Venue switch - World Cup QF

[GUBRATS]

6 minutes ago, ShropshireBull said:

They must have known before too.  And just move one down south to a bigger stadium .

Before what ? , If there's a clash , that's down to Bolton to refuse the QF , it looks like they've only just told the RFL now 

And as I've put , move it how far ? , 20 miles to Warrington ? , Or 200 miles to London ? 

And the cost implications ? 

[Tommygilf]

7 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

A downgrade yes , but people who aren't involved just randomly suggesting alternatives that quite possibly either aren't available , or indeed just aren't interested in hosting is crazy , just people who like having a pop at the RFL , once you've moved Anfield to Wigan , that takes Wigan out of the equation for replacing Bolton , that's why I suggested the 3 other similar sized and relatively close to alternatives , but maybe they just aren't interested , or are outside the workable costs 

The downgrade is what people are bothered about. 

To refer to my original post you replied to, the equivalent logic applied to the other two QF venues would see Huddersfield and Hull replaced with Doncaster and Kingston Park or York. Or for the Semi finals, going from Elland Road and the Emirates to Headingley and Brentford. The trajectory isn't a good sign imo.

As an aside Blackburn, Burnley and Preston would be poor alternatives for their own reasons imo.

[RayCee]

The problem with the 2022 RL WC is that it’s now competing with the likes of the FIFA equivalent. 2021 was the better year for the RL tournament. Another problem is keeping momentum going for an extra year. Surely attendances will be impacted. 

[GUBRATS]

1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

The downgrade is what people are bothered about. 

To refer to my original post you replied to, the equivalent logic applied to the other two QF venues would see Huddersfield and Hull replaced with Doncaster and Kingston Park or York. Or for the Semi finals, going from Elland Road and the Emirates to Headingley and Brentford. The trajectory isn't a good sign imo.

As an aside Blackburn, Burnley and Preston would be poor alternatives for their own reasons imo.

So you'd admit , it isn't as easy as just telling a stadium they must take on a RLWC quarter final , they might well have exhausted all other options 

[gingerjon]

30 minutes ago, Just Browny said:

Getting turfed out for some ITV4 filler snooker tournament, having already had the booking for the rugby, is really embarrassing. At least that time Wigan couldn't play a home game it was because of a wedding that had already been booked.

It does seem odd that we can be turfed out having already made the booking and put tickets on sale.

[GUBRATS]

1 minute ago, RayCee said:

The problem with the 2022 RL WC is that it’s now competing with the likes of the FIFA equivalent. 2021 was the better year for the RL tournament. Another problem is keeping momentum going for an extra year. Surely attendances will be impacted. 

But nothing you can do about that , it's not great , but not a disaster 

[Tommygilf]

2 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

So you'd admit , it isn't as easy as just telling a stadium they must take on a RLWC quarter final , they might well have exhausted all other options 

Odd that you would find something I didn't say in that but oh well.

[Barley Mow]

We obviously don't know if they considered it or even tried and failed to accommodate it, but I would have gone for both west quarter finals at Wigan with Bolton pulling out.

It's closer to Bolton in capacity and prestige (as well as geographically) and it would give Wigan a second match instead of Warrington a 4th.

[Harry Stottle]

20 hours ago, Dave T said:

Indeed. 

The HJ is fine for a WC QF, it hosted one last time, its fine. 

But we have now downgraded Anfield to the DW and Bolton to the HJ. 

The cynic in me suggests that organisers are not disappointed with this, quarter finals are tough sells, and we now have far fewer seats to fill. 

After a brilliant couple of years, there is a real risk of losing positive momentum. 

Even considering the organisers are asking the majority of the crowd which will be Warrington folk to attend 4 games, I can very well see some tickets for a fiver on offer, at Leigh in '13 for the Tonga v Cook Islands close to the event tickets went for 3 quid each, it worked though nearly 12.000 full capacity turned up.

[GUBRATS]

3 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Odd that you would find something I didn't say in that but oh well.

You said the trajectory isn't good , true , I'm sure the RFL agree as well , but as I put , they might have exhausted all the other workable alternatives , don't Forget Bolton given their recent financial issues would take anything and everything to bring in revenue right now , other football clubs might not be as desperate , hence why they've gone for a RL venue 

[GUBRATS]

4 minutes ago, Barley Mow said:

We obviously don't know if they considered it or even tried and failed to accommodate it, but I would have gone for both west quarter finals at Wigan with Bolton pulling out.

It's closer to Bolton in capacity and prestige (as well as geographically) and it would give Wigan a second match instead of Warrington a 4th.

That's providing the Wigan owners want yet another RL game on their pitch in essentially winter 

[Jughead]

4 minutes ago, Barley Mow said:

We obviously don't know if they considered it or even tried and failed to accommodate it, but I would have gone for both west quarter finals at Wigan with Bolton pulling out.

It's closer to Bolton in capacity and prestige (as well as geographically) and it would give Wigan a second match instead of Warrington a 4th.

Wigan have a double header on in the QF, giving them a third game that weekend would probably not go down to well with the landlords. 

[Tommygilf]

9 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

You said the trajectory isn't good , true , I'm sure the RFL agree as well , but as I put , they might have exhausted all the other workable alternatives , don't Forget Bolton given their recent financial issues would take anything and everything to bring in revenue right now , other football clubs might not be as desperate , hence why they've gone for a RL venue 

They've not even gone for a largest RL venue in the area. 

[GUBRATS]

1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

They've not even gone for a largest RL venue in the area. 

Which is where ?

[Tommygilf]

1 minute ago, GUBRATS said:

Which is where ?

St Helens, 18k.

Face it Gubby, they've halved the two Quarter Finals they've had to move. I suspect, as others on this thread have suggested, the pre sales were way down hence the willingness to so radically slash venue capacity.

[Harry Stottle]

1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

St Helens, 18k.

Face it Gubby, they've halved the two Quarter Finals they've had to move. I suspect, as others on this thread have suggested, the pre sales were way down hence the willingness to so radically slash venue capacity.

Yep agree with that Tommy, but 6 months before the event? The ticket sales barometer at RLHQ for all games must be some way below 'fair'.

[Barley Mow]

20 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

That's providing the Wigan owners want yet another RL game on their pitch in essentially winter 

 

20 minutes ago, Jughead said:

Wigan have a double header on in the QF, giving them a third game that weekend would probably not go down to well with the landlords. 

Yeah, this was the main thought behind mentioning the possibility of trying/failing to accommodate it. 

[EagleEyePie]

27 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

It does seem odd that we can be turfed out having already made the booking and put tickets on sale.

They made the booking and put tickets on sale for last year, so technically the deal has already been broken. I have a feeling the Snooker tournament was already agreed, so essentially whenever the deal was signed the commitment was there that the tournament would take place, even though the dates wouldn't have been officially confirmed. Until it's confirmed they can't be certain there's a clash. Neither event can be rearranged or delayed so one was bound to take precedent.

[Dave T]

32 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Even considering the organisers are asking the majority of the crowd which will be Warrington folk to attend 4 games, I can very well see some tickets for a fiver on offer, at Leigh in '13 for the Tonga v Cook Islands close to the event tickets went for 3 quid each, it worked though nearly 12.000 full capacity turned up.

Yeah, I don't think they have the pricing quite right tbh and I do expect some creativity with the pricing as we get closer. 

My worry is that they have 4 games at Wire, 3 at Saints, 3 at Leigh and 1 at Wigan - that's 11 games and 165k tickets to sell. 

I hope they go down the route of working with charities and community groups, schools etc to offer cheaper pricing if they do that at all. 

[Toby Chopra]

49 minutes ago, RayCee said:

The problem with the 2022 RL WC is that it’s now competing with the likes of the FIFA equivalent. 2021 was the better year for the RL tournament. Another problem is keeping momentum going for an extra year. Surely attendances will be impacted. 

They will be, but not catastrophically it seems. 

A little while back Dutton said a majority of pre-sales had survived the transfer from 21 to 22, although that of course means we've ended up selling less than first thought, so are starting further back in the final push over the summer/autumn. 

On the upside, we had an extra year to make up those sales. On the downside, that involved extra effort and cost, which judging by the cuts made to the organising staff, we haven't made. Plus the other sporting distractions we'll face. 

Overall, I think the tournament will still be more successful than 2013 or 2017, making a profit, and perhaps more importantly for the UK game, we'll be plastered all over the BBC for 6 weeks. We need to put on our best show for that, and I'm confident the rugby will be entertaining. I'll be interested to see what the BBC have planned for coverage innovations. 

But will the tournament be the gamechanger for UK rugby league that was suggested it could be? No. 

Although perhaps that was always wishful thinking. The RFU made bold claims about how the 2015 world cup would lift union to on a par with football, and 7 years on I think that sport is no further forward than it was then. 

A profit, widespread publicity and some memorable moments should mean we come out of RLWC 2021 net positive. 

[Tommygilf]

Just now, Harry Stottle said:

Yep agree with that Tommy, but 6 months before the event? The ticket sales barometer at RLHQ for all games must be some way below 'fair'.

They recently advertised that they had sold out Cat C seating at Headingley for 1 or maybe both games I think - which is just a bit odd.

Unsurprisingly, sticking 9 group games between Leigh, Warrington and St Helens, plus an England game in Bolton, the England QF in Wigan, and another Quarter final in Bolton(now Warrington), seems a lot like over saturation. 

The "third" games at venues was going to be a tough sell anyway, but with such an abundance of fixtures in such a small area without the city to draw fans in from elsewhere, its going to be even more difficult imo. Lot of expectation placed on the good people of Warrington, St Helens and "Wigan & Leigh".

[Tommygilf]

5 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Yeah, I don't think they have the pricing quite right tbh and I do expect some creativity with the pricing as we get closer. 

My worry is that they have 4 games at Wire, 3 at Saints, 3 at Leigh and 1 at Wigan - that's 11 games and 165k tickets to sell. 

I hope they go down the route of working with charities and community groups, schools etc to offer cheaper pricing if they do that at all. 

There's still England at Bolton in the group stage too. Its 200k tickets to sell to basically the local area.

[Harry Stottle]

6 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

They recently advertised that they had sold out Cat C seating at Headingley for 1 or maybe both games I think - which is just a bit odd.

Unsurprisingly, sticking 9 group games between Leigh, Warrington and St Helens, plus an England game in Bolton, the England QF in Wigan, and another Quarter final in Bolton(now Warrington), seems a lot like over saturation. 

The "third" games at venues was going to be a tough sell anyway, but with such an abundance of fixtures in such a small area without the city to draw fans in from elsewhere, its going to be even more difficult imo. Lot of expectation placed on the good people of Warrington, St Helens and "Wigan & Leigh".

It seems like someone at RLHQ considers they are close enough to be one big city.

[Dave T]

6 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

There's still England at Bolton in the group stage too. Its 200k tickets to sell to basically the local area.

Yes. I understand the approach of reducing numbers of venues, it was one of the findings from 2013, but I think geographically we are too tight in some areas. 

Now I hope my concerns are unfounded, let's be honest we do have tens of thousands of ready made customers in this area, but I fear there will be too much of a reliance on us customers attending many games, and as per my post a few weeks back, the pricing structure doesn't really lend itself to that. 

[Dave T]

10 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

They recently advertised that they had sold out Cat C seating at Headingley for 1 or maybe both games I think - which is just a bit odd.

Unsurprisingly, sticking 9 group games between Leigh, Warrington and St Helens, plus an England game in Bolton, the England QF in Wigan, and another Quarter final in Bolton(now Warrington), seems a lot like over saturation. 

The "third" games at venues was going to be a tough sell anyway, but with such an abundance of fixtures in such a small area without the city to draw fans in from elsewhere, its going to be even more difficult imo. Lot of expectation placed on the good people of Warrington, St Helens and "Wigan & Leigh".

It's interesting, if you look at that Category of seats that was sold out in Leeds I think it was something like 2 blocks at the ends of the South Stand. It wasn't worth shouting about, but understand why they did so.