The Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport

[Spidey]

1 hour ago, Big Picture said:

If that was true, it would mean that IMG has just taken on an impossible job wouldn't it.

No. Maybe currently interested would’ve been the right description. Nothing to say they can’t get interested. However the OP said majority aren’t even aware of RL in Warrington. That simply isn’t true, all the amateur clubs have plenty of members, and you can’t shop in Tesco without going past Warrington Wolves signage. All the high schools play RL. There are so many touch points it’s impossible to not be aware

[gingerjon]

2 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I care little for party politics. 

But this government has made a lot of noise about a 'Northern Powerhouse' and 'leveling up' and indeed it was suggested that winning the Rugby League World Cup and playing games predominantly in the North was part of this narrative. 

This World Cup (sport) is on the BBC across multiple platforms (digital and media) and is being played out in this 'Northern Powerhouse' (culture).

I would suggest the least the Minister and her team could do was know which sport she was talking about.

Not simply part of the narrative. It's Northern Powerhouse funding and an actual manifesto commitment from the government to deliver the Rugby League World Cup.

Next you'll be telling me that political candidates don't read the manifestos they are standing on.

[Man of Kent]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

 

That joke’s on us 

[Tommygilf]

31 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

In my experience it tends to be that there is an automatic assumption that if you say rugby you mean rugby union.

Also in my experience, I’ve never had to explain to anyone who has lived in this country for any length of time that rugby league exists. I have had to to people from outside the UK. And for both groups I’ve had to explain some of the differences.

I would never have expected to have to explain to anyone drawing a salary to control sport in this country that that there are two sports.

In my experience it is either that, or that they don't even realise that the 6 Nations and Challenge Cup are different sports.

Most of the people I went to Uni with would know the Rhinos are Leeds' rugby team, a fraction of them (and generally the union fans/players) would know they played Rugby League. Jonny Wilkinson and Kevin Sinfield both played "rugby". 

It is disappointing but not surprising that the Secretary of State and their speech writers fall into this category. 

[Tommygilf]

2 hours ago, phiggins said:

I doubt it is that common amongst people speaking at Rugby League World Cup events

You'd be surprised, especially with those who are there on the corporate level.

[gingerjon]

2 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

In my experience it is either that, or that they don't even realise that the 6 Nations and Challenge Cup are different sports.

Most of the people I went to Uni with would know the Rhinos are Leeds' rugby team, a fraction of them (and generally the union fans/players) would know they played Rugby League. Jonny Wilkinson and Kevin Sinfield both played "rugby". 

It is disappointing but not surprising that the Secretary of State and their speech writers fall into this category. 

It may be generational then. I can only go on my experience.

I do genuinely think it is surprising that the Secretary of State and her speechwriters, advisors, researchers (etc) fall into this category because their actual job is not to fall into this category.

[Dave T]

5 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

That joke’s on us 

Only if you want it to be. 

It's a direct joke poking fun at Dorries. 

[Futtocks]

1 minute ago, gingerjon said:

I do genuinely think it is surprising that the Secretary of State and her speechwriters, advisors, researchers (etc) fall into this category because their actual job is not to fall into this category.

I suggested, on another thread, that it is entirely possible that the people who have to work for Dorries loathe her even more than the rest of us, so they don't signpost the obvious pitfalls and no-nos. Without those warnings, she (even if partially sober) can be relied upon to say and/or do the wrongest, most stupid thing imaginable, because that's her only talent.

[Man of Kent]

2 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

It may be generational then. I can only go on my experience.

I do genuinely think it is surprising that the Secretary of State and her speechwriters, advisors, researchers (etc) fall into this category because their actual job is not to fall into this category.

I’ve heard older blokes round here say with a straight face ‘Is it still going?’ in relation to RL. The wider ignorance surrounding rugby league is perhaps more than we realise. 

[gingerjon]

Just now, Man of Kent said:

I’ve heard older blokes round here say with a straight face ‘Is it still going?’ in relation to RL. The wider ignorance surrounding rugby league is perhaps more than we realise. 

They have heard of it then.

[gingerjon]

Just now, Futtocks said:

I suggested, on another thread, that it is entirely possible that the people who have to work for Dorries loathe her even more than the rest of us, so they don't signpost the obvious pitfalls and no-nos. Without those warnings, she (even if partially sober) can be relied upon to say and/or do the wrongest, most stupid thing imaginable, because that's her only talent.

There may be something in that. Any reply in that direction, I'll stick on the politics board.

[Tommygilf]

2 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

It may be generational then. I can only go on my experience.

I do genuinely think it is surprising that the Secretary of State and her speechwriters, advisors, researchers (etc) fall into this category because their actual job is not to fall into this category.

I think that is a fair comment. I have grown up in an era where Wilkinson's drop goal was the biggest "rugby" moment, and League hasn't had the same stars as Offiah or Davies in the past. Equally, Rugby Union has professionalised every aspect of itself so much in 27 years that even that gap is closing somewhat. 

I wouldn't be surprised at all if her speechwriters/advisors/civil servants were all of a similar ilk that just doesn't really care that much about rugby. Simple truths of government and the civil service class I suppose.

[Dave T]

1 minute ago, gingerjon said:

They have heard of it then.

Yup. There seems to be a lot of people equating not being an RL fan as never heard of it. 

 

[graveyard johnny]

when people get a divorce its not unusual to drop the other partners name- when league broke away it should have dropped the rugby tag there and then - is it too late now?

[Dunbar]

9 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Not simply part of the narrative. It's Northern Powerhouse funding and an actual manifesto commitment from the government to deliver the Rugby League World Cup.

Next you'll be telling me that political candidates don't read the manifestos they are standing on.

I thought it was, but I didn't have the time to double check so I didn't want to state something that isn't true.

Anyway, I'm really not bothered if the majority of people don't know the difference between the two codes and even default to 'rugby' being what they see every year in the six nations.

But I do start to care if it is part of their job. But I have miss spoke in client amd partner meetings in the past* so who knows, she may have been going off script and made a gaff.  I am talking myself into a position of relative sympathy for her here!

(* to lighten the mood a little... 100% genuine. I was meeting with the CTO of Lufthansa to talk about Google Cloud and I called the business Luftwaffa.  It took a while to live that one down).

[gingerjon]

2 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

I think that is a fair comment. I have grown up in an era where Wilkinson's drop goal was the biggest "rugby" moment, and League hasn't had the same stars as Offiah or Davies in the past. Equally, Rugby Union has professionalised every aspect of itself so much in 27 years that even that gap is closing somewhat. 

I wouldn't be surprised at all if her speechwriters/advisors/civil servants were all of a similar ilk that just doesn't really care that much about rugby. Simple truths of government and the civil service class I suppose.

I'll leave off comments about civil servants/her team beyond that it should be their job as that really does take us into politics.

I think we can all agree: it's not a great look but, heh, at least some people are talking about us now.

[Tommygilf]

Just now, Dave T said:

Yup. There seems to be a lot of people equating not being an RL fan as never heard of it. 

 

I do get the impression that the older you are the harder it was to not know Rugby League existed, purely because it was the only significant club rugby game with profile, and of course the infamy associated wrongly with code swappers.

Nowadays, and so for younger generations, neither code has a huge profile as soccer has overtaken everything by a massive margin, and we compete in the space that is "rugby". To a certain extent that is to our benefit, much of the old class (as in status) elements aren't as prevalent to casual spectators. Of course it also has a negative impact.

[Man of Kent]

3 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

They have heard of it then.

Heard of it mostly due to Eddie Waring but long since dropped off their radar. It’s complacent to assume everyone in England or whatever knows about rugby league - they really don’t. 

[Tommygilf]

2 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

I'll leave off comments about civil servants/her team beyond that it should be their job as that really does take us into politics.

I think we can all agree: it's not a great look but, heh, at least some people are talking about us now.

Much like Prince Harry did too. Perhaps RLWC 2021 will be the WC of political Infamy

As Oscar Wilde said...

[Toby Chopra]

I do fear that in the current era - with infinite digital distractions and tv channels available - there are greater numbers of people who don't know league exists as something separate. 

If I go back to the 80s when I started watching, I think most people who followed any sport in any way knew about rugby league, even if it was a jaundiced or stereotypical view of it. If you had a TV or read the sports pages you would soon become aware of its existence at least. 

Nowadays, it's quite easy not to come across it, which maybe is how her advisers missed it too, although I'd still be furious with them if I was Dorries. You had one job.. etc. 

But, in the spirit that there's no such thing as bad publicity, hopefully it'll get people talking. 

Dutton says he and Dorries "had a conversation" about her mistake, and he's looking forward to inviting her to the tournament and was very diplomatic. The right choice and hopefully that conversation included a few quid extra for the marketing budget or some other support as we make the final push on ticket sales. 

[gingerjon]

4 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

Heard of it mostly due to Eddie Waring but long since dropped off their radar. It’s complacent to assume everyone in England or whatever knows about rugby league - they really don’t. 

Heard of it.

Would know that a Rugby League World Cup is not the same as Wilkinson dropping a goal to win in 2003.

[Tommygilf]

5 minutes ago, graveyard johnny said:

when people get a divorce its not unusual to drop the other partners name- when league broke away it should have dropped the rugby tag there and then - is it too late now?

That's a slight misreading of history imo.

RL didn't "break away". It just formed a League just as had happened in Association football. Unlike in Soccer however, the RFU and the RL were not able to come to an arrangement like the FA and the Football League did.

So Rugby League, for a century, was at least on paper the professional competitive rugby. That it evolved different rules is another point that has kept difference ever since.

[Tommygilf]

4 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Heard of it.

Would know that a Rugby League World Cup is not the same as Wilkinson dropping a goal to win in 2003.

Would they? Sure they wouldn't think it was a Rugby (union) World Cup, given how little that game is followed relatively too?

I think it reflects on the popularity of both codes tbh. We're both in the margins.

Edited June 30, 2022 by Tommygilf

[gingerjon]

2 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Would they? Sure they wouldn't think it was a Rugby (union) World Cup, given how little that game is followed relatively too?

I think the people MoK is talking about are old enough and, given he’s in Tunbridge Wells, posh enough to follow the rahs. Even if only the internationals.

[Tommygilf]

Just now, gingerjon said:

I think the people MoK is talking about are old enough and, given he’s in Tunbridge Wells, posh enough to follow the rahs. Even if only the internationals.

Fair enough, apologies I edited my post afterwards to move it more towards the point I was aiming towards.