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Toronto Academy/Reserves

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16 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

Melbourne always crop up in these debates but people forget that countless players have made their first grade debuts at the Storm.

OK, there may not have been many Victorians but Melbourne does produce NRL players through their various systems.  

Ask yourself why they do this. 

Toronto needs to find a way to produce their own players sooner rather than later.

Doesn’t have to be Canadians and I suppose that’s what the Skolars (non)investment was about. It’s a shame that didn’t materialise.

Ok so if Toronto give English players their first grade debuts you will be happy ?

😀

To be honest I find your stuff amusing.  I don't think you believe all of it either and deep down you like the pack just a bit

Edited by aj1908

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I think if the wolfpack came out with a cure for cancer today some people.would still.be complaining.about them 

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2 minutes ago, aj1908 said:

Ok so if Toronto give English players their first grade debuts you will be happy ?

😀

To be honest I find your stuff amusing.  I don't think you believe all of it either and deep down you like the pack just a bit

Yes, I believe players making their professional debuts at Toronto would be a success wherever they are from. 

Even though part of me thinks the whole thing is a bit bonkers, I do actually want Toronto to succeed. 

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7 minutes ago, NOS4A2 said:

I don't think it's the fact that they exist that rankles many, more that they have had an easy ride of it to date (the expense was their choice) with permission to play a top tier team in L1 and then 2 Years in the championship, but now they've arrived, then they should play by exactly the same rules as everyone else.

They have 2 Marquee signings costing them 300k, and another 21 players who it would seem are on a collective 2 million. That's bad management/Planning and the fact is that any players they approach are going to want top coin, so where does it end?

Just because Argyle can afford it, doesn't mean it's right. Say we let him BUY a SL title. Do you really think they'll be the catalyst for RL in North America? London made the CC Final then crowds bombed. Catalans won the CC, but still the game struggles in France. Melbourne won titles (kinda) but it was only when they changed tactics did they really see crowds and revenues grow and as you say, 500 mil and counting. 

I'd love TWP to win the lot, but I don't for one second think they are either the solution to the games problems in the NH and neither do I see them boosting the games participation numbers in NA

Ok I'll pass on your concerns to David argyle and tell him to walk away from the club.

Even though they get the highest club rugby crowds in Canada and America 

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3 hours ago, Davo5 said:

How is Leigh’s academy looking ?

Not bad.. And the community club feed to SL academies still on going.

Hows  your academy doing!

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2 hours ago, SL17 said:

They support the so called academies via the community game. It’s 100 years of development.

They got rid of their academy& their reserves after they bottled their first attempt at promotion and used the money to sign a load of journeymen,maybe that’s why there is so much anti Toronto rubbish spewed out by you all on here,the Canadians are using your model and doing it better.

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4 minutes ago, Davo5 said:

They got rid of their academy& their reserves after they bottled their first attempt at promotion and used the money to sign a load of journeymen,maybe that’s why there is so much anti Toronto rubbish spewed out by you all on here,the Canadians are using your model and doing it better.

 Crikey an anti leyther. 
Breath son keep breathing..

You follow me round this site like a magnet. 
 

If you want my autograph just pm me padawan.

 

Edited by SL17

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2 minutes ago, NOS4A2 said:

I don't for one second think that Mr Argyle gives a toss about the concerns I raised, being that they won't raise the participation numbers in North America, nor that they will solve the problems faced by the game in the Northern Hemisphere, which include stopping the slide in participation, ensuring that we become less reliant on TV money, the need to assist French RL before if slips into obscure disarray AGAIN.

He only cares for his own team, playing in his colours out of the city he calls home. If a few folk pay to get in fine, but if not, he's not bothered. He's paying SBW £72K per game out of his own pocket and will probably spend twice that again to win a trophy.

Their Crowds, no matter how they are attained, freebies, freebies or even more freebies tagged to a beer festival, are to be applauded and they will certainly make SL watchers feel all warm and fuzzy when their 9k average replaces London's 2k, inflating the overall attendance number by as much as 5%., but in terms of income for SL they will deliver little.

They asked to come in and we let them, but now they remind me of an unknown guest ( a friend of a friend) who attends a group dinner party. Once in, they ctiticise the decor, adjust the seating arrangements, bemoan the standard of the wine on offer, ask for something  to eat other than that which your host has prepared and which the other guest are happy to enjoy and the starts to loudly blow ones own trumpet drowning out the other guests conversation.

He knows more about RL in Canada, France and the UK..

Yet lives in OZ..😂😂

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17 minutes ago, SL17 said:

 Crikey an anti leyther. 
Breath son keep breathing..

You follow me round this site like a magnet. 
 

If you want my autograph just pm me padawan.

 

Nah you just haunt every TWP thread I happen to read and it is entertaining to read your bitter diatrades.

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6 hours ago, aj1908 said:

theres a thread on league unlimited asking when melbourne will produce their first nrl player.

and theyve had over 500 million into them.

anybody with half a brain would realize it way to early to be asking these questions of toronto.

The problem is that you are assuming that everyone on here has at least half a brain... 😄😄

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9 hours ago, NOS4A2 said:

Indeed you are K-man.

Other expansion sides have been cut slack in the past. Catalans were safe from the drop for all but one year between 2005 and 2014, London Broncos fielded extra foreign trained players up to 2006 (IIRC) and then had the RFL pay their new Landlord £100,000 in 2014 to spend on marketing (and to ensure the fixtures were met). Celtic Crusaders were also cut slack in various departments, so it is only right that the RFL should give you the same help......except that is that they can't. 


After 20 years of RFL management and mis-managent of SL, the chairmen/owners of the club decided to wrest control to themselves and it would appear that this lot "don't do noting for nobody for nothing", so you might have to cough up some more of Argyles readies if you want any favours doing.

Of course it is ridiculous to expect an infant club such as yours to run juniors, academies and reserves, in the same way it is insane to expect North American players...except that was what was promised by Perez and as my namesake was famed for once saying

“Remember my friend, that knowledge is stronger than memory, and we should not trust the weaker”

 but alas, this is Rugby League and the memories are strong here, no matter how logical and knowledgeable the other side of the debate.

I will say that with a little bit of forward thinking, a Reserve grade side could have been assembled quite cheaply and based full time in England, but I can see that Argyle feels that if he has to have a reserve grade then he should also get the SKY cash, even though he'd only be able to spend it on other things, as he's already at the cap.

Many on here certainly did not cut Catalans slack. Until a few years later then claimed that they had always said they would be a success, as they are from a rugby league area. I quoted their own quotes back at them, but they they insisted reality was wrong.

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"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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8 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

Many on here certainly did not cut Catalans slack. Until a few years later then claimed that they had always said they would be a success, as they are from a rugby league area. I quoted their own quotes back at them, but they they insisted reality was wrong.

Yes I remember that 

They hated the idea of les Catalans and said it would fail 

Five years later when it didn't they said oh it's a rugby league heartland of course it would work 

Catalans have been one of the few success super league has had.  One would say stunning even 

I'm hoping the wolfpack will be the next one 

And then Toulose 

That would set up super league very very.nicely going forward 

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4 minutes ago, aj1908 said:

Yes I remember that 

They hated the idea of les Catalans and said it would fail 

Five years later when it didn't they said oh it's a rugby league heartland of course it would work 

Catalans have been one of the few success super league has had.  One would say stunning even 

I'm hoping the wolfpack will be the next one 

And then Toulose 

That would set up super league very very.nicely going forward 

Indeed. TWP would be a more improbable success, but it would be great for the sport.


"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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3 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

Indeed. TWP would be a more improbable success, but it would be great for the sport.

It's weird how argyle.has made a success of.toronto and branson couldn't with London 

If toronto fail.it won't be for lack of money that's for sure.

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6 hours ago, NOS4A2 said:

I don't for one second think that Mr Argyle gives a toss about the concerns I raised, being that they won't raise the participation numbers in North America, nor that they will solve the problems faced by the game in the Northern Hemisphere, which include stopping the slide in participation, ensuring that we become less reliant on TV money, the need to assist French RL before if slips into obscure disarray AGAIN.

He only cares for his own team, playing in his colours out of the city he calls home. If a few folk pay to get in fine, but if not, he's not bothered. He's paying SBW £72K per game out of his own pocket and will probably spend twice that again to win a trophy.

Their Crowds, no matter how they are attained, freebies, freebies or even more freebies tagged to a beer festival, are to be applauded and they will certainly make SL watchers feel all warm and fuzzy when their 9k average replaces London's 2k, inflating the overall attendance number by as much as 5%., but in terms of income for SL they will deliver little.

They asked to come in and we let them, but now they remind me of an unknown guest ( a friend of a friend) who attends a group dinner party. Once in, they ctiticise the decor, adjust the seating arrangements, bemoan the standard of the wine on offer, ask for something  to eat other than that which your host has prepared and which the other guest are happy to enjoy and the starts to loudly blow ones own trumpet drowning out the other guests conversation.

That’s another thing I don’t understand They spent so much on SBW imagine if they spent that on junior development and growing the game.

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3 hours ago, aj1908 said:

It's weird how argyle.has made a success of.toronto and branson couldn't with London 

If toronto fail.it won't be for lack of money that's for sure.

I think there are a few key differences.

THe Broncos approach was built it and they will come, which was rather different. The Broncos also did have a few years of decent crowds.

But, the Broncos were always a sideline there was not the same personal involvement to make it work. Also, rugby league was not a fresh new sport to the already crowded London sports market. It Toronto have to move around Ontario is search of a ground, I suspect they would also find it much harder.

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"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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Its seems a little backward that Toronto, who dont have any amateur game to work with are criticised for not contributing to youth development but the existence if an amateur game is the reason Leigh centurions dont have to bother contributing to youth development.

Like the existence of amateur clubs in an area and the efforts of those who keep them running somehow protects lazy professional clubs near by, yet expansion clubs should be expected to create an entire amateur game, and a youth development system to sit on top of that with 3 years is such an incredibly ridiculous standpoint that I cant believe anyone could make it in good faith.

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1 hour ago, Themusician_2 said:

That’s another thing I don’t understand They spent so much on SBW imagine if they spent that on junior development and growing the game.

Why just Toronto,why not several other clubs who have only made a token effort of youth development over the years or in some cases haven't even bothered.

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12 hours ago, GUBRATS said:

And there we have it , as I said , you ignore the point being made , the school and community clubs in Leigh have produced and continue to produce professional and indeed international players , how many Canadian professional RL players are there ? 

You have a choice , if you don't understand the point I made , say so , and I will explain again , if you don't want to understand it , then fine just say so and we can ignore you 

So the hard work of clubs like Leigh Miners/Easts gives your club an excuse not to bother,very good.

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1 hour ago, Themusician_2 said:

That’s another thing I don’t understand They spent so much on SBW imagine if they spent that on junior development and growing the game.

Because there's a marquee player allowance and they can?

And Developing juniors doesn't help them.not getting relegated ?

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3 hours ago, Davo5 said:

Why just Toronto,why not several other clubs who have only made a token effort of youth development over the years or in some cases haven't even bothered.

Do as I say, not as I do.

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Several people missing the point. This isn't about what Toronto should contribute vs what traditional clubs contribute, it's about how they can enhance their own operation through youth development.

I assume every sane person believes bringing through players is a good thing and I think Toronto are in a unique position to develop very good youth set-up on both sides of the Atlantic. It would be interesting to hear if they have any plans in this regard.

They could certainly have a short term aim of teams in the UK system bringing through UK based players and a longer term Canadian/North American plan running concurrently. 

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