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Manfred Mann

Ryan Hall should be back playing in the NRL for many weeks.

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The Sydney Roosters' star winger Daniel Tupou was injured in Thursday night's spine tingling clash with the Melbourne Storm. Tupou has reportedly suffered a severe case of  syndesmosis.

That injury will keep Tupou off the field for between  6 and 10 weeks (a more accurate and precise prognosis should be available on Tuesday).

This unfortunate turn of events for the Roosters incumbent left winger should give Ryan Hall the chance to play top flight rugby league for several weeks, and it gives the Rubik's Cube wiz a chance to shine, playing at last in his preferred left wing spot, outside Josh Morris, rather than on the right wing. Hall will also benefit from the fact that most of the Roosters' attack goes down their left side.

Here's hoping that Ryan Hall does well in the coming weeks, scores a few tries, and cements a good contract -- either at the Roosters or elsewhere -- for 2021 and beyond.

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3 hours ago, Manfred Mann said:

The Sydney Roosters' star winger Daniel Tupou was injured in Thursday night's spine tingling clash with the Melbourne Storm. Tupou has reportedly suffered a severe case of  syndesmosis.

That injury will keep Tupou off the field for between  6 and 10 weeks (a more accurate and precise prognosis should be available on Tuesday).

This unfortunate turn of events for the Roosters incumbent left winger should give Ryan Hall the chance to play top flight rugby league for several weeks, and it gives the Rubik's Cube wiz a chance to shine, playing at last in his preferred left wing spot, outside Josh Morris, rather than on the right wing. Hall will also benefit from the fact that most of the Roosters' attack goes down their left side.

Here's hoping that Ryan Hall does well in the coming weeks, scores a few tries, and cements a good contract -- either at the Roosters or elsewhere -- for 2021 and beyond.

I hope he works on his defence down the edge... They will target him the air and the ground

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45 minutes ago, DoubleD said:

Think he’s already signed for Toronto for next season hasn’t he?

I have not seen any evidence of that.  I checked the Wolfpack website and there is no announcement of Hall being signed. So it is probably just a rumour.

But Toronto have signed Ryan Hall's former Leeds team mate Kallum Watkins. Maybe you confused the Watkins signing  with Hall?

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33 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

I hope he works on his defence down the edge... They will target him the air and the ground

Catching the high kicks is one of Daniel Tupou's great strengths. Ryan Hall is not in Tupou's class on that skill, so he is going to have to practice taking the high kicks if he is going to succeed at the Roosters.

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2 minutes ago, Manfred Mann said:

I have not seen any evidence of that.  I checked the Wolfpack website and there is no announcement of Hall being signed. So it is probably just a rumour.

But Toronto have signed Ryan Hall's former Leeds team mate Kallum Watkins. Maybe you confused the Watkins signing  with Hall?

No I’m pretty sure it’s a done deal.

Roosters have the option of Ikuvalu still

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6 minutes ago, DoubleD said:

No I’m pretty sure it’s a done deal.

Roosters have the option of Ikuvalu still

If it is in fact a "done deal" already, it can only be a done deal verbally. Because if Hall had signed on the dotted line the club would surely have made a public announcement already.

But in any case I think that the Wolfpack would be better served by signing two quality British or Australian or Kiwi props. That position is their real area of weakness.

 

Yes, the Roosters still have the option of Ikuvalu. And they are rumoured to be considering Herbie Farnworth as well.

Edited by Manfred Mann

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12 minutes ago, Manfred Mann said:

Catching the high kicks is one of Daniel Tupou's great strengths. Ryan Hall is not in Tupou's class on that skill, so he is going to have to practice taking the high kicks if he is going to succeed at the Roosters.

Yes that is true

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4 hours ago, Manfred Mann said:

the Rubik's Cube wiz

Ey , you’re wasted here Manfred ! Very good .

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Before Tupou went off injured against the Storm he had made four handling errors.

What percentage of these errors do we think Hall would need to make before people were labelling him as 'out of his depth'... I reckon about 25 or 50%.

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13 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

Before Tupou went off injured against the Storm he had made four handling errors.

What percentage of these errors do we think Hall would need to make before people were labelling him as 'out of his depth'... I reckon about 25 or 50%.

Agree with that - don't get me wrong I think it's well documented that Hall left it too late to really have a fair crack at the NRL. That said, how the Fox/9 commentators go on about him sometimes it's like they're angry this near on 33 SL veteran is even allowed to be on the field! He's looked solid if not spectacular in the recent games i've seen him in - does he make mistakes? Of course he does but as you point out so does Tupou - neither are helped by the fact the Morris twins are in the form of their lives. Even Tedesco looks pretty ordinary across that backline at the moment with them two stealing the show. 

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Tupou has been in great form though , anyone can have a bad night . His levels in recent times are consistently very good and he’s a big weapon for the Roosters . Hall has shown hardly any sign he’s gonna cut it there in the games he’s played . I gave him the benefit of the doubt but he’s looked well below that standard when you look at the other wingers 

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3 minutes ago, DavidM said:

Tupou has been in great form though , anyone can have a bad night . His levels in recent times are consistently very good and he’s a big weapon for the Roosters . Hall has shown hardly any sign he’s gonna cut it there in the games he’s played . I gave him the benefit of the doubt but he’s looked well below that standard when you look at the other wingers 

I think the injury he had, normally takes a couple of years - made up of recuperation and confidence building.  Hes a bit older too.

Arent the Morris's a year older than Ryan?  

If he gets a run of a few games, I'm sure he'll do ok.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, DavidM said:

Tupou has been in great form though , anyone can have a bad night . His levels in recent times are consistently very good and he’s a big weapon for the Roosters . Hall has shown hardly any sign he’s gonna cut it there in the games he’s played . I gave him the benefit of the doubt but he’s looked well below that standard when you look at the other wingers 

I am sure we have both watched all of Hall's games David.

Given the amount of service he has received and the try scoring opportunities he has had, what would you have expected him to do that he hasn't done?

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1 minute ago, Dunbar said:

I am sure we have both watched all of Hall's games David.

Given the amount of service he has received and the try scoring opportunities he has had, what would you have expected him to do that he hasn't done?

It’s always an interesting point of argument this. Has he been given that level of service because based upon what they see of him in training etc, they don’t view him as being a key strike weapon?

That is something that often isn’t taken into account. His teammates and coaches see him day in, day out and make a judgement based on that. He still looks short of confidence to me, perhaps he’s finding it difficult finding his place in the team, in a new environment, amongst world class players whilst coming back from a serious injury

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1 minute ago, DoubleD said:

It’s always an interesting point of argument this. Has he been given that level of service because based upon what they see of him in training etc, they don’t view him as being a key strike weapon?

That is something that often isn’t taken into account. His teammates and coaches see him day in, day out and make a judgement based on that. He still looks short of confidence to me, perhaps he’s finding it difficult finding his place in the team, in a new environment, amongst world class players whilst coming back from a serious injury

There may be something in this but I think the really simple answer is that the Roosters shift better to the left than the right and when they do attack right their edge of Manu and Crighton are more running threats than ball handlers and so anyone on the right wing for the Roosters is going to get fewer opportunities than the left.

My point on Hall is not that he is in the form of his life (he isn't) but he hasn't bombed any try scoring opportunities because he hasn't had any.

So what he has done is work hard with the ball, particularly in his own half and I am sure that Robinson recognises that as a decent contribution.  His ball carrying has always been his main strength and I am sure that was a factor in the Roosters bringing him in to the squad as all the Roosters back three (whichever combination) have a key job in carrying the ball and starting the sets with momentum.

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I made the point on another thread that a decade ago Hall was one of the best wingers in the world and scored some fantastic tries for England and Leeds. For a good few years he would have walked onto practically any team on the world. I don't think he looked like the player he once was even in his last couple of years at Leeds so its no surprise his form at the Roosters, particularly after his bad injury in the first place.

In his later years at Leeds he seemed to have now just turned into an extra forward on the wing making the hard yards and this has continued at the Roosters. He used to be so much more than that. Whether that is age, injury or just bulking up way too much, or indeed a combination of all 3, I'm not sure.

He has looked way too big for a long time, going back to his later Leeds days. Injuries and not enough gametime seems to have made that worse with probably too much time in the gym and not enough match fitness. Hopefully more gametime will see him shed the excess size and see him regain some of his speed and mobility.

Edited by Damien
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I’ve thought about the argument that Hall isn’t getting great service , and I’ve commented on that , but everything is relative in comparison . Brett Morris has 7 tries , Tupou has 4 tries , Josh Morris is a stand out , Manu is a stand out . They’re all shining across the backline . So then is it the gamelan or ultimately is it Hall ? Or do the side not rate him much as a go to when he’s there , which would tell it’s own tale ? His exit yards are strong but you’d be wanting a lot more than that . He’s had sniffs , he’s had chances but he’s not looked clinical or confident with those . I think if he wasn’t English and we weren’t focusing on him we’d see a squad player filling in for first choices . Injuries may have jaded him as a prime Hall of five years back would be having a much bigger impact imo

Edited by DavidM
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12 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

There may be something in this but I think the really simple answer is that the Roosters shift better to the left than the right and when they do attack right their edge of Manu and Crighton are more running threats than ball handlers and so anyone on the right wing for the Roosters is going to get fewer opportunities than the left.

My point on Hall is not that he is in the form of his life (he isn't) but he hasn't bombed any try scoring opportunities because he hasn't had any.

So what he has done is work hard with the ball, particularly in his own half and I am sure that Robinson recognises that as a decent contribution.  His ball carrying has always been his main strength and I am sure that was a factor in the Roosters bringing him in to the squad as all the Roosters back three (whichever combination) have a key job in carrying the ball and starting the sets with momentum.

I don't doubt that Robinson values his contribution to that, which is why he's keeping Ikuvalu out the side. However, he used to be much more than that and he looks a shadow of his former self. We'll see how he goes, if given the chance. I'm not sure he'll play left wing though..........I expect Brett will move there outside his brother (as it's his preferred wing too), and Hall will play right wing again, which isn't his preference either

8 minutes ago, Damien said:

I made the point on another thread that a decade ago Hall was one of the best wingers in the world and scored some fantastic tries for England and Leeds. For a good few years he would have walked onto practically any team on the world. I don't think he has looked like the player he was in his last couple of years at Leeds so its no surprise his form at the Roosters, particularly after his bad injury in the first place.

In his last couple of years at Leeds he didn't look the player he once was and seemed to have now just turned into an extra forward on the wing making the hard yards and this has continued at the Roosters. He used to be so much more than that. Whether that is age, injury or just bulking up way too much, or indeed a combination of all 3, I'm not sure.

He has looked way too big for a long time, going back to his later Leeds days. Injuries and not enough gametime seems to have made that worse with probably too much time in the gym and not enough match fitness. Hopefully more gametime will see him shed the excess size and see him regain some of his speed and mobility.

His confidence can come back, however I don't think he'll get back his speed or mobility at his age. Mobility is now key more than ever with the restart set of 6 and Hall was never the most mobile, but now looks cumbersome (and did in his final season or so at Leeds as you rightly point out)

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2 minutes ago, DavidM said:

I’ve thought about the argument that Hall isn’t getting great service , and I’ve commented on that , but everything is relative in comparison . Brett Morris has 7 tries , Tupou has 4 tries , Josh Morris is a stand out , Manu is a stand out . They’re all shining across the backline . So then is it the gamelan or ultimately is it Hall ? Or do the side not rate him much as a go to when he’s there , which would tell it’s own tale ? His exit yards are strong but you’d be wanting a lot more than that . He’s had sniffs , he’s had chances but he’s not looked clinical or confident with those . I think if he wasn’t English and we weren’t focusing on him we’d see a squad player filling in for first choices . Injuries may have jaded him as a prime Hall of five years back would be having a much bigger impact imo

As a cross comparison, in terms of teammates/coaches not rating someone much, I've thought the same about Ryley Jacks when I've seen him play for Melbourne this year. I played close attention to his impact on the side, and more often than not his teammates would bypass him or just not send the ball his way, despite being one of the halves. I probably wouldn't have noticed, but it seemed quite stark, particularly when he was in such a key pivotal position. I'm sure there's an element of this with Hall, and he's a quiet lad so probably doesn't impress himself vocally much. He's also a big confidence player...........perhaps when he gets his first try, the shackles will come off a bit

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6 minutes ago, DoubleD said:

I expect Brett will move there outside his brother (as it's his preferred wing too), and Hall will play right wing again, which isn't his preference either

Yes, I think this will happen and is the right choice for the Roosters.

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I think it also needs saying that we wouldn’t be discussing and analysing it if we didn’t want him to succeed , as all our guys who take the plunge .  I hope he comes in , rips it up and scores a hattrick 

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It is interesting when you look at the comparison of the tries by wingers with the Roosters compared to the rest of the comp.

The Roosters are far and away the leading try scorers in 2020 with 37 (next best are Sharks, Eels and Tigers with 33 each) and yet when you look at tries by wingers they are ranked 7th with 11 tries (North Queensland lead with 18).

The Roosters do however lead in the try scoring contributions by their second row and half back.  

They absolutely set themselves up to target their attack to the second row/centre edge combinations of Cordner & Morris and Crighton & Manu.

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I have noticed a seemingly reluctance by his team mates to pass to Hall when in an attacking position. 

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