New England training range

[Leyther_Matt]

Being advertised as "England Rugby League Lions Range". I'm completely lost now on what branding we're trying to go with. Neither a GB lion, nor the same as on the newish England crest.

 

[gingerjon]

Obviously not genuine Oxen merch as they've missed off the yellow REDUCED NOW stickers.

[Jughead]

It’s that time of the month again for a new England training range, only two more before I go on holiday and seven before Christmas. 

[Tommygilf]

Tbf, its not too bad actually, but its barely a month since the black and cyan range released...

[Tonka]

It doesn't look like the classiest gear, sadly.  The lion logo's a bit of a weird choice given the context.

[EastLondonMike]

Dear god. Standards are so low.

[gingerjon]

Just realised that one of those shirts is the exact same colour combination as Tiny Ginger's compulsory PE kit top at school.

I'm willing to bet that SuperStitch is better quality.

[Dave T]

I don't have any issue with a wide range of training gear. The more choice the better as far as I'm concerned, if I don't like something I won't get it. 

The lion head does come directly from the lion badge, so it is on brand. 

[Jughead]

It’s a horrific business model, so feels like a match made in heaven with England RL. I’d love to see what they sell at full price for a national side that hasn’t played a full international in England since 2018. 

[gingerjon]

3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I don't have any issue with a wide range of training gear. The more choice the better as far as I'm concerned, if I don't like something I won't get it. 

The lion head does come directly from the lion badge, so it is on brand. 

Each new release devalues the brand, such as it is.

And clipping the head off one lion and chopping its arms off isn't so much on brand as letting a drunk have a go on Photoshop and pretending to be happy with the result.

[Leyther_Matt]

Just now, gingerjon said:

Each new release devalues the brand, such as it is.

And clipping the head off one lion and chopping its arms off isn't so much on brand as letting a drunk have a go on Photoshop and pretending to be happy with the result.

That was my line of thinking in the OP. Although @Dave Tis probably correct in that it is taken from the lion on the badge, it isn't immediately obvious, and even then on closer inspection I'm still not 100% convinced that it is identical.

Not sure if lions have arms though tbf Jon. Then again, do fish have fingers?

[gingerjon]

3 minutes ago, Leyther_Matt said:

That was my line of thinking in the OP. Although @Dave Tis probably correct in that it is taken from the lion on the badge, it isn't immediately obvious, and even then on closer inspection I'm still not 100% convinced that it is identical.

Not sure if lions have arms though tbf Jon. Then again, do fish have fingers?

The vet insists that the front limbs of my dog and cat are 'arms' and the rear ones 'legs'. So ...

And, with that, we've put a lot more thought into the England branding and its value than Oxen and the RFL have.

[Chrispmartha]

It's all getting a bit silly now isn't it?

Apart from the fact this is yet another load of tat released by Oxen - which will be reduced in a couple of weeks.

The branding is just bizarre and stupid. There is already a GB Lions in RL and the branding is (apart from being absolutely brilliant) already established, they should be pushing the actual England branding. stuff like this gets me really annoyed to be honest.

What was there last release a black GB shirt released by England RL celebrating a welsh RL player.

 

Our National Teams apparel and kit should be the best of the best, not loads of tossed out at a whim to then be put on sale.

 

Rant over... for now.

 

[DI Keith Fowler]

1 hour ago, Leyther_Matt said:

Being advertised as "England Rugby League Lions Range". I'm completely lost now on what branding we're trying to go with. Neither a GB lion, nor the same as on the newish England crest.

 

They've been using that lion's head on their online adverts for the last year or so. 

I don't think it's an utterly insane idea to use the lion's head provided they make it the badge and be consistent with it, having it on some items but not on others is a terrible strategy.

The lion's head itself I'm fully for adopting, you can't use the GB lion's head because it's associated with that brand but it alludes to it and people in RL generally like the GB lion. Plus it's quite distinct from other English sporting teams most of whom use a shield with three lions in some variety. 

[Dave T]

I do think some of you are over thinking it. It's some clothes that people can buy if they want. 

The England badge has Lions on it, people get the link to Lions with the football and cricket teams also using them. 

They are using the head off the lion that is on the badge. 

I do understand the complaints about quality, although my Hoodie and hat have been very good quality (not sure if made by Oxen themselves). I don't understand complaints about too many t-shirts being released. 

Other sports I follow have more clothes launches than Asos. 

[Chrispmartha]

3 minutes ago, DI Keith Fowler said:

They've been using that lion's head on their online adverts for the last year or so. 

I don't think it's an utterly insane idea to use the lion's head provided they make it the badge and be consistent with it, having it on some items but not on others is a terrible strategy.

The lion's head itself I'm fully for adopting, you can't use the GB lion's head because it's associated with that brand but it alludes to it and people in RL generally like the GB lion. Plus it's quite distinct from other English sporting teams most of whom use a shield with three lions in some variety. 

The problem being Lions in RL has never referred to England always GB, there's also the fact that wether we like it or not there is a bit of a crossover with RU and they have the Lions too, which just as in RL doesn't refer to England.

[wilsontown]

Laughed my head off when I saw this e-mail this morning. At this rate everyone in the squad will be able to wear a different shirt for training.

[Chrispmartha]

Just now, Dave T said:

I do think some of you are over thinking it. It's some clothes that people can buy if they want. 

The England badge has Lions on it, people get the link to Lions with the football and cricket teams also using them. 

They are using the head off the lion that is on the badge. 

I do understand the complaints about quality, although my Hoodie and hat have been very good quality (not sure if made by Oxen themselves). I don't understand complaints about too many t-shirts being released. 

Other sports I follow have more clothes launches than Asos. 

I probably am over thinking it but Branding is what I do, and it does matter.

 

Have a good range yes, don't realise a mishmash of ranges with different branding and more importantly don't devalue everything by having it on sale shortly after releasing it.

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

The problem being Lions in RL has never referred to England always GB, there's also the fact that wether we like it or not there is a bit of a crossover with RU and they have the Lions too, which just as in RL doesn't refer to England.

Of course the lion plays a prominent part for Eng, its on the badge and has been for the vast majority of our history. 

They are not changing the name of the team, they have just named a range of clothes. 

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

I probably am over thinking it but Branding is what I do, and it does matter.

 

Have a good range yes, don't realise a mishmash of ranges with different branding and more importantly don't devalue everything by having it on sale shortly after releasing it.

But they are different things. 

Sales strategy and quality is one thing, but you always tell us that brand is not about logo. 

I have no issue with trying to flood the market and giving consumers choice. I generally find the range of stuff clubs have depressing. 

England has always been really poor on this, you could get a real basic range that could have been designed by any of us as it was just classic, at least there is choice of different stuff now. 

The England FA stuff has a huge range and is a right mish-mash of styles. 

I think we need to be a little less po-faced about merchandise (accepting the point about quality - which I haven't personally witnessed). 

[Chrispmartha]

2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Of course the lion plays a prominent part for Eng, its on the badge and has been for the vast majority of our history. 

They are not changing the name of the team, they have just named a range of clothes. 

I understand that.

When have England RL ever been know as the 'lions' Lions in RL means GB, what's the point of the range and advertising?

 

[Scubby]

2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

But they are different things. 

Sales strategy and quality is one thing, but you always tell us that brand is not about logo. 

I have no issue with trying to flood the market and giving consumers choice. I generally find the range of stuff clubs have depressing. 

England has always been really poor on this, you could get a real basic range that could have been designed by any of us as it was just classic, at least there is choice of different stuff now. 

The England FA stuff has a huge range and is a right mish-mash of styles. 

I think we need to be a little less po-faced about merchandise (accepting the point about quality - which I haven't personally witnessed). 

Do the RFL have any control over this or is it simply - yeah go nuts? It seems a very different approach to the England relationship with Hummel which I believe was the original deal for the WC. Maybe it's a stop gap

[Chrispmartha]

3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

But they are different things. 

Sales strategy and quality is one thing, but you always tell us that brand is not about logo. 

I have no issue with trying to flood the market and giving consumers choice. I generally find the range of stuff clubs have depressing. 

England has always been really poor on this, you could get a real basic range that could have been designed by any of us as it was just classic, at least there is choice of different stuff now. 

The England FA stuff has a huge range and is a right mish-mash of styles. 

I think we need to be a little less po-faced about merchandise (accepting the point about quality - which I haven't personally witnessed). 

Branding is not 'just' about a logo. My issue is about two things Branding and the amount/quality of stuff being peddled.

England Football may well have a huge range and about of styles but I bet they've either got the official England Badge on them or 3 Lions on them as that is well known.

 

[Dave T]

22 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

I understand that.

When have England RL ever been know as the 'lions' Lions in RL means GB, what's the point of the range and advertising?

 

But they aren't calling the team the lions. Its a name for a range of clothes, which tbh goes no further than the email (I can't see mention of it on the shop), and takes its name from the lion head being front and centre. 

When yiu ask who it is aimed at, I think it is quite clear where this can appeal.

Firstly to a segment of RL fans brought uo with GB as the team, their national team has been represented by a lion. Many people still believe England should have just used the GB lion logo (I disagree). 

Secondly, general England sports fans identify the Lion logo with England. 

Thirdly, fans, like me who are not keen on the England logo. This range looks far classier than the pointy shield logo, and would make me far likelier to pick up a training t-shirt or two. 

[Dave T]

26 minutes ago, Scubby said:

Do the RFL have any control over this or is it simply - yeah go nuts? It seems a very different approach to the England relationship with Hummel which I believe was the original deal for the WC. Maybe it's a stop gap

It's clear this is an Oxen approach, we get our weekly rants about Leeds merch on here too. 

I've always been bored by the basic range of kit, polo shirt, training T and a Hoodie. If I go on the site now there are plenty of things that would appeal to me.