OFFICIALS

[maripins]

Been watching first half of Fev and Toronto on freesports. These officials are really really bad.Toronto take a long kick, winger catches cleanly, lo and behold TJ raises his flag.Replay clearly shows he is a foot inside play!! A bigger joke was the ref. Toronto attacking, Brierly puts an optimistic kick in, hits the post, Toronto man dives and clearly knocks on, toronto player touches down, try given. Now the ref is behind the sticks in full view of the action, should never ref another match after that. Commentators both said clearly a knock on! There's too many useless officials out there for anything to change.Really ruins games. SPECSAVERS on the shirts, now that is a joke!

[troutmaster]

Ref looks a 12 year old?????

[shaun mc]

Trouble is, there have been that many ref's that have packed it in at the top end, such as Silverwood, or for other career reasons, that we have blokes like Kendall reffing in SL. I'm sure he'll make a good ref, but he's too wet behind the ears, as are others. This impacts lower down where very young refs are now having to do Champ and League 1 games when they should be getting experience at lower levels

Nowadays it seems like how often can you blow the whistle rather than managing the game and the players. That must come from the top, or is part of their performance measurement, so its not the young refs fault

[silverfox]

IF YOU THINK THE STANDARD OF THE OFFICIALS IS BAD IN THE CHAMPIONSHIP  ,YOU WANT TO SEE IT IN LEAGUE ONE . AND IN THE SUPER LEAGUE THE REF FOR SOME REASON NEARLY ALWAYS GOES TO THE VIDEO REF  WHEN A TRY IS SCORED . AND THEY MUST BE WATCHING A DIFFERENT MATCH TO THE ONE THATS SHOWED ON SKY TV . SOME OF THERE DECISIONS ARE A JOKE ,WATCHED HULL KR V HULL , HULL KR GET  BRILLIANT TRY DISALLOWED FOR OBSTRUCTION ,AND NO WAY COULD THE DEFENDER GET NEAR THE TRY SCORER , DUMMY RUNNERS ARE NOW BEING TOUCHED DELIBERATLEY  BY A DEFENDER ,TO GET OBSTUCTIONS , SO I THINK THE WHOLE GAME WANTS LOOKED AT .   

[Onreport]

15 minutes ago, troutmaster said:

Ref looks a 12 year old?????

Twin to yesterdays touchie then?

[maripins]

10 minutes ago, silverfox said:

IF YOU THINK THE STANDARD OF THE OFFICIALS IS BAD IN THE CHAMPIONSHIP  ,YOU WANT TO SEE IT IN LEAGUE ONE . AND IN THE SUPER LEAGUE THE REF FOR SOME REASON NEARLY ALWAYS GOES TO THE VIDEO REF  WHEN A TRY IS SCORED . AND THEY MUST BE WATCHING A DIFFERENT MATCH TO THE ONE THATS SHOWED ON SKY TV . SOME OF THERE DECISIONS ARE A JOKE ,WATCHED HULL KR V HULL , HULL KR GET  BRILLIANT TRY DISALLOWED FOR OBSTRUCTION ,AND NO WAY COULD THE DEFENDER GET NEAR THE TRY SCORER , DUMMY RUNNERS ARE NOW BEING TOUCHED DELIBERATLEY  BY A DEFENDER ,TO GET OBSTUCTIONS , SO I THINK THE WHOLE GAME WANTS LOOKED AT .   

Well I know the standard of officials in Champ 1 as I support Town.The point I was trying to make was the officials are rubbish at all pro levels. I agree about the Video Ref. We have to rely on the judgement of three half bakes.

[DavidM]

I think there’s an awful lot in the argument around the instruction refs are getting from above . I also think the VR has reduced the standard at the top level here and Oz . They don’t officiate the game anymore , they’ve lost the control they’ve lost the confidence to make decisions . Refs used to manage the game better and have a better feel for it , now they’re robotic and remote controlled and use the VR as a comfort blanket for everything . I also think , and yes I’m a traditionalist , that the game is far to sanitised , we’ve gone way to far on what’s not allowed and what’s penalised , and the more you straitjacket things the more whistle you’ll get . There’s zero latitude anymore and so much is picky and analysed to find a wrong . I’m watching a game thinking ‘ what’s wrong with that , what’s that for ? ‘ a lot . I understand player welfare but we’ve thrown the baby out with the bath water - why ban the shoulder charge , it’s a great spectacle and way of showing domination . Just outlaw head contact . Why penalise every lift , it’s how you put him down etc etc . Why ban the punch up , you get endless rubbish without end . Maybe me but I liked the game I was brought up with , tough ,  brutal , players going at it , but also lots of skill and fluency and not much ref getting in the way . Now it’s ultra  structured , stats based and based on big guys bashing in an awful lot followed by a kick  , and lots n lots of rules and whistle breaking it up .

[Alineden]

That’s one of the best posts I’ve read for a long time. We hear all the experts talking about how to make our great game greater when all we really need to do is revert back to what attracted us to the sport in the first place. The physicality and brutality of it all.

[Wrlfc]

9 hours ago, DavidM said:

I think there’s an awful lot in the argument around the instruction refs are getting from above . I also think the VR has reduced the standard at the top level here and Oz . They don’t officiate the game anymore , they’ve lost the control they’ve lost the confidence to make decisions . Refs used to manage the game better and have a better feel for it , now they’re robotic and remote controlled and use the VR as a comfort blanket for everything . I also think , and yes I’m a traditionalist , that the game is far to sanitised , we’ve gone way to far on what’s not allowed and what’s penalised , and the more you straitjacket things the more whistle you’ll get . There’s zero latitude anymore and so much is picky and analysed to find a wrong . I’m watching a game thinking ‘ what’s wrong with that , what’s that for ? ‘ a lot . I understand player welfare but we’ve thrown the baby out with the bath water - why ban the shoulder charge , it’s a great spectacle and way of showing domination . Just outlaw head contact . Why penalise every lift , it’s how you put him down etc etc . Why ban the punch up , you get endless rubbish without end . Maybe me but I liked the game I was brought up with , tough ,  brutal , players going at it , but also lots of skill and fluency and not much ref getting in the way . Now it’s ultra  structured , stats based and based on big guys bashing in an awful lot followed by a kick  , and lots n lots of rules and whistle breaking it up .

Best post ive ever read,this is how were all feeling even the players themselves ,the game as gone to soft then they wonder why they carnt grow the game ,they dont ask the people that play the game they just say i no we will change this we will change that ..to ban the shoulder charge was a disgrace with out even consulting the players ,they dont want it banned everybody knows you carnt contact head so the only thing there they should have is a fixed penalty so everybody knows say 6 game ban end off ...bring back the biff or risk losing the sport alltogether.

[Wrlfc]

Send that post into the RFL .

[maripins]

12 hours ago, Alineden said:

That’s one of the best posts I’ve read for a long time. We hear all the experts talking about how to make our great game greater when all we really need to do is revert back to what attracted us to the sport in the first place. The physicality and brutality of it all.

And me! A very clinical explanation of what is wrong, great post. The top elite of RL have tinkered about so much with our game it's hardly recognisable.

[DavidM]

11 hours ago, Wrlfc said:

Send that post into the RFL .

Wouldn’t waste my breath , totally immune. The authorities are right and doing everything in the best interests of the game - except the spectacle , and the enjoyment and any understanding of or empathy with the nature of the game etc etc . Gus Gould on his podcast summed it up  ‘I watch a game now and I see a refereeing exhibition ‘  ...  And the flip side is these guys are human shields for the blokes above them passing on this instruction . That’s where the real change is needed 

[Billy Bob]

17 minutes ago, DavidM said:

Wouldn’t waste my breath , totally immune. The authorities are right and doing everything in the best interests of the game - except the spectacle , and the enjoyment and any understanding of or empathy with the nature of the game etc etc . Gus Gould on his podcast summed it up  ‘I watch a game now and I see a refereeing exhibition ‘  ...  And the flip side is these guys are human shields for the blokes above them passing on this instruction . That’s where the real change is needed 

I watch a lot of Aussie rugby on Sky, their refs seem more geared to let the game flow more and they interpret head tackles on the basis of was there intent or did a players hand or arm hit the opposing players chest and bounce onto his head.

Oz game is much faster and exciting than ours and therefore commands more support, we could learn a lot from the Oz game.

Also our game was better supported when there was one league even when lower teams were getting tonked you got to see all the leagues top players, which was a big attraction for fans to attend games, irrespective of results or league positions.

[dkw]

2 minutes ago, Billy Bob said:

I watch a lot of Aussie rugby on Sky, their refs seem more geared to let the game flow more and they interpret head tackles on the basis of was there intent or did a players hand or arm hit the opposing players chest and bounce onto his head.

Oz game is much faster and exciting than ours and therefore commands more support, we could learn a lot from the Oz game.

Also our game was better supported when there was one league even when lower teams were getting tonked you got to see all the leagues top players, which was a big attraction for fans to attend games, irrespective of results or league positions.

Not this weekends games on sky, they have been penalty fests and pretty tedious games. 

[DavidM]

18 minutes ago, Billy Bob said:

I watch a lot of Aussie rugby on Sky, their refs seem more geared to let the game flow more and they interpret head tackles on the basis of was there intent or did a players hand or arm hit the opposing players chest and bounce onto his head.

Oz game is much faster and exciting than ours and therefore commands more support, we could learn a lot from the Oz game.

Also our game was better supported when there was one league even when lower teams were getting tonked you got to see all the leagues top players, which was a big attraction for fans to attend games, irrespective of results or league positions.

25 penalties each on Friday , even the commentators were totally and utterly fed up. This season has seen over 20 on average so far , more n more ex players are speaking up . Joey Johns made the point about playmakers flourishing as big guys especially tire , but the endless fracturing of the game means there’s more stoppages so it has a knock on effect with players not tiring as quickly . I like the NRL but it’s just horrendous how the game is being officiated right now , I tune in to watch players play , not refs looking to blow every little thing to please their boss . Penalties used to be a last resort ... now they’re a first , and thats a worry . It used to be about keeping  out of it now it’s how much you can get involved . Every minimal or unintentional thing , and to many plain errors are pinged . And it just becomes a downward spiral of you told me to watch this and this and this so I’ll find them for you boss ... over n over again. Officiating is one area that’s an all encompassing issue it seems and they’ve certainly no superiority on that right now . You just feel it’s gonna come to a head somehow 

[Havenwarrior]

The bottom line is players are coached to spoil and slow the game down.

So any coach who complains about the situation, needs to look at their own teams.

 

HW

[Derwent]

I’ve been saying the same thing on the main forum for more than a year and getting derided for it by the twenty somethings on there. I feel sorry for them, they’ve never seen RL played as it should be, just this sanitised version that Sky hype up for them.

[DavidM]

1 hour ago, Havenwarrior said:

The bottom line is players are coached to spoil and slow the game down.

So any coach who complains about the situation, needs to look at their own teams.

 

HW

Maybe so but I still say if you took 75% of the penalties out no one would be any the wiser . Wait until Origin and see how that’s officiated ... and see if the game is drastically different or inferior for it .

[shaun mc]

Some of it is being sanitised because of the times we are living in

You have got to be wary of huge lawsuits coming down the line for not exercising a duty of care, especially re head injuries. Once one lawsuit gets in there, it'll be a flood

I didn't want to see the shoulder charge ruled out, as it spectacular, but when it goes wrong (without any intent whatsoever) then it goes wrong in a bad way. Not every one is the same as Sam Burgess on FF Moi Moi, as fantastic as it was.

Listen to JJB's comments on the SL show - he has 4 boys, 3 of whom play rugby. He wants them to continue to play rugby, but not (in his opinion of course) if we see tackles like the one the Hull winger got sent off for, let go. He commented how that was ok 10 years ago, but not now, and he's probably right

The other side for me is the responsibility of the coaches. They are coaching the players to coax penalties, dive, simulate, wrestle, etc in the same way as any other sport. I don't think we'll ever go back to Rugby League without this happening. The games leaders then have to show leadership to counteract that - they have to realise that just giving more penalties isn't then answer. 

[ivans82]

Best ref all weekend was the one at the Brow v Kells match , but maybe that`s because there was no near the messing about at the play the balls as there is in pro Rugby ......First thing that needs done for me is to revert back to players once subbed not being able to come back on . I talk to a lot of the old players and they said you had to learn to pace yourself for 80 mins and not just go bang , bang , bang off for a rest and back on . Sick of seeing players get payed for 20 mins rugby and spending the rest of the match in the dugout . It might slow the game down a bit but maybe result in less injuries as players naturally tire .  

[Billy Bob]

4 hours ago, DavidM said:

Maybe so but I still say if you took 75% of the penalties out no one would be any the wiser . Wait until Origin and see how that’s officiated ... and see if the game is drastically different or inferior for it .

All Refs are trained at Sellafield in elf & safety and are jobs worth's.

[anok4u]

I talked to a ref who had just jacked in he said years back certain refs had certain ways, before a game the ref went into the changing rooms explaining what he'd be looking out for, thats when coaches/ players knew what they were up against and what things they could get away with. Some refs liked the rough stuff themselves but the human side was taken away and they were made into robots..

[DavidM]

4 minutes ago, anok4u said:

I talked to a ref who had just jacked in he said years back certain refs had certain ways, before a game the ref went into the changing rooms explaining what he'd be looking out for, thats when coaches/ players knew what they were up against and what things they could get away with. Some refs liked the rough stuff themselves but the human side was taken away and they were made into robots..

Spot on , I have myself and you hear about talking to players , humouring them , managing the situations and getting a rapport without endless whistle until they had to . All that has been sucked out it seems and they look preprogrammed by their bosses 

[anok4u]

34 minutes ago, DavidM said:

Spot on , I have myself and you hear about talking to players , humouring them , managing the situations and getting a rapport without endless whistle until they had to . All that has been sucked out it seems and they look preprogrammed by their bosses 

It was part of being a coach knowing the ref and their ways now coaches are just as frustrated if not more than us. In the  end we pay to be entertained by the 26 players on the pitch not the twonk with the whistle!

[ivans82]

I know refs are supposed to ref to the letter of the law , but i think a visit to both changing rooms before games should be mandatory , he could tell the Teams what he was looking for in particular and and at least then everyone knows where they stand .