Super League ready

[Man of Kent]

1 minute ago, Harry Stottle said:

For all their infrastructure, they will have to go way beyond that - halfway around the world - to amas a squad to compete in SL.

Tell me what are they doing better than say Saints, Wigan and Leeds and those 3 who produce SL player's, all 3 still go to the Antiopodees and Islands to supplement their teams. Stop hiding behind facts being reliant on home grown players they would be an average Championship team.

Straw man argument. We are discussing whether Toulouse are ready for Super League, not whether they are better than Saints, Wigan and Leeds. Nobody does better than them with youth development. Ask Derek Beaumont!

[Harry Stottle]

19 minutes ago, Scubby said:

Yep, I believe since returning to the UK structure they have finished 5, 3, 2, 1 and currently first in the Championship. They also last lost a regular league game (non play off) on July 6th 2019 - that's 24 straight victories. That is a club building for the future.

Straws and grasping Scubby, the first place finish you refer to was in a 5 game season they were one of 3 unbeaten teams, and only played the extra fixture to put them leading at the time because they ducked out of playing the in the Challenge cup.

[Toby Chopra]

34 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

How long have you got?!

Toulouse are essentially Catalans MkII: a mix of French, British and Antipodeans with youth development and a reserve side - they are a club, not just a team.

They also have the advantage of a core of players and a coach who have been there for some time. They have been building towards Super League for years. It's not a flash in the pan, cowboy thing. 

I agree the consistent coaching will make some difference in performance, and the more stable roots of the club hopefully means they'll make wiser off season decisions than TWP did. 

But player for player I don't see any difference in quality between what TO have now and what TWP had in early 2020.

I'd be nervous on betting my survival in SL on Kheirellah, Ford and Gigot. Great talents all, but can they produce at the highest level consistently every week? TO will need to add a proven NRL/SL half among other things to survive. 

[Harry Stottle]

14 minutes ago, Dave T said:

nah, if you are promoting the Grand Finalists either way, then the Grand Final is a bit irrelevant. 

OK, maybe the game does not need to go ahead, but the play offs do to name both the finalists.

[Harry Stottle]

16 minutes ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

Yeah and I was saying that Toronto had far more problems than just poor recruitment, it wasn't just poor recruitment that killed them off, in fact I don't think it was much of a problem at all, I mean when London were in SL and barely won a game they didn't just disappear, Leigh haven't just packed up and liquidated because they haven't been winning any games. Toronto were killed off by a poor business model, administrative problems when it came to travel, a lack of funds (or rather spending money in the wrong places) and ultimately covid. Toulouse aren't gonna have a lot of these problems in SL, that is what I was saying. Recruitment was the least of Toronto's problems. 

Recruitment was the paramount problem at Toronto, they got it all wrong.

[Scubby]

3 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Straws and grasping Scubby, the first place finish you refer to was in a 5 game season they were one of 3 unbeaten teams, and only played the extra fixture to put them leading at the time because they ducked out of playing the in the Challenge cup.

It would be grasping at straws if they hadn't won 11 straight (all forced to be away from home) in 2021 and their last 9 league games on the trot in 2019.

How would the others be doing this year playing after a same day flight from the M62 to the South of France every week? 

[Harry Stottle]

8 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

Straw man argument. We are discussing whether Toulouse are ready for Super League, not whether they are better than Saints, Wigan and Leeds. Nobody does better than them with youth development. Ask Derek Beaumont!

You brought up all the infrastructure they have and it is very good, but I was just pointing out to survive they need to go out and spend- a lot.

Bit of a snide remark about Mr Beaumont, The League has denied Leigh the opportunity to run an academy team, there was £400K made readily available in the first year to finance it but the League said no, couldn't be anything to do with Leigh's close proximity to Wigan, Wire and Saints could it?

[Scubby]

How do Leigh get onto every thread? It's like the old days with Wendall and Warrington.

[Dave T]

10 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

OK, maybe the game does not need to go ahead, but the play offs do to name both the finalists.

I like the suggestion of 1st place gets auto promotion and then the playoff becomes a promotion playoff - not unlike the Football Championship playoffs.

[Harry Stottle]

6 minutes ago, Scubby said:

It would be grasping at straws if they hadn't won 11 straight (all forced to be away from home) in 2021 and their last 9 league games on the trot in 2019.

How would the others be doing this year playing after a same day flight from the M62 to the South of France every week? 

As for the second part not a scobie.

The Ist place you were referring to was 5 wins on the trot in 2020 nothing at all to do with any other time.

[The Hallucinating Goose]

1 minute ago, Scubby said:

How do Leigh get onto every bloody thread? 

Because one of the most argumentative members of this forum is a Leigh fan? 

[Harry Stottle]

2 minutes ago, Scubby said:

How do Leigh get onto every thread? It's like the old days with Wendall and Warrington.

Ask MoK he brought Leigh up.

[gingerjon]

Just now, The Hallucinating Goose said:

Because one of the most argumentative members of this forum is a Leigh fan? 

And, invariably, gets a reply that gets a reply

[Man of Kent]

6 minutes ago, Toby Chopra said:

I agree the consistent coaching will make some difference in performance, and the more stable roots of the club hopefully means they'll make wiser off season decisions than TWP did. 

But player for player I don't see any difference in quality between what TO have now and what TWP had in early 2020.

I'd be nervous on betting my survival in SL on Kheirellah, Ford and Gigot. Great talents all, but can they produce at the highest level consistently every week? TO will need to add a proven NRL/SL half among other things to survive. 

I agree TO need to strengthen but the core squad is probably good enough to survive. As you, say a proven halfback will be needed.

Also, it's not solely down to the player roster looking good on paper. Player for player, the current TO and 2020 TWP sides look stronger on paper than London in 2019 but the Broncos managed to win 10 in 29 games versus 0 in 6 for Toronto.

It's impossible to quantify how many points a stable, well-run club environment is worth compared to, say, a team of 'mercenaries' based out of a college in Rochdale.

[Harry Stottle]

1 minute ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

Because one of the most argumentative members of this forum is a Leigh fan? 

Who would that be Goosey, someone with a different opinion, it may have slipped your notice but this is a debating platform, not a parting each other on the head site.

[The Hallucinating Goose]

1 minute ago, gingerjon said:

And, invariably, gets a reply that gets a reply

You know when I was a kid I was told there is a big difference between discussion and argument, still takes some people a little longer to learn some things doesn't it?

 

 

...British people are the masters of passive aggression..!

[Scubby]

9 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I like the suggestion of 1st place gets auto promotion and then the playoff becomes a promotion playoff - not unlike the Football Championship playoffs.

Makes even more sense if the top placed club can't play a play-off game at home.

[The Hallucinating Goose]

2 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Who would that be Goosey, someone with a different opinion, it may have slipped your notice but this is a debating platform, not a parting each other on the head site.

I wasn't really referring to anyone necessarily Harry, I was merely stating that if threads keep being derailed towards Leigh then it would probably be someone who supports Leigh, and thus has an in depth understanding of that club, that would be doing it. I mean you wouldn't get a Barrow fan say, constantly talking about Leigh, I wouldn't have thought anyway.

I mean earlier at work I was explaining the differences between city proper, urban area and metropolitan area to someone who didn't really understand why there was these differences and how it was relevant to Britain's densely populated urban sprawls, and I was using Hull and the surrounding area as the example because I know this area. I would not have chosen to use, say Liverpool or Manchester because I do not know those areas anywhere near as much. And so a Leigh fan would talk about Leigh over another club wouldn't they? It was just a thought Harry, a point of discussion if you will.

[The Hallucinating Goose]

Just now, The Hallucinating Goose said:

I wasn't really referring to anyone necessarily Harry, I was merely stating that if threads keep being derailed towards Leigh then it would probably be someone who supports Leigh, and thus has an in depth understanding of that club, that would be doing it. I mean you wouldn't get a Barrow fan say, constantly talking about Leigh, I wouldn't have thought anyway.

I mean earlier at work I was explaining the differences between city proper, urban area and metropolitan area to someone who didn't really understand why there was these differences and how it was relevant to Britain's densely populated urban sprawls, and I was using Hull and the surrounding area as the example because I know this area. I would not have chosen to use, say Liverpool or Manchester because I do not know those areas anywhere near as much. And so a Leigh fan would talk about Leigh over another club wouldn't they? It was just a thought Harry, a point of discussion if you will.

Now that's passive aggression..!

[Mumby Magic]

I've been watching Northern/Bulls 35 years. I can categorically say that Toulouse away the last time we played was one of the best RL experiences of my life.

Im glad this thread is hyperthetical as the Bulls are going up.

[Harry Stottle]

5 minutes ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

I wasn't really referring to anyone necessarily Harry, I was merely stating that if threads keep being derailed towards Leigh then it would probably be someone who supports Leigh, and thus has an in depth understanding of that club, that would be doing it. I mean you wouldn't get a Barrow fan say, constantly talking about Leigh, I wouldn't have thought anyway.

I mean earlier at work I was explaining the differences between city proper, urban area and metropolitan area to someone who didn't really understand why there was these differences and how it was relevant to Britain's densely populated urban sprawls, and I was using Hull and the surrounding area as the example because I know this area. I would not have chosen to use, say Liverpool or Manchester because I do not know those areas anywhere near as much. And so a Leigh fan would talk about Leigh over another club wouldn't they? It was just a thought Harry, a point of discussion if you will.

Fair point, and yes Leigh was mentioned, but only because another poster thought it worthwhile to bring it up to have a dig on something he obviously knew nothing about.

[Scubby]

Just now, Mumby Magic said:

I've been watching Northern/Bulls 35 years. I can categorically say that Toulouse away the last time we played was one of the best RL experiences of my life.

Im glad this thread is hyperthetical as the Bulls are going up.

Are the Bulls Subbuteo league ready?

That's my full quota of Odsal jokes for August!

[Harry Stottle]

1 minute ago, Mumby Magic said:

I've been watching Northern/Bulls 35 years. I can categorically say that Toulouse away the last time we played was one of the best RL experiences of my life.

Im glad this thread is hyperthetical as the Bulls are going up.

Via the play off's? At who's expense of the two fancied clubs, Fev or Toulouse.

[Mumby Magic]

Just now, Harry Stottle said:

Via the play off's? At who's expense of the two fancied clubs, Fev or Toulouse.

Darn. Missed this out of my post.

[Hela Wigmen]

I agree about Bradford going up. They’ll be up that A1 for Newcastle away this weekend coming.