Manly players refusing to wear Pride Jersey

[Barley Mow]

8 minutes ago, FearTheVee said:

...I also think that there appear to be a lot of things these players are happpy to gloss over in terms of faith but seemingly they draw the line at being tolerant of homosexuals for whatever reason.

I have not seen anything to suggest that they aren't tolerant of homosexuals.

Indeed if these people are Christians they should be tolerant of everyone despite whatever sin they believe them to be committing.

I don't think it will be a matter of being tolerant (there doesn't seem to be a call to ban gay people from RL for example), it appears to just be that they don't want to be personally associated with promoting a way of life that they consider to be sinful.

There's a difference between being tolerant of something and actively promoting it.

Edited July 25, 2022 by Barley Mow

[FearTheVee]

Just now, Barley Mow said:

I have not seen anything to suggest that they aren't tolerant of homosexuals.

Indeed if these people are Christians they should be tolerant of everyone despite whatever sin they believe them to be committing.

I don't think it will be a matter of being tolerant (there doesn't seem to be a call to ban gay people from RL for example), it appears to just be that they don't want to be personally associated with promoting a way of life that they consider to be sinful.

Well then someone needs to explain to them that there is a difference between promoting tolerance/inclusion and promoting homosexuality.

When anti-racism campaigns are run, it is not the intention of the campaign to convert all white people into ethnic minorities.

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

True, but those groups are, a) still relatively small, and b) being subsumed into wider society with each generation.

You will always get radicals and reactionaries. Its their kids and grandkids who are the ones who decide the future.

No, they are not.

[Loiner]

Good for them, I think people in general are sick to the back teeth of have lgbtq+ constantly rammed down our throats (No pun intended). I've no problem with people living there lives how they want to but don't subject me to it.

[Loiner]

Good for them, I think people in general are sick to the back teeth of have lgbtq+ constantly rammed down our throats (No pun intended). I've no problem with people living there lives how they want to but don't subject me to it.

[Loiner]

Good for them, I think people in general are sick to the back teeth of have lgbtq+ constantly rammed down our throats (No pun intended). I've no problem with people living there lives how they want to but don't subject me to it.

[Loiner]

Good for them, I think people in general are sick to the back teeth of have lgbtq+ constantly rammed down our throats (No pun intended). I've no problem with people living there lives how they want to but don't subject me to it.

[Jughead]

2 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Good for them, I think people in general are sick to the back teeth of have lgbtq+ constantly rammed down our throats (No pun intended). I've no problem with people living there lives how they want to but don't subject me to it.

Ah yes, don’t subject me to people across the planet wanting the same basic human rights as others. 

[Loiner]

Just now, Jughead said:

Ah yes, don’t subject me to people across the planet wanting the same basic human rights as others. 

Where did I say they shouldn't have basic human rights? What about the human rights of the players who don't want to wear the shirt.

[Barley Mow]

3 hours ago, FearTheVee said:

Well then someone needs to explain to them that there is a difference between promoting tolerance/inclusion and promoting homosexuality.

When anti-racism campaigns are run, it is not the intention of the campaign to convert all white people into ethnic minorities.

I don't want to get into speaking for people I don't know and may not share beliefs with, but I imagine that they see promoting pride in a way of life they see as being sinful (rather than just being tolerant of it) as getting too close to promoting sin. But you'd have to ask them.

I'd like to hope that if it was a campaign for 'equal treatment for all', without the rainbow and reference to pride, that they would be happy with it.

As someone said earlier, it's crazy that a call for inclusion leads to this exclusion!

Edited July 25, 2022 by Barley Mow

[David Shepherd]

5 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Good for them, I think people in general are sick to the back teeth of have lgbtq+ constantly rammed down our throats (No pun intended). I've no problem with people living there lives how they want to but don't subject me to it.

Exactly.  Live and let live.

I don't even know why anyone in western democracies protests about LGBT rights anymore. There are no impediments on the lives of LGBT people. They are absolutely equal and rightly so. It's a total non-issue to 99.9% of people. And the 0.01% are the kind of folk that would moan about anything.

[Man of Kent]

More posts in support of the Manly players than not. The tide seems to be turning against the intolerant uniformity of diversity. Good. 

[David Shepherd]

5 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Where did I say they shouldn't have basic human rights? What about the human rights of the players who don't want to wear the shirt.

This is the problem with debates about issues like this. You made a perfectly reasonable point but instead of getting a reasonable response, it was insinuated that you didn't think LGBT people should have the same human rights as everyone else.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Jughead said:

Ah yes, don’t subject me to people across the planet wanting the same basic human rights as others. 

Who is going to force Muslim countries to give the same rights to the LGBT community? Or China for that matter? I'm not in favour of trans rights. Sex and gender are the same thing and you can't change it. Trans women should not compete against biological women. And there are serious questions to be asked about encouraging people to get life changing surgeries which will never deal with the actual issue.

[Jughead]

7 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Where did I say they shouldn't have basic human rights? What about the human rights of the players who don't want to wear the shirt.

If your trying to compare the basic human rights of thousands of gay people across the planet who have suffered and continue to suffer incredible amounts of persecution to some men not wanting to wear a rainbow in a modern country then there is no hope. 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

This is the problem with debates about issues like this. You made a perfectly reasonable point but instead of getting a reasonable response, it was insinuated that you didn't think LGBT people should have the same human rights as everyone else.

That's just the typical response. Insult and close down the debate.

[Manxmanc]

There’s another angle to this. In the UK, in particular, many gays and lesbians have disassociated themselves from Pride, Stonewall and the like, because they believe those organisations to now be homophonic, with a primary focus on transgender and surrogacy issues.

That’s why the LGB Alliance was formed, whose logo is, incidentally plain black and white; their involvement is with sexual orientation only, and not matters of transgender, non-binary etc. And that’s not to mention many women’s groups who believe that transgender issues are a threat to women’s rights.

Whatever, people’s views on this are, Pride is a political lobby group. As such, I don’t see why any of these players should have been stood down.

 

Edited July 25, 2022 by Manxmanc

[Jughead]

7 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

This is the problem with debates about issues like this. You made a perfectly reasonable point but instead of getting a reasonable response, it was insinuated that you didn't think LGBT people should have the same human rights as everyone else.

Which is part of the reason events like Pride and LGBTQ community events exist, to bring attention to such issues across the planet where basic human rights aren’t met because of their feelings. 

Being unable to want basic human rights for everybody doesn’t seem very religious-y to me. 

[Dunbar]

13 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

This is the problem with debates about issues like this. You made a perfectly reasonable point but instead of getting a reasonable response, it was insinuated that you didn't think LGBT people should have the same human rights as everyone else.

I find it ironic that the next post after this one literally said "I'm not in favour of trans rights" and you gave it a like.

[David Shepherd]

2 minutes ago, Jughead said:

Which is part of the reason events like Pride and LGBTQ community events exist, to bring attention to such issues across the planet where basic human rights aren’t met because of their feelings. 

Being unable to want basic human rights for everybody doesn’t seem very religious-y to me. 

Have you ever been on a Pride march?

They are 80% straight people virtue signaling and having a day on the ale, 19% Gay people celebrating their community and 1% brain impaired revolutionaries that think being anything other than trans means you're sub-human.

Me and my daughter hated it, we'll never go on another.

At no point did Loiner ever suggest that LGBT people should not have the same human rights as everyone else.

I'm not religious at all, in fact I struggle to believe that anyone is.  However, billions of people around the world are and their views must be respected. 

 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I find it ironic that the next post after this one literally said "I'm not in favour of trans rights" and you gave it a like.

And this just proves none of you are willing to have an honest conversation about this issue. Just shut it all down and silence people. The modern left for you.

[David Shepherd]

4 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I find it ironic that the next post after this one literally said "I'm not in favour of trans rights" and you gave it a like.

He was expressing a view that he is entitled to. I like on the basis that he had the courage to stand up and share it in the knowledge that the correct thinkers would be along to shoot him down.

I'm torn on the issue myself, although I'm struggling to see what "rights" trans people are lacking in this country.

[Dunbar]

Just now, NW10LDN said:

And this just proves none of you are willing to have an honest conversation about this issue. Just shut it all down and silence people. The modern left for you.

Just pointing out the irony.

If you look back on these boards the you will see that I supported the decision of various sports bodies to 'ban' trans women from competing on women's sports... although I feel very strongly that this decision to exclude people should be mitigated by ensuring we welcome them to the sport in other ways.

As for political labels.  No thanks, I will make my own mind up on each issue in hand without camping out on one side or another.

[The storm]

36 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Good for them, I think people in general are sick to the back teeth of have lgbtq+ constantly rammed down our throats (No pun intended). I've no problem with people living there lives how they want to but don't subject me to it.

I sort of agree with you, 

I think people should live their lives as they want as long as beliefs are not imposed on others. 

I welcome diversity. 

 

[The storm]

25 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

This is the problem with debates about issues like this. You made a perfectly reasonable point but instead of getting a reasonable response, it was insinuated that you didn't think LGBT people should have the same human rights as everyone else.

There was zero insinuation of that