The General 'Toronto Wolfpack' Discussion Thread

[RobertAM]

well Hakim Miloudi is active on twitter saying he is on his way to training and seems as happy as a lark so maybe he's the only one getting paid?  Unless there suddenly a flood of players complaining they weren't being paid i'd ignore the recycled so called journalism..

[Jayme2020]

i just want to add on this whole Cfl is minor league

 

Avg salary of minor league players $15,000

Avg salary of Cfl player $85,000

[TIWIT]

8 minutes ago, Oldbear said:

I think some people forget that the US and Canadian college systems literally produce thousands of skilled athletes each year, only a small minority will end up with a pro career in the major leagues (including the CFL), for the rest it’s a search to see if they can land something in one of the minor leagues or in Europe. None of those options is well paid and the reality is that the majority will need to forget their sporting dreams and enter the real world of work. I therefore don’t think that RL being a relatively low paid sporting career is that much of an issue and that there does exist a pool of fit, well trained, disciplined athletes who RL could target to see if a number could make it as a pro RL player (and we are not talking big numbers, if the Wolfpack or Aces only find 2-4 guys from this route every couple of years it would help). I think the reality is that finding and identifying athletes from this route will depend how serious the club is in its search, which in turn depends on how much priority is put on doing this at the top level, how much money the owner is willing to spend on this exercise, how patient the owner is in waiting for results and how willing the coaching staff is to spend resources developing players by this route. The reality is that finding your own talent, especially from a non RL background is hard, whereas the easy option is to just import ready made talent and unless clubs get some form of incentive for developing their own most will always choose the easy route.

Its not a career it's an adventure!

[Oldbear]

Having read the article there’s really not a lot of surprises in there. The late payment of suppliers and potential lawsuits are fairly common knowledge and there have been several stories in the past of players being paid late. It is interesting to see the players quote about the people running things on behalf of Argyle and like some have mentioned I am surprised that Mr Elstone has not investigated the whole running and administration of the club, given the issues stated above, the salary cap fiasco and now visa problems, if the club does fail in the next couple of years and is wound up then a major investigation needs to be launched since the failure will almost certainly result from mismanagement rather than lack of funds, in which case the question will need to be asked how did SL/RFL allow this mismanagement to happen?

[TheReaper]

If the CFL is minor league then SL is even worse.

Both are the second best league in that sport, there's a bigger richer league that the best talent goes to for the money and prestige, and players that can't cut it in the big league sometimes find success in the smaller league.

Only the CFL doesn't have owners whining to the press every other week, doesn't have problems paying players, has a salary floor well above minimum wage, and doesn't treat certain clubs like redheaded stepchildren. And sometimes NFL guys still struggle in CFL since it is a slightly different game with a bigger field.

[TIWIT]

6 minutes ago, Jayme2020 said:

i just want to add on this whole Cfl is minor league

 

Avg salary of minor league players $15,000

Avg salary of Cfl player $85,000

Sorry Jayne, but the CFL is the very definition of minor league. The standard of play isn't very good. Very few players make over $100000. Even a second rate American player makes far more on an NFL taxisquad when they used to come up here to hone their game.

60 years ago the CFL and AFL were more or less competitive. The Grey Cup winner now couldn't beat a good NCAA school.

And in the big Can cities. fans definitely perceive the Argos, Als and Lions as minor league

 

[TheReaper]

15 minutes ago, TIWIT said:

Sorry Jayne, but the CFL is the very definition of minor league. The standard of play isn't very good. Very few players make over $100000. Even a second rate American player makes far more on an NFL taxisquad when they used to come up here to hone their game.

60 years ago the CFL and AFL were more or less competitive. The Grey Cup winner now couldn't beat a good NCAA school.

And in the big Can cities. fans definitely perceive the Argos, Als and Lions as minor league

 

They're not minor league because they are the top of (our version) of the sport, aren't subservient to anybody,  pay a living wage and are a (the only) fully professional national league in the country.

The standard of play satisfies millions of Canadians, many of whom would argue that it is better than NFL style football with the larger field, freedom of pre snap motion,  and more exciting play since we don't have the extra down.

[TIWIT]

3 minutes ago, TheReaper said:

They're not minor league because they are the top of (our version) of the sport, aren't subservient to anybody,  pay a living wage and are a (the only) fully professional national level in the country.

The standard of play satisfies millions of Canadians, many of whom would argue that it is better than NFL style football with the larger field, freedom of pre snap motion,  and more exciting play since we don't have the extra down.

And are begging for $150 million from Ottawa to tide them over. Chump change to TSN/Bell

[LeytherRob]

3 hours ago, CanadianRugger said:

Since we are all about random rumours from sources this has been making its rounds on facebook:

Regarding VISAs, Super League has an agreement with the Home Office and Clubs that are full members get different VISA rules and preferential treatment.  Super League didn't want to make Toronto a full member; therefore, TWP has to play by a different set of rules than everyone else.

This issue has been apparently made known to the RFL for some time and nothing was done about it.  Also, the rumour is SKY have gotten involved and are threatening to withdraw funding completely from the other Super League clubs for breach of contract should TWP not play. 

An article in a national newspaper with an on the record quote from Bob Hunter confirming late payment issues is hardly in the same league as a Facebook rumour. 

Toronto have done a lot of good, they get good crowds and have done an unbelievable job to get this far, but to pretend they're without flaws or question is laughable. They had some pretty poor administrators with shady track records at other clubs and a trail of allegations of late wages, non payment of transfer fees and non payment of contractors, some confirmed officially others not.

Here is just one of those instances, reported by a Canadian paper last year.

https://www.thestar.com/sports/2019/01/06/missed-payroll-just-a-glitch-says-toronto-wolfpack.html

The world is not black and white and no club is without it's criticisms. This increasingly polarised thread is just becoming ridiculous as you can't say something good or bad about TW without being lumped into one of these opposing camps. 

[TheReaper]

6 minutes ago, TIWIT said:

And are begging for $150 million from Ottawa to tide them over. Chump change to TSN/Bell

*initial request for up to $150 Mil, as a worst case for not playing at all this year.

Super League received £16 Mil.... So government aid = minor league? Chump change to Sky....

[Big Picture]

1 hour ago, Jayme2020 said:

Youl could say the same about the NHl then many players get cut from the Russian KHL and head to the NHL.

Is that so?  Which KHL castoffs are playing in the NHL then because I've never heard of any.

[John Rhino]

https://inews.co.uk/.../rugby-league/toronto-wolfpack-super-league-wages- late-sonny-bill-williams-visa-553387

 

Weird, the link doesn't work but tapping on the picture does.

 

Shame the i put this negative report online but not the larger and very positive 2/3 of a page article by Clare Balding 

[TIWIT]

2 hours ago, TheReaper said:

*initial request for up to $150 Mil, as a worst case for not playing at all this year.

Super League received £16 Mil.... So government aid = minor league? Chump change to Sky....

Quite a gap between $150 million and £16 million, even with the exchange rate.

Sky televise SL games. TSN airs CFL games. TSN's parent owns the company that owns the CFL team in the league's worst city. Which is Toronto and no one in Toronto cares about the CFL anymore. They are the secondary tenant in their stadium to a soccer team that outdraws them 2-to-1.

TSN airs CFL games on their national cable network. NFL games are aired over the main FTA CTV/CTV2 networks.

Any way you look at it the CFL is a secondary sport in much of the country where it is perceived as minor league. Which is not to say you can't be a CFL fan and love the game. Many do. But not in the same numbers as before. To pretend the CFL isn't in long-term trouble is about the same as those here who don't think RL is in a similar state.

[RigbyLuger]

There are some disreputable "journalists" who cover this sport, but wouldn't class Davidson as one of them.

[Kayakman]

Holy Cow!   I guy goes off in the Bush for a week and comes back to a whole new scenario.  What is actually going on?

[Omott91]

36 minutes ago, Kayakman said:

Holy Cow!   I guy goes off in the Bush for a week and comes back to a whole new scenario.  What is actually going on?

Nothing too much to worry about. 

[Kayakman]

1 hour ago, Omott91 said:

Nothing too much to worry about. 

Thanks...no worries then!

[tms]

9 hours ago, Kayakman said:

Holy Cow!   I guy goes off in the Bush for a week and comes back to a whole new scenario.  What is actually going on?

to be honest kman with all the  shananagins  supposedly going on at TWP you might have been better off staying there

[Kayakman]

1 hour ago, POR said:

to be honest kman with all the  shananagins  supposedly going on at TWP you might have been better off staying there

I'm going out again in a few days...might be out for awhile this time........depends on the weather.

[silverback]

25 minutes ago, Kayakman said:

I'm going out again in a few days...might be out for awhile this time........depends on the weather.

Save me a leg,

[Kayakman]

5 minutes ago, silverback said:

Save me a leg,

What does that mean?  I break my paddle travels into topo map 'legs'; you looking to come along for a couple of legs?  No Covid where I go.

[Kayakman]

6 minutes ago, SL17 said:

Salmon for me.

Ya, if I can get one....better chance of getting a steelhead...hope I don't have to settle for bass again.

[ATLANTISMAN]

16 hours ago, TIWIT said:

Sorry Jayne, but the CFL is the very definition of minor league. The standard of play isn't very good. Very few players make over $100000. Even a second rate American player makes far more on an NFL taxisquad when they used to come up here to hone their game.

60 years ago the CFL and AFL were more or less competitive. The Grey Cup winner now couldn't beat a good NCAA school.

And in the big Can cities. fans definitely perceive the Argos, Als and Lions as minor league

 

I would totally disagree I have followed CFL for around 20 years and much prefer it to the NFL its far more exciting.

As for minor league I get it that they are struggling in Toronto and BC however even in those 2 markets the average crowds was around 12000 and 18000 last season other teams like Calgary/Edmonton/Rough Riders average 23/25000 and Ottawa have over 20000 season ticket holders.

If thats minor league then we will certainly have some of it LOL:)

 

Paul