Fri 3rd May: SL: Leeds Rhinos v London Broncos KO 20:00 (Sky/SuperLeague+)

[John Drake]

Please stick to discussing the match in question and do not accuse match officials of being biased or corrupt or you run the risk of being immediately banned from the forum.

[M j M]

Leeds should win comfortably.

I'm away for this one and am sort of glad I am given the hostile environment towards their own club the moronic minority of Leeds fans will no doubt again generate.

[Chronicler of Chiswick]

Leeds by at least 40.

[muckymunksy]

Two closely matched sides 

London by 2

[Tommygilf]

Anything other than a demolition and this could turn nasty quite quickly.

The terraces were not happy against Huddersfield, the result against Hull was pretty poor, Smith needs his team to put London to the sword. The attack however has consistently misfired and relied on try of the week contenders from range as our 20m from the tryline plays have been really ineffective.

Is it too unfair to say it has to be at least a 30pt margin? 

[Loiner]

1 hour ago, Chronicler of Chiswick said:

Leeds by at least 40.

With that 3/4 line ? None of our back line available, replaced by kids. Luckily our forwards should overpower the Broncos.

[Chrispmartha]

7 hours ago, M j M said:

Leeds should win comfortably.

I'm away for this one and am sort of glad I am given the hostile environment towards their own club the moronic minority of Leeds fans will no doubt again generate.

Yeah I'm not looking forward to what some in the crowd get up to! Each to their own and all that but I do find it embarrassing.

Phil Caplan on Forty Twenty Podcast summed it up for me.

 

Anyway I do think Leeds will need to put in a decent performance on Friday, we've got a few out but should still have enough to win by at least a few scores.

[Chrispmartha]

6 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

Anything other than a demolition and this could turn nasty quite quickly.

The terraces were not happy against Huddersfield, the result against Hull was pretty poor, Smith needs his team to put London to the sword. The attack however has consistently misfired and relied on try of the week contenders from range as our 20m from the tryline plays have been really ineffective.

Is it too unfair to say it has to be at least a 30pt margin? 

I'm not sure its unfair to say that but I do think its a bit disrespectful, as was the carry on by some of our fans against Hull, I could have a rant but can't be bothered.

Salford only beat London by 8 points, and that's with everyone's favourite Super Coach in charge

Our 3/4 backline hasn't got a first teamer in it and will likely have 3 kids playing in it. As I say we should win but it might not be by a cricket score.

It's another perfect game for the Smith haters

Win by loads - well we should be doing SMITH OUT 

Win by a few - SMITH OUT and loads of booing

Lose - Armageddon and SMITH OUT

[Tommygilf]

10 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

I'm not sure its unfair to say that but I do think its a bit disrespectful, as was the carry on by some of our fans against Hull, I could have a rant but can't be bothered.

Salford only beat London by 8 points, and that's with everyone's favourite Super Coach in charge

Our 3/4 backline hasn't got a first teamer in it and will likely have 3 kids playing in it. As I say we should win but it might not be by a cricket score.

It's another perfect game for the Smith haters

Win by loads - well we should be doing SMITH OUT 

Win by a few - SMITH OUT and loads of booing

Lose - Armageddon and SMITH OUT

Tbh I think he's lost the a large proportion of fans at the moment, there's little for him to be gained from this week or last week. The wins have to be big imo, or at least our defence has to be good enough that it can cover somewhat for our poor attack.

The faltering back line and attack is a theme from last year into this. It's a shame these young lads are being thrown in at this stage.

I don't think it's that disrespectful to London. They are effectively a part time team with no expectations coming up against Leeds Rhinos in Leeds. Salford don't spend much more than they do, and London were at home. They also lost 40-0 at the nearly as poor Cas last week...

[Chrispmartha]

4 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Tbh I think he's lost the a large proportion of fans at the moment, there's little for him to be gained from this week or last week. The wins have to be big imo, or at least our defence has to be good enough that it can cover somewhat for our poor attack.

The faltering back line and attack is a theme from last year into this. It's a shame these young lads are being thrown in at this stage.

I don't think it's that disrespectful to London. They are effectively a part time team with no expectations coming up against Leeds Rhinos in Leeds. Salford don't spend much more than they do, and London were at home. They also lost 40-0 at the nearly as poor Cas last week...

I've no doubt he's lost some fans, in fairness he never had quite a few of them who didn't like his appointment in the first place.

I don't particularly mean it's disrespectful just to London, I think it was disrespectful to Hull last week and Huddersfield the week before.

With regard to the young kids, thankfully we have some really talented ones waiting in the wings, and those fans who are constantly bagging Smith might want to speak to speak of them who say how much he has helped them come through and the way they have been integrated into the first team squad.

[Tommygilf]

25 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

Phil Caplan on Forty Twenty Podcast summed it up for me.

 

 

Support = Blind Faith it seems to Phil?

Dialogue doesn't always have to be constantly positive and reassuring. Likewise, Leeds fans rightly have expectations (from themselves and projected from the club) for the team to be performing better than it has been. 

Support, like love, means being honest to me. 

[Tommygilf]

1 minute ago, Chrispmartha said:

I've no doubt he's lost some fans, in fairness he never had quite a few of them who didn't like his appointment in the first place.

I don't particularly mean it's disrespectful just to London, I think it was disrespectful to Hull last week and Huddersfield the week before.

With regard to the young kids, thankfully we have some really talented ones waiting in the wings, and those fans who are constantly bagging Smith might want to speak to speak of them who say how much he has helped them come through and the way they have been integrated into the first team squad.

I think last season and the start of this one have lost him far more than many coaches can't consider concerning.

I don't think it's just the results, it's the nature of the performances and the feeling that we're heading for another year without silverware after 1/3 of the season down. Fans are allowed to be upset over that and voice those frustrations. Losing so many home games hasn't helped either.

The work with the young lads might be amazing, but it isn't making a difference right now because the 1st team he is integrating them into is poor.

[Chrispmartha]

3 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

 

Support = Blind Faith it seems to Phil?

Dialogue doesn't always have to be constantly positive and reassuring. Likewise, Leeds fans rightly have expectations (from themselves and projected from the club) for the team to be performing better than it has been. 

Support, like love, means being honest to me. 

Well personally I don't think chanting ROHAN OUT to the players after the game is very supportive.

I agree with a lot of what Phil is saying here, I got some abuse on Twitter just for going against the narrative of everything is rubbish, everyone is entitles to there opinion on both sides, but some of it is getting pretty nasty IMO.

[Chrispmartha]

1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

I think last season and the start of this one have lost him far more than many coaches can't consider concerning.

I don't think it's just the results, it's the nature of the performances and the feeling that we're heading for another year without silverware after 1/3 of the season down. Fans are allowed to be upset over that and voice those frustrations. Losing so many home games hasn't helped either.

The work with the young lads might be amazing, but it isn't making a difference right now because the 1st team he is integrating them into is poor.

I Honestly get that but when he was appointed it was clear that this was a long term project, I know with the signings we've made for this year expectations were high, but personally I always thought this year was a year too early for any silverware, we are still light in the forwards, which with the surgery needed to the squad would have been hard to achieve this year.

Ive said fro, pretty early on in his appointment I don't think Smith will ultimately get the rewards from the work he's done within the set up, but he was given a remit and it was a long term one, Leeds have been far too quick to chop and change stuff in the last 6 years and not stick to a plan.

If the supporters get their wish and he is sacked Ill give it a year before they are calling for the next person to be sacked and the cycle continues.

And all that is ignoring the fact that we are only a 3rd way through the season and we are only 2 points of 3rd place. A lot can happen.

[Tommygilf]

Just now, Chrispmartha said:

Well personally I don't think chanting ROHAN OUT to the players after the game is very supportive.

I agree with a lot of what Phil is saying here, I got some abuse on Twitter just for going against the narrative of everything is rubbish, everyone is entitles to there opinion on both sides, but some of it is getting pretty nasty IMO.

It isn't meant to be supportive in that sense I think. Its meant to send a clear message to those players about how those supporters are feeling. As I said in a relationship I think honesty is key. Many fans aren't happy and pretending otherwise serves no purpose.

Until the team starts performing well I think it will continue. I don't think Smith will ever have them performing well tbh and have seen enough to suggest that.

I don't like the disharmony it is creating in the fanbase at all either and it is toxic. Sorry that you have received abuse.

[Chrispmartha]

5 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

It isn't meant to be supportive in that sense I think. Its meant to send a clear message to those players about how those supporters are feeling. As I said in a relationship I think honesty is key. Many fans aren't happy and pretending otherwise serves no purpose.

Until the team starts performing well I think it will continue. I don't think Smith will ever have them performing well tbh and have seen enough to suggest that.

I don't like the disharmony it is creating in the fanbase at all either and it is toxic. Sorry that you have received abuse.

Those players had just won a game though, that's why I find it all a bit entitled and disrespectful.

As I say it is each to their own and if the fans want to chant and boo, then that's up to them, I'm just not a fan of it at all.

[THE RED ROOSTER]

Leeds by 36 in a get right non-contest

[bobbruce]

1 hour ago, Tommygilf said:

I think last season and the start of this one have lost him far more than many coaches can't consider concerning.

I don't think it's just the results, it's the nature of the performances and the feeling that we're heading for another year without silverware after 1/3 of the season down. Fans are allowed to be upset over that and voice those frustrations. Losing so many home games hasn't helped either.

The work with the young lads might be amazing, but it isn't making a difference right now because the 1st team he is integrating them into is poor.

From an outsider it reminds me of Cunningham at Saints it’s not so much the performances. It’s the comments after don’t seem to match what’s just happened. So you lose confidence he’s the man to fix the problem. 

[Chrispmartha]

1 minute ago, bobbruce said:

From an outsider it reminds me of Cunningham at Saints it’s not so much the performances. It’s the comments after don’t seem to match what’s just happened. So you lose confidence he’s the man to fix the problem. 

I think the difference is IIRC Cunningham didn’t into a club that needed a major overhaul 

[bobbruce]

6 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

I think the difference is IIRC Cunningham didn’t into a club that needed a major overhaul 

I think it did he just wasn’t the man to do it. From the 2014 GF win to the 2019 GF win took a big turnover in personnel to get winning titles again. Sure a few players stayed around like Roby,Walmsley,Lomax ,Thompson Percival and Makinson but the 2014 squad needed overhauling. Soliola,Manu,Llaffranchi,Clough,Wellens all went. Hohaia was all but done I think Walsh broke his leg the year before and was never the same again and I’m pretty sure Lomax lost the year virtually through injury. Cunningham was dealt a really tough hand don’t let the 2014 GF hide that fact. 

[Chrispmartha]

Just now, bobbruce said:

I think it did he just wasn’t the man to do it. From the 2014 GF win to the 2019 GF win took a big turnover in personnel to get winning titles again. Sure a few players stayed around like Roby,Walmsley,Lomax ,Thompson Percival and Makinson but the 2014 squad needed overhauling. Soliola,Manu,Llaffranchi,Clough,Wellens all went. Hohaia was all but done I think Walsh broke his leg the year before and was never the same again and I’m pretty sure Lomax lost the year virtually through injury. Cunningham was dealt a really tough hand don’t let the 2014 GF hide that fact. 

Fair enough 

[Tommygilf]

4 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

I Honestly get that but when he was appointed it was clear that this was a long term project, I know with the signings we've made for this year expectations were high, but personally I always thought this year was a year too early for any silverware, we are still light in the forwards, which with the surgery needed to the squad would have been hard to achieve this year.

Ive said fro, pretty early on in his appointment I don't think Smith will ultimately get the rewards from the work he's done within the set up, but he was given a remit and it was a long term one, Leeds have been far too quick to chop and change stuff in the last 6 years and not stick to a plan.

If the supporters get their wish and he is sacked Ill give it a year before they are calling for the next person to be sacked and the cycle continues.

And all that is ignoring the fact that we are only a 3rd way through the season and we are only 2 points of 3rd place. A lot can happen.

I appreciate what you say and ultimately I think the problems at Leeds are bigger than Rohan Smith (hence minimal material change since Furner and Agar for example). Resigning Fusitua is a peak example of that lack of direction.

That said, I genuinely don't think Smith helps, or if he does, he really does not convey that to fans very well at all. That in itself is a failing of his as the public face of the rugby department - if the results on the pitch don't do the talking then you have to be better off it and I think we can both agree that isn't Smith's strong suit.

I don't think the club has an identity or a set of leaders to implement that identity. We've been talking about young players for nearly a decade now too. I think Agar was treading water after being reluctant initially by his own admission. Smith again feels like a coach disconnected from the results and fanbase.

I wouldn't mind if Smith came out and critiqued the club publicly. That honesty is sorely missing towards the fans, some of whom are resorting to all they can with the current chants. I doubt he will though, as from GH's appearance on a recent Sky Sports podcast, he's of the belief everything is rosy...

We may only be a third of the way into a season, but it feels like last year already, and we're out of the cup too. Croft and Ackers look like half the players they were at Salford, Frawley seems to be no better than he ever was at Huddersfield, and Miller whilst lively and energetic simply isn't a seasoned enough RL fullback to make a contribution in "normal" attacking moves which is clearly hindering our opponents 20m attacking stats. 

I remember you saying yourself that Smith wouldn't be able to start this season like last year, and we should wait for "his team". I think that time is coming...

[Tommygilf]

4 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

Those players had just won a game though, that's why I find it all a bit entitled and disrespectful.

As I say it is each to their own and if the fans want to chant and boo, then that's up to them, I'm just not a fan of it at all.

They had won, by 1 try, a game against a side who had conceded 50 points or more in 4 of the previous 5 games...

I think the players need to be aware they aren't performing at the levels expected. If the coach keeps saying in the changing rooms what he is saying in the press conferences then fans take action to make their own voices heard.

Its what happens when a club appears rudderless. 

[Chrispmartha]

13 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

They had won, by 1 try, a game against a side who had conceded 50 points or more in 4 of the previous 5 games...

I think the players need to be aware they aren't performing at the levels expected. If the coach keeps saying in the changing rooms what he is saying in the press conferences then fans take action to make their own voices heard.

Its what happens when a club appears rudderless. 

You really think the players and coach think they are performing to their full capabilities? 

I think you’re reading way too much into coach press conferences TBH. Watch most coaches pressers, they don’t come out and slag the club and players off in public.

 

[Loiner]

5 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

I'm not sure its unfair to say that but I do think its a bit disrespectful, as was the carry on by some of our fans against Hull, I could have a rant but can't be bothered.

Salford only beat London by 8 points, and that's with everyone's favourite Super Coach in charge

Our 3/4 backline hasn't got a first teamer in it and will likely have 3 kids playing in it. As I say we should win but it might not be by a cricket score.

It's another perfect game for the Smith haters

Win by loads - well we should be doing SMITH OUT 

Win by a few - SMITH OUT and loads of booing

Lose - Armageddon and SMITH OUT

And why wouldn't it be Armageddon if we lost ? It would be the most embarrassing defeat on all time. I'm not one for sack the coach but if we lose ?