State of Origin 2

[Dave T]

Just now, MattSantos said:

I replied without seeing the previous chat on this. I didn't see it as a penalty at the time and a still image doesn't do anyone any good.

 

 

The tackler has to clear the ruck. That isn't optional. He can't stand over DCE like that. 

Inevitably it leads to handbags as DCE tries to get up with the tackler straddling him. 

The ref deemed it all legal. If its legal, that suggests that the tackler can just slow every PTB down to a snails pace by doing that. But they can't, as they would be penalised 99% of the time, because the rule states to move off the player. 

[MattSantos]

NSW were very England, they look over coached in the middle. Yeo touching the ball on every play to shift it on a block play. Christ!

I'd get rid of Fittler now to be honest, too much negativity and gives a new coach a free shot at building some momentum for next year.

New coach.. play through the middle and don't pick Frizel and Young over Murray and Martin. Also, pick players that are fit... 

 

 

[MattSantos]

4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

The tackler has to clear the ruck. That isn't optional. He can't stand over DCE like that. 

Inevitably it leads to handbags as DCE tries to get up with the tackler straddling him. 

The ref deemed it all legal. If its legal, that suggests that the tackler can just slow every PTB down to a snails pace by doing that. But they can't, as they would be penalised 99% of the time, because the rule states to move off the player. 

As alluded to above..  if the ref blew his whistle for every illegal action, we wouldn't have a game. I was happy with it in the game, you weren't. That's sport. 

Unless it's completely crazy, I just don't see the point in looking at individual decisions. Crack on. 

[LittleboroRoughyed]

I thought DCE (oldest player on the pitch?) chasing down Chrichton epitomised the Maroons - effort, spirit & a fair bit of class. Luai is a massively overrated grub!

[Click]

Overall - For what is often billed as the greatest spectacle of RL.. It was a pretty disappointing game,  lots of errors - NSW can't even be described as coached, they just look like they get thrown onto the pitch and Fittler says "have fun". QLD had plenty of set plays and ways of creating an overlap and I don't think NSW had a single move planned out.

I would say that I support NSW generally speaking, as when I first starting watching Origin all they did was lose, so naturally I started rooting for the underdog until they eventually won a series again, but they don't look like they would win anything with Fittler in charge. 

Generally speaking I don't mind the aussie commentators, but they were pretty poor today. 

Like Dunbar says, I enjoy the more "edge" that SoO brings, but I think certain things should be punished. I wasn't a fan of the Reece Walsh high tackle (the one that was challenged and the commentators were upset they gave it as a high tackle) - The tackle itself was around the neck with both arms, but it was more when they were on the ground and Walsh decided to wrench at the neck of the NSW player twice while he was already tackled. Wasn't a great look, but wasn't mentioned by the TV people.

[Mojo]

1 hour ago, LittleboroRoughyed said:

I thought DCE (oldest player on the pitch?) chasing down Chrichton epitomised the Maroons - effort, spirit & a fair bit of class. Luai is a massively overrated grub!

Tbh any 6 would've struggled when you have Cook next to him at center and with no attacking and especially defensive threat at all. And not only that Addo-Carr didn't do anything at all and only ran for 56m. Meanwhile To'o was trying his heart out on the other wing. Left side got exposed badly on the defensive end. Hynes or walker at 6 would've been on the same boat as Luai. Qld were just too good at everything!

[Mojo]

7 hours ago, Dunbar said:

You would have liked to have seen a penalty for that?

DCE elbowed luai during the tackle and tried to kick him, which is why Luai stood over him. I'm glad the ref let it go for both players. It's origin and the rough stuff is normal in the heat of the moment I guess.

[Dave T]

10 hours ago, MattSantos said:

As alluded to above..  if the ref blew his whistle for every illegal action, we wouldn't have a game. I was happy with it in the game, you weren't. That's sport. 

Unless it's completely crazy, I just don't see the point in looking at individual decisions. Crack on. 

Yeah, this one was complete crazy. It's not just hands in for a sec. 

[Dave T]

7 hours ago, Mojo said:

DCE elbowed luai during the tackle and tried to kick him, which is why Luai stood over him. I'm glad the ref let it go for both players. It's origin and the rough stuff is normal in the heat of the moment I guess.

Not when the rough stuff literally stops the game and it becomes handbags of a scuffle. 

The game just descends into farce. By saying play on there is an acceptance that nobody has fouled, not that everyone has fouled. 

If your assessment is correct, I definitely think we are going too far if we are allowing an elbow, a kick, interference and a scuffle in one tackle!

Edited June 22, 2023 by Dave T

[Dave T]

9 hours ago, Click said:

Overall - For what is often billed as the greatest spectacle of RL.. It was a pretty disappointing game,  lots of errors - NSW can't even be described as coached, they just look like they get thrown onto the pitch and Fittler says "have fun". QLD had plenty of set plays and ways of creating an overlap and I don't think NSW had a single move planned out.

I would say that I support NSW generally speaking, as when I first starting watching Origin all they did was lose, so naturally I started rooting for the underdog until they eventually won a series again, but they don't look like they would win anything with Fittler in charge. 

Generally speaking I don't mind the aussie commentators, but they were pretty poor today. 

Like Dunbar says, I enjoy the more "edge" that SoO brings, but I think certain things should be punished. I wasn't a fan of the Reece Walsh high tackle (the one that was challenged and the commentators were upset they gave it as a high tackle) - The tackle itself was around the neck with both arms, but it was more when they were on the ground and Walsh decided to wrench at the neck of the NSW player twice while he was already tackled. Wasn't a great look, but wasn't mentioned by the TV people.

This was another example - Klein didn't penalise it, he must have seen it and allowed it. The commentators reaction to it was ridiculous, claiming there had been 30 tackles like that in the game. 

There hadn't. 

There is plenty that can be allowed to carry on to let the game flow, but if the incidents are leading to scuffles then it is the opposite of letting the game flow. It's a fine line. 

In the end, imho it led to 2 reds and a yellow. 

[MattSantos]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

Yeah, this one was complete crazy. It's not just hands in for a sec. 

That crazy there wasn't a even a penalty?

Hyperbole?

 

[MattSantos]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

 

In the end, imho it led to 2 reds and a yellow. 

Is this a bad thing?

[Click]

9 hours ago, Mojo said:

Tbh any 6 would've struggled when you have Cook next to him at center and with no attacking and especially defensive threat at all. And not only that Addo-Carr didn't do anything at all and only ran for 56m. Meanwhile To'o was trying his heart out on the other wing. Left side got exposed badly on the defensive end. Hynes or walker at 6 would've been on the same boat as Luai. Qld were just too good at everything!

I honestly don't think that Qld were too good at everything, they weren't particularly clinical, they dropped the ball a few times, they were there for the taking if NSW had any idea on how to break a defence down. 

I do agree that the left side of Addo-Carr was pretty awful for helping run the ball back, honestly it feels like it's been awhile since I have seen him put in a full shift but I don't watch his club matches too often. 

Luai has a step an ok short pass and that is about it for his attacking arsenal, it can look great and exciting when he is at full speed and stepping off his left foot, but he isn't particularly skillful and I felt Moses definitely was the better and more effective NSW half yesterday, so I expect him to be dropped for the next game and Luai to retain his spot.

[Dave T]

38 minutes ago, MattSantos said:

That crazy there wasn't a even a penalty?

Hyperbole?

 

Well that's the whole discussion. It should have been. Sure, people can argue that they like the rules being ignored, but it was a 100% foul no matter what people's preferences are.

I'm ok with giving some leeway to make it a better spectacle. My issue is that it made the game very, very messy at the ruck.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Dave T

[MattSantos]

4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Well that's the whole discussion. It should have been. Sure, people can argue that they like the rules being ignored, but it was a 100% foul no matter what people's preferences are.

I'm ok with giving some leeway to make it a better spectacle. My issue is that it made the game very, very messy at the ruck.

You're arguing that 1 tackle influenced the whole game.. 

That's my last post on it. I see no value in spending time debating the influence of one tackle on the game when there are a plethora of more important things to review. Have you seen Cotter's beautiful arms?

 

[Dave T]

5 minutes ago, MattSantos said:

You're arguing that 1 tackle influenced the whole game.. 

That's my last post on it. I see no value in spending time debating the influence of one tackle on the game when there are a plethora of more important things to review. Have you seen Cotter's beautiful arms?

 

I can only assume you haven't read the discussion, because that isn't my position in the slightest.

[MattSantos]

11 minutes ago, MattSantos said:

My issue is that it made the game very, very messy at the ruck.

... why post this then Dave?

Anyhoozle. Cotter's arms.. 

[Dave T]

1 minute ago, MattSantos said:

... why post this then Dave?

Anyhoozle. Cotter's arms.. 

You missed the first part of that para for some reason. Repeated for accuracy:

I'm ok with giving some leeway to make it a better spectacle. My issue is that it made the game very, very messy at the ruck.

So quite clearly, the "it" referred to is the approach of giving leeway, not this one tackle.

[MattSantos]

Just now, Dave T said:

You missed the first part of that para for some reason. Repeated for accuracy:

I'm ok with giving some leeway to make it a better spectacle. My issue is that it made the game very, very messy at the ruck.

So quite clearly, the "it" referred to is the approach of giving leeway, not this one tackle.

Interpretations eh. Ref's have em as well. Stop moaning about them..

[Pulga]

 

 

 

[MattSantos]

5 minutes ago, Pulga said:

 

 

 

It cannot be. The intensity isnt the same and the rucks were too messy. Plus something about Luai and people not being arm in arm during the anthem.

[Click]

31 minutes ago, MattSantos said:

It cannot be. The intensity isnt the same and the rucks were too messy. Plus something about Luai and people not being arm in arm during the anthem.

You do realise people come onto forums to debate and discuss things, especially one of the biggest games of 2023 so far?

[DoubleD]

1 hour ago, Pulga said:

 

 

 

What's BVOD?

[Farmduck]

32 minutes ago, DoubleD said:

What's BVOD?

Broadcast Video On Demand. Content made by traditional TV stations that is available online at any time.

[Mojo]

2 hours ago, Click said:

I honestly don't think that Qld were too good at everything, they weren't particularly clinical, they dropped the ball a few times, they were there for the taking if NSW had any idea on how to break a defence down. 

I do agree that the left side of Addo-Carr was pretty awful for helping run the ball back, honestly it feels like it's been awhile since I have seen him put in a full shift but I don't watch his club matches too often. 

Luai has a step an ok short pass and that is about it for his attacking arsenal, it can look great and exciting when he is at full speed and stepping off his left foot, but he isn't particularly skillful and I felt Moses definitely was the better and more effective NSW half yesterday, so I expect him to be dropped for the next game and Luai to retain his spot.

Your right qld also had their bad moments but it felt like nsw was always 2 steps behind the whole game. Moses had a ok game. But he took a couple of average chip kicks that made no sense at all. He also went missing in that 2nd half. It felt like Moses was just a passenger that whole 2nd half and Yeo took over most of the plays.

Saying Luai has only a "step and a ok short pass" is way off tbh. Panthers left side has been dominant the last 2 championships. This year is the only year that hasn't happened so far... but they're slowly getting that dominance back. Kikau hasn't been that dominant since he left the panthers next to Burton. Before the injury Burton struggled to click with him so far.

Sorenson was a journeyman before he joined the panthers. No team wanted him. Now he's one of the form second rowers in the comp next to Luai. And their combination is starting to click. You can say the panthers system and Cleary makes him look good. But when the team starts winning all the glory and praises goes to Cleary but when they start losing people go after Luai because he's a easy target.

In saying that Reynolds and Walker would've been worse than Moses and Luai last night. They were never the answer. Hynes would've probably done better than Moses but who knows. When the forwards are getting dominated what is the halves supposed to do?.