The General 'Toronto Wolfpack' Discussion Thread

[TheReaper]

12 minutes ago, Agbrigg said:

Tell me this, do Toronto have a season ticket system like all other clubs. If they do I suspect that around 80% of their fans will get into the games on that ticket which is the average rate of clubs.

I doubt it's that high. No proof but I don't get the idea that STH make up that much of total sales for most teams here. I know the Ticats cap theirs at around 70%, I think 17,000 out of 24,000. Anyway, doesn't matter because as someone else pointed out, they are refunding season tickets since they never hosted any games - so they have a liability equal to that amount of cash. Some will roll it over but they can't count om that, especially until their new situation is settled. And every ticket rolled over is a loss of a new sale next year.

12 minutes ago, Agbrigg said:

If true then season tickets are bought before the season starts so by the time corvid kicked in they will have had the benefit of season ticket sales. 

So where has the season ticket money gone if true.

On paying wages - with no home games they would always have gone way down in the hole by paying the costs of playing away, before making it back with the back-loaded home games.

12 minutes ago, Agbrigg said:

Then dont forget i said net profit because this is what they will have lost. Take off season ticket money, stadium rental. Match day expenses, stewards etc. No way will you get anywhere near 3 million. 

-don't take off STH money - see above

- stadium rental is actually tiny. Anybody can rent Lamport, it't not exhorbiant.

- obviously there would be costs out of that. The point it's within the realm of possibility, not "give over there's no way"

We haven't even touched on VIP and sponsorship income. 

[Dave T]

29 minutes ago, Les Tonks Sidestep said:

It would seem that all hasn't been rosy for a while though

Tony Smith: 

“What I found astonishing really is that with some of the things that have gone on at Toronto, for the last couple of years really, there hasn’t been much in the press on the negative.

“There’s been late payments to players for some time and on a number of occasions. When it was Bradford Bulls having their issues it was in the media daily.

“I’m not sure how they’ve gone under the radar for so long with some of the issues that have been going on.

“Maybe we were all hopeful it would be a success and all got caught up into thinking let’s overlook some of the misdemeanours and let’s look at how positive it is for the game."

I'm not sure Smith is right though. These things have been discussed publicly, including in the media for years. 

[RobertAM]

4 minutes ago, Agbrigg said:

Well the tin pot club I support have also had to tell season ticket holders they can get a refund if they wish. Only 33 wanted their money back the other 2500/3000 have written it off to help out the club. Dedication or stupidity cal l it what you will. I wonder if you know what percentage of Wolfpack fans have decided to roll over their tickets. 

I and my mates have already told them we'd roll over..as long as there's a sniff of us resuming I'm in. RL the game is to good to give up on even if the running of it makes the Trump administration look competent 

[Scubby]

3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I'm not sure Smith is right though. These things have been discussed publicly, including in the media for years. 

SL clubs have furloughed players. When they realised Toronto couldn't get any protection then support should have been offered. That's what a sport pulling together does?

[Dave T]

So the majority of the pro game will not play out the year. Hopefully that puts the TWP decision in context. 

No Championship. 

No league one. 

No ashes series. 

This year is survival and put on a show for our TV partners and viewers to keep the show on the road, everyone else does what they need to survive and we start again next year. 

[Dave T]

Just now, Scubby said:

SL clubs have furloughed players. When they realised Toronto couldn't get any protection then support should have been offered. That's what a sport pulling together does?

With what? 

And the obvious question is why couldn't TWP get any government support? 

[Damien]

2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

With what? 

And the obvious question is why couldn't TWP get any government support? 

Do you mean from the Canadian Government?

[Dave T]

Just now, Damien said:

Do you mean from the Canadian Government?

That sort of goes into the answer yeah. 

They can't get Canadian support because.... 

They can't get UK support because....

[Scubby]

5 minutes ago, Dave T said:

With what? 

And the obvious question is why couldn't TWP get any government support? 

Have the government in Canada been giving sports clubs handouts? Are they even on Canadian payroll?

[Damien]

1 minute ago, Scubby said:

Have the government in Canada been giving sports clubs handouts? Are they even on Canadian payroll?

That was what I was getting at. I know the UK's furlough is one of the most generous in the World, I'm not sure the Canadian situation.

[Hela Wigmen]

No promotion from the Championship annoys me. I can’t see Toronto being around in any shape next year and I don’t think they can get away with what’s happened without being demoted. This now puts Magic at risk next year and leaves the competition even more lopsided. 

[RobertAM]

1 minute ago, Damien said:

That was what I was getting at. I know the UK's furlough is one of the most generous in the World, I'm not sure the Canadian situation.

There isn't any money for sports teams..as of yet..Toronto Blue Jays told they can't play in Toronto.. CFL football is on hiatus - no money

UK is in good shape compared to our home teams

[Scubby]

Well one thing to come out of this is Josh McCrone is now up for grabs 

[Kayakman]

2 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said:

No promotion from the Championship annoys me. I can’t see Toronto being around in any shape next year and I don’t think they can get away with what’s happened without being demoted. This now puts Magic at risk next year and leaves the competition even more lopsided. 

No...Toronto should be given a full membership and a fair portion of the Sky money...SL can't afford to lose Toronto and all it has to offer in the future.

Don't panic.

[fcl]

Its a chance to build a real expansion with à second french club ! 
 

[Chris22]

Really not sure what to think about this. Obviously, it is devastating for the club, staff, players, league and sport. The practical and reputational difficulties this causes are huge. To have a side withdraw from the league with two weeks notice before the season resumes is as much of a nightmare as it gets.

My biggest worry, selfishly, is the impact on the Sky deal and whether we can fulfil its obligations. If not, the impact could be devastating. Equally, given the perilous position of the sport, Sky also can't afford to push us too far, or they will lose out too.

Trying to cling to a positive, this provides an opportunity to reset. Since 2017, we have learned that a minimum of 6,000 are willing to watch a sport that they have never heard of in North America. We are not big enough as a sport to let them go. The question is what now. In a coronavirus or post-virus age, is a transatlantic league possible. With New York, Ottawa and Toronto, do we have the basis forming of a small North American league?

This expansion project has had one thing different. Huge fan buy in. They got more fans through the turnstiles than any lower league club and several Super League clubs despite the absence of any roots.

We can't give up now. Horrible day today, but RLWC 2021 schedule released tomorrow. This year is just about getting through. If by 2021 no club has gone to the wall, I will be ecstatic. Let's aim for that and rebuild as a sport.

For those snearing and laughing, just remember. All of our clubs are either reliant on one backer or one misfortune away from financial ruin. We are not rich enough to lose a club. And we are a sport where any club is vulnerable. Including yours.

[RobertAM]

11 minutes ago, Damien said:

That was what I was getting at. I know the UK's furlough is one of the most generous in the World, I'm not sure the Canadian situation.

https://www.inthehammer.com/ontario-sport-minister-says-no-cfl-specific-financial-aid-on-table

[Hela Wigmen]

3 minutes ago, Kayakman said:

No...Toronto should be given a full membership and a fair portion of the Sky money...SL can't afford to lose Toronto and all it has to offer in the future.

Don't panic.

Toronto should be given full membership and a portion of the Sky money - No, they should have four years ago. Now, they should be on a probationary licence, forced to show their books monthly to The RFL and asked for solid proof that they have the cash in the bank to complete 3-5 seasons.

Super League can’t afford to lose Toronto and all it has to offer in the future - We’ve already lost them and what do they have to offer? Disillusioned, disgruntled and annoyed players on a salary cap exemption for everyone else? 

[leytherz]

there has just been a meeting in leigh town hall where leigh n fev are going to declare war on the moose bangers of toronto for stopping our rugby till next season.(canadian pub team).and a quick message to the rfl and super league.kiss my sexy leyther ###### you set of cowardly sausages

[Dave T]

21 minutes ago, Scubby said:

Have the government in Canada been giving sports clubs handouts? Are they even on Canadian payroll?

 

18 minutes ago, Damien said:

That was what I was getting at. I know the UK's furlough is one of the most generous in the World, I'm not sure the Canadian situation.

This was the point I was making. Canada does have a furlough scheme like the UK (don't know the details, have seen 75%), but if they fall inbetween the UK and Canada and miss all support then that needs a rethink moving forward. 

[Kayakman]

7 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said:

Toronto should be given full membership and a portion of the Sky money - No, they should have four years ago. Now, they should be on a probationary licence, forced to show their books monthly to The RFL and asked for solid proof that they have the cash in the bank to complete 3-5 seasons.

Super League can’t afford to lose Toronto and all it has to offer in the future - We’ve already lost them and what do they have to offer? Disillusioned, disgruntled and annoyed players on a salary cap exemption for everyone else? 

Thats right this all could have been avoided with a bit of goodwilll...its still not too late.

[Tommygilf]

 

[Dave T]

20 minutes ago, RobertAM said:

There isn't any money for sports teams..as of yet..Toronto Blue Jays told they can't play in Toronto.. CFL football is on hiatus - no money

UK is in good shape compared to our home teams

What about furlough schemes, can sports clubs use this for employees? 

I assume they can tap into other business support, there just isn't specific sport team support? 

[Scubby]

7 minutes ago, leytherz said:

there has just been a meeting in leigh town hall where leigh n fev are going to declare war on the moose bangers of toronto for stopping our rugby till next season.(canadian pub team).and a quick message to the rfl and super league.kiss my sexy leyther ###### you set of cowardly sausages

Neither of these clubs are top of the championship. Toulouse were currently top.

[Damien]

2 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

 

That's the most positive contribution I've seen from McCrone since he's been at Toronto!