New women's rl website

[unapologetic pedant]

Following yesterday's RL games, I took in some of the England v New Zealand RU game on the BBC Red Button. Our public service broadcaster seem very keen on this WXV tournament. Even if nobody else is.

The caricature of Union (nothing but reset scrums, lineouts, and penalty goals) is over 30 years out of date. Women's RU especially is very open. Not for the first time I was struck by how often a Union ref plays on where a League ref would stop the game and call something (knock-on, double knock-on, obstruction, forward pass).

It's still oddly unsatisfying though. At times, both teams appeared to be scoring at will. Loads of space, disorganized defences, throwing the ball around from anywhere, ref playing long advantages. Came across like a 15-a-side version of 7s. No discernible strategy or territorial contest. Superficially entertaining perhaps, but not a patch on the epic battle of WSL GF.

[unapologetic pedant]

On 07/10/2024 at 15:52, unapologetic pedant said:

Not for the first time I was struck by how often a Union ref plays on where a League ref would stop the game and call something (knock-on, double knock-on, obstruction, forward pass).

Been re-watching the GF and it brought home how much harm officials are doing to WSL. They make it nigh impossible for our players to produce a spectacle. 

The ludicrous phantom forward pass call against Zoe Harris (probably the TJ wanting to get involved) summed it up. Wouldn't even cross a Union ref's mind to see such a pass as forward.

Several times, one team lost the ball, opposition regathered, should have been play on, ref blew up anyway. Everything slowed down and condensed, no expectation among players that the ref will play advantage. 

On one occasion, ball came loose in an upright tackle. Went clearly backwards, ball-carrying arm was well above the ground, ref hadn't called Held, so should have been play on. But all the players stopped, looked at the ball on the ground, and waited for a whistle. Which duly came.

Coaches and players have got the message that safety-first is the way to win. Simple one-out carries are the only means of keeping officials out of the game. 

[unapologetic pedant]

Noticeable how many RU games at the top level are controlled by women. 

English RL would benefit from more female refs. Male officials are steeped in the crowd culture of men's RL. Means they're constantly looking for things to call. WSL games regularly have three blokes doing their utmost to make everything more difficult. Creativity is suppressed, risk-taking deterred. To thrive as a spectator sport WSL needs to entertain, but our players are not being given the chance.

From what I've seen, Tara Jones is less officious and more inclined to let the game flow. Have to think she would be more in tune with the women's game. Not sure what the RFL policy is, as regards Tara refereeing WSL. Would imagine her goal is to ref SL. 

[unapologetic pedant]

On 27/09/2024 at 21:54, unapologetic pedant said:

Widnes 40 Swinton 6 at DCBL Stadium. 

Think I recognized the ref as the bald bloke who took charge of the 2018 Leeds/Cas CC final at Warrington. Wasn't impressed back then. Better now. More inclined to let the players get on with it. Perhaps the noodle-armed juvenile from Army v Navy might similarly learn to stop looking for things to call.

Omitted to mention a salient detail about the above game - No Touch Judges.

Possible moral, apropos of the foregoing gripes - Two thirds reduction of hindrance. One bloke looking for things to call rather than three blokes looking for things to call.

[The Blues Ox]

8 minutes ago, unapologetic pedant said:

Omitted to mention a salient detail about the above game - No Touch Judges.

Possible moral, apropos of the foregoing gripes - Two thirds reduction of hindrance. One bloke looking for things to call rather than three blokes looking for things to call.

Only games at that level with TJ's are the finals. Its a struggle some weeks to get ref's on Sundays and will get worse for the community game with the 19's competition moving to Sundays as well.

[unapologetic pedant]

Result from Port Moresby -

Junior Orchids 4 Australian Schoolgirls 14

Encouraging for the PNG junior girls. Intuition and precedent indicated a massacre. Open-age PM's XIII game ended PNG 0 Australia 50.

[unapologetic pedant]

Kiwi Ferns squad for the Christchurch Test in a fortnight looks very strong. Betting against Aussies in RL is not a lucrative business, as a rule. Nevertheless, after last year, and with home advantage, I reckon NZ start slight favourites. Olivia Kernick is a surprising omission for Jillaroos.

Virtue of the Women's Pacific Championship is that, unlike the men, all the star names are eager to play for their nations.

[The Blues Ox]

Just a follow up from the other thread in regards tonights meeting regarding league structure and rule changes. It was confirmed that both London and Cardiff will be invited in to the Championship but the full make up of the division is yet to be decided but its looking like there will be loop fixtures but it was said that teams will only have to travel to one of either Cardiff or London but not both. The RFL have no idea how the community teams in the Championship are going to fund this travel (Upwards of 1k to hire a coach for either journey).

No mention about Warrington potentially dropping out but Wakefield have asked to stay in League 1 which recieved opposition as everyone has heard about them paying players from next season but it was mentioned because they did not win a single game this season then they do not deserve that spot in the league over the League 2 runners up Orrell.

The SL U19's competition was confirmed as moving to Sundays and squad sizes are set at 25 for first teams and unlimited for U19's. Multiple teams complained about this as expected with the team that has topped League 1 for the last two seasons Thatto saying they already know they are losing over 10+ players to Saints next season and there is a very realistic chance they may not enter a team next season. Oulton, Fryston, Stanningley, and Dewsbury expect to be hit very hard over this as well. SL will still be allowed to DR with lower division teams next season but there will still be no DR between teams from lower divisions. 

There seems to be very little respect for the community clubs and we all know what happens in the lads game and i expect the same to happen with this in that lasses will be told they are no longer needed by SL clubs and they won't filter back to the community clubs, I think a much higher percentage than in the lads game will simply walk away from the game. At the moment there does not seem to be much incentive for any clubs to run any age group above 16's in my opinion.

 

[unapologetic pedant]

2 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

Just a follow up from the other thread in regards tonights meeting regarding league structure and rule changes. It was confirmed that both London and Cardiff will be invited in to the Championship but the full make up of the division is yet to be decided but its looking like there will be loop fixtures but it was said that teams will only have to travel to one of either Cardiff or London but not both. The RFL have no idea how the community teams in the Championship are going to fund this travel (Upwards of 1k to hire a coach for either journey).

If one trip South is potentially unaffordable for Northern community clubs, begs the question how Cardiff and London will fund all their trips North.

I have an idea Cardiff secured some funding from Sport Wales. Might be wrong, could have been the national team.

[The Blues Ox]

9 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

If one trip South is potentially unaffordable for Northern community clubs, begs the question how Cardiff and London will fund all their trips North.

I have an idea Cardiff secured some funding from Sport Wales. Might be wrong, could have been the national team.

Yeah exactly. The same was said about Workington and Barrow. Those teams are looking at upwards of 15k just for travel unless they can get a deal with a coach company. Ive not heard any mention of if it is likely that London and Cardiff accept the offer.

[gingerjon]

9 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

begs the question how Cardiff and London will fund all their trips North

If it mirrors the end of this season, assuming London even make it to next season, then it will be GoFundMes all over the place.

[RBKnight]

12 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

Just a follow up from the other thread in regards tonights meeting regarding league structure and rule changes. It was confirmed that both London and Cardiff will be invited in to the Championship but the full make up of the division is yet to be decided but its looking like there will be loop fixtures but it was said that teams will only have to travel to one of either Cardiff or London but not both. The RFL have no idea how the community teams in the Championship are going to fund this travel (Upwards of 1k to hire a coach for either journey).

No mention about Warrington potentially dropping out but Wakefield have asked to stay in League 1 which recieved opposition as everyone has heard about them paying players from next season but it was mentioned because they did not win a single game this season then they do not deserve that spot in the league over the League 2 runners up Orrell.

The SL U19's competition was confirmed as moving to Sundays and squad sizes are set at 25 for first teams and unlimited for U19's. Multiple teams complained about this as expected with the team that has topped League 1 for the last two seasons Thatto saying they already know they are losing over 10+ players to Saints next season and there is a very realistic chance they may not enter a team next season. Oulton, Fryston, Stanningley, and Dewsbury expect to be hit very hard over this as well. SL will still be allowed to DR with lower division teams next season but there will still be no DR between teams from lower divisions. 

There seems to be very little respect for the community clubs and we all know what happens in the lads game and i expect the same to happen with this in that lasses will be told they are no longer needed by SL clubs and they won't filter back to the community clubs, I think a much higher percentage than in the lads game will simply walk away from the game. At the moment there does not seem to be much incentive for any clubs to run any age group above 16's in my opinion.

 

Thank you for this update. Evidently the RFL think that the place to be for 16-19yo's is in Super League U19 squads  There is no other way of interpreting the unlimited squad size being allowed and moving the U19 fixtures to weekends....

Compare this with the caution with Year 10/11 girls, where the Super League clubs are only allowed to take a maximum of 12 girls in each year group into extended blocks of training.

It does look like a lot of Championship and League 1 sides are going to be gutted (in terms of playing numbers) by this. It also puts an end to the experiment that York did last season, in their dual-reg arrangement with Sheffield Eagles, with Valkyrie U19s gaining valuable open-age experience in the Championship.

 

[The Blues Ox]

1 hour ago, RBKnight said:

Thank you for this update. Evidently the RFL think that the place to be for 16-19yo's is in Super League U19 squads  There is no other way of interpreting the unlimited squad size being allowed and moving the U19 fixtures to weekends....

Compare this with the caution with Year 10/11 girls, where the Super League clubs are only allowed to take a maximum of 12 girls in each year group into extended blocks of training.

It does look like a lot of Championship and League 1 sides are going to be gutted (in terms of playing numbers) by this. It also puts an end to the experiment that York did last season, in their dual-reg arrangement with Sheffield Eagles, with Valkyrie U19s gaining valuable open-age experience in the Championship.

 

York and Sheffield should still be ok to DR again this season, or at least that is how I interpret what was said. I think its more aimed at stopping Championship DR'ing players to League 1 or League 2 teams or vice versa. 

Im also hearing that some SL teams will get round the limited first team squad by just having some ladies training with them and dangling the carrot of potential first team opportunities. It will be interesting to see if those players are allowed to play community rugby as they will not be registered to the SL club because of the limit and I would also like to know where those players stand from an insurance point of view with them not been official SL players. I think teams need to be very careful with that.

In my opinion this move to Sundays for the 19's looks like a deliberate act of selfishness by top clubs rather than looking at the bigger picture.

[unapologetic pedant]

On 10/10/2024 at 15:49, unapologetic pedant said:

Been re-watching the GF and it brought home how much harm officials are doing to WSL. 

Followed by re-watching the Saints/Wigan semi.

A signature Chantelle Crowl attempted offload on halfway graphically illustrated the above point. She hit the tackle, turned, and flicked the ball out. Wasn't clean, made contact with a defender as it went to ground. Ref called knock-on.

I accept the knock-on interpretation of "forward" is different from the forward pass rule. Even so, a player facing her own goal-line and releasing the ball out of the back of the hand? No way could officials say with certainty the ball went forward relative to the ground. There had to be doubt. And that's the rub, "Doubt = Call". Flipping this around to "Doubt = Play On" could do so much to open the game up. Officials are actively choosing to punish creativity.

Unmistakable message - "Don't offload. Don't take risks". Sentiment likely amplified from the side-line by some variant of the "need to complete our sets" theme.

Officials and coaches should get together and ask themselves a couple of questions. 1) Will people pay to watch refs call knock-ons? 2) Will people pay to watch teams go through the motion of completing their sets? If the answer on both counts is No, the next question could be "Why is our current application of some rules inimical to the task of building a WSL fanbase"? 

Worth emphasizing that, aside from this call, the ref was generally good. Stung Wigan with half a dozen set restarts. Not sure why Denis Betts was so unhappy. Could easily have been double or triple that number.

[The Blues Ox]

It does seem they may be something going on at Warrington with a number of players leaving and now the head coach. All does not sound too good.

[BroncoFan]

Hopefully Warrington announce a top coach, there definitely was some positives with the young players emerging.

From what I saw, Grace Burnett looks to have a big future but just needs some experience around her. She’s only 21 and I don’t see any other players in WSL with her physical presence.

Millie Bell just turned 19 had a breakout year playing in the halves.

Nicole Barnett 18yo centre showed glimpses but they probably had more injuries than any other team and they could only replace them with youngsters not yet ready.

Hopefully fullback Anna Dennis hangs around and Shannon Stephens comes back from injury.

 

[unapologetic pedant]

Final thought on the Saints/Wigan semi.

The Wigan club website commentators spent much of the second half excoriating Izzy Rowe for the two short kick-offs that went wrong. Symptomatic of RL values in 2024. When innovation fails, blame the idea rather than the execution. Attempted offloads elicit the same reaction. 

Slavish adherence to unimaginative orthodoxy is entirely at odds with the history of our game.

These talented Wigan teenagers clearly want to express themselves. Let's hope a combination of influences from officials, coaches and pundits hasn't turned them into complete-our-sets conformists by the age of 20.

Also been re-watching the Leeds/York semi. The game was compelling due to the closeness. Let's be honest though, it wasn't exactly full of razzle-dazzle attacking football.

Again, officials didn't help. Along with stoppages from the usual raft of phantom knock-ons, the VR made a 10-course meal out of anything sent his way. The players were stood around for nearly 3 minutes waiting to take a goal-line dropout during one of his dilatory deliberations. Despite seeing all he needed within 10 seconds, this bloke went back and forth, asking for more angles, looking repeatedly at the same angles. Seemed to be in his own little world. In tandem with on-field OCD refs, procrastinating VRs will not attract fans to WSL games.

[Richard de la Riviere]

1 hour ago, unapologetic pedant said:

Slavish adherence to unimaginative orthodoxy is entirely at odds with the history of our game.

That is one of the best lines I've ever read about rugby league. Bravo! 

[unapologetic pedant]

Half-time New Zealand 0 Australia 4.

Try scored towards the end of the half. Consecutive goal-line drop-outs. Pressure finally told.

Jillaroos look more dangerous with the ball.

Kiwi Ferns a bit disjointed and predictable, but defending well so far. Fatigue could be a problem later.

[unapologetic pedant]

Full-time New Zealand 0 Australia 14.

The Jess Sergis try and lead-up contained the best attacking moments.

Another elite women's RL game where defences were too good.

[BroncoFan]

Jillaroos almost at full strength minus Kernick, Kiwi girls missing a couple of key players.

Scary to think what England will be up against in LV.

Edited October 28, 2024 by BroncoFan

[unapologetic pedant]

Georgia Taylor (York), Agnes Wood (Sheffield), Ashlea Prescott (Featherstone), Dani McGifford (St. Helens), Gracie Hobbs (Huddersfield).

Added to the more familiar Carys Marsh of Wigan.

I'm not conversant with the backgrounds of these players named in the Welsh squad for Saturday. Are any of them actually Welsh? 

If not, are the selections a sign of WRL increasingly going down the heritage-player route? Or that availability is markedly compromised once the Union season in South Wales gets into full swing.

Implications for the mooted Cardiff involvement in the Northern divisional structure are hard to ignore.

[RigbyLuger]

More Welsh than how "Scottish" their men's rugby union squad is, despite over a century of existing. Not perfect, but far more understandable. 

Not sure Wales have played more than 10 women's tests yet?

[unapologetic pedant]

1 hour ago, RigbyLuger said:

More Welsh than how "Scottish" their men's rugby union squad is, despite over a century of existing. Not perfect, but far more understandable. 

Not sure Wales have played more than 10 women's tests yet?

Authenticity isn't the main concern.

Don't recall as many heritage players (assuming they are) selected in earlier Welsh squads. Prima facie seems a backward step. Possibly prompted by the previously-mentioned availability constraints.

[RigbyLuger]

7 minutes ago, unapologetic pedant said:

Authenticity isn't the main concern.

Don't recall as many heritage players (assuming they are) selected in earlier Welsh squads. Prima facie seems a backward step. Possibly prompted by the previously-mentioned availability constraints.

And now we seem to know that England will play the Jillaroos next autumn, a summer tri-series with France and Wales would be a good idea to keep up playing against both.