have different opinions, these are allowed.

If it’s a sensible way of doing it why don’t they do it in the Premier League, La Liga, Bundesliga etc?

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57 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I am going to say something really controversial now...

The team that finishes top of the league have proved themselves to be the best and most consistent over the course of the season.

and.

The team that that wins the Grand Final are the champions.

That is true, but using that way the champions aren’t necessarily the best team, any more than the cup winners are. 

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1 hour ago, Dunbar said:

I am going to say something really controversial now...

The team that finishes top of the league have proved themselves to be the best and most consistent over the course of the season.

and.

The team that that wins the Grand Final are the champions.

That is exactly right. 

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21 minutes ago, Eddie said:

That is true, but using that way the champions aren’t necessarily the best team, any more than the cup winners are. 

I'm ok with that.

If a team finishes top after the regular season they are rewarded with the most favourable route to the Grand Final. If they win the Grand final then they have shown to be capable of consistency and also being able to raise to the pressure of a big game.

If a team finishes 2nd or 3rd and wins the Grand Final it means they have benefited from being good all season and then proving themselves to be the best come the big games.

If a team wins from 4th or 5th then they have won four consecutive high pressure sudden death games at the end of the year.

This system rewards consistency and the ability to perform in crunch games.

You may disagree... and here is the key bit... that's ok.

Edited by Dunbar

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11 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I'm ok with that.

If a team finishes top after the regular season they are rewarded with the most favourable route to the Grand Final. If they win the Grand final then they have shown to be capable of consistency and also being able to raise to the pressure of a big game.

If a team finishes 2nd or 3rd and wins the Grand Final it means they have benefited from being good all season and then proving themselves to be the best come the big games.

If a team wins from 4th or 5th then they have won three consecutive high pressure sudden death games at the end of the year.

This system rewards consistency and the ability to perform in crunch games.

You may disagree... and here is the key bit... that's ok.

Trouble is the loop fixtures have further enhanced a flawed system. How many times could Saints end up playing Wire this season compared to others.

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1 hour ago, Eddie said:

So if a team wins every league game and then loses the GF to a team that scrape into 5th place you think the winners are the better team over that season? I give up. 

Please do

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1 hour ago, Bod said:

Agreed. In effect we play an end of season top five Knock out competition which could result in a team not worthy of the title of Champions. How can anyone not see it as anything but a stupid way to decide Champions.

It seems only panic stricken Saints fans find the present 20 yr old system stupid,I can’t think why !!

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1 hour ago, Davo5 said:

It seems only panic stricken Saints fans find the present 20 yr old system stupid,I can’t think why !!

That’s not true. It’s been a regular discussion on this board for nearly 20yrs across the fan spectrum. 

I personally love the play offs.

Edited by GeordieSaint
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Saints they are a brand new Ferrari, they look good and can be exciting at times, but when it comes the business end of doing the big shop, picking the kids up from school, going on holiday etc it fails.

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5 hours ago, Bod said:

Trouble is the loop fixtures have further enhanced a flawed system. How many times could Saints end up playing Wire this season compared to others.

Wigan and Warrington have, so far this season, faced each other four times: home and away in league, Magic weekend and Challenge Cup. A fifth (maybe sixth) clash through the play-offs is possible.

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11 hours ago, Eddie said:

Which super league team are better than them then? You keep avoiding the very simple question. 

Warrington and whomever wins the Grand Final .

Now come back with another question irrelevant to my original post , since you can't win this argument .

 

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9 hours ago, Eddie said:

That is true, but using that way the champions aren’t necessarily the best team, any more than the cup winners are. 

 

Saints bottled it last year , losing in the semi-final of the CC and in the semis of the GF .

This year they bottled it in the CC Final .

Pray , why does the 'best team' in the Super league fail to win anything of value , if they are the best team ???

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10 hours ago, Bod said:

Agreed. In effect we play an end of season top five Knock out competition which could result in a team not worthy of the title of Champions. How can anyone not see it as anything but a stupid way to decide Champions.

If a team reaches the GF and wins it they are the champions . That's what everyone agreed at the start of the season .That makes them the best team of 2019 .

The team that fails to win its play-off games clearly isn't the best team - since the best team would not be defeated . Do you see ?

 

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