IMG - Vote on Wednesday

[Tommygilf]

Just now, Tubby said:

I’d be interested to see your breakdown of running a semi professional club on £25k

That isn't to run it, that is the central funding allocation. My examples are all 11 League 1 clubs this year. 

[Tubby]

Just now, Tommygilf said:

That isn't to run it, that is the central funding allocation. My examples are all 11 League 1 clubs this year. 

And would you describe them as thriving?

[Tubby]

Either way, what we think is irrelevant. We’ll see what IMG suggest and whether the clubs agree to it. 

[Tommygilf]

Just now, Tubby said:

And would you describe them as thriving?

For 3rd division clubs, yeah pretty good actually. Some very promising signs. 

They could have much more if some Championship clubs didn't insist on £300k plus so they can play at being Full timers.

[Tubby]

1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

For 3rd division clubs, yeah pretty good actually. Some very promising signs. 

They could have much more if some Championship clubs didn't insist on £300k plus so they can play at being Full timers.

Wonderfully disparaging. 

I think the fact is, fans of SL clubs generally believe they should keep 95% of any income and fans of clubs outside SL don’t. With one or two possible exceptions. This is unlikely to change. 
 

[Tommygilf]

1 minute ago, Tubby said:

Wonderfully disparaging. 

I think the fact is, fans of SL clubs generally believe they should keep 95% of any income and fans of clubs outside SL don’t. With one or two possible exceptions. This is unlikely to change. 
 

I think its interesting that some part time clubs can operate as part timers, yet others need more central funding (more than 10x) to play at being full timers.

And the Championship clubs believe they should keep 95% of the funding they're getting, for no apparent reason really. Completely under the auspices of the RFL.

We've had NRL recruits coming into Championship teams already on significant 6 figure central funding levels. Is that really necessary? Is it the best use of funds to "look after the whole game"?

Whilstsoever millions are still being diverted into the Championship and League 1 centrally, you won't get much sympathy from Super League whilst they are dealing with their lowest TV deal in a while.

[Tubby]

1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

I think its interesting that some part time clubs can operate as part timers, yet others need more central funding (more than 10x) to play at being full timers.

And the Championship clubs believe they should keep 95% of the funding they're getting, for no apparent reason really. Completely under the auspices of the RFL.

We've had NRL recruits coming into Championship teams already on significant 6 figure central funding levels. Is that really necessary? Is it the best use of funds to "look after the whole game"?

Whilstsoever millions are still being diverted into the Championship and League 1 centrally, you won't get much sympathy from Super League whilst they are dealing with their lowest TV deal in a while.

Clubs will and should be ambitious and will try to achieve the best they can with the income they have. Much the same across the leagues, some clubs generate more income and achieve more. 

I’m always interested to hear how people are privy to the wages of individual players, but I assume you’re alluding to Leigh, where their owner has made no secret of his personal investment. 

Your also stating that the championship clubs have no right to central funding. Them and us again. 

 

[Griff]

2 hours ago, Roughyed Rats said:

They should keep it all then and good luck to them

Perhaps the remaining clubs should set up their own competition, possibly even go back to winter rugby to try and make ends meet?

[sigh]

[Tommygilf]

1 minute ago, Tubby said:

Clubs will and should be ambitious and will try to achieve the best they can with the income they have. Much the same across the leagues, some clubs generate more income and achieve more. 

I’m always interested to hear how people are privy to the wages of individual players, but I assume you’re alluding to Leigh, where their owner has made no secret of his personal investment. 

Your also stating that the championship clubs have no right to central funding. Them and us again. 

 

I'm not saying they shouldn't have central funding. I'm saying that whilst they seem to be concentrating the quite large allocation of funding they are getting, which again is almost entirely drawn from the Super League TV Deal, in barely a handful of top clubs pockets, then its not a great place to start complaining about "unfairness". 

If every Championship (and League 1) club was given the same amount of money of the allocation now, and there was still a crisis at several clubs, then it could be fair to start thinking Super League might need to be more generous. As it stands that is neither the case currently, nor looks likely.

Super League are supporting the lower divisions. The Championship and RFL are happy to say League 1 clubs warrant £25k per annum. Super League should not be funding the championship to be full time or anything like, especially if the Super League TV deal is down as it has been.

[Tubby]

2 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

I'm not saying they shouldn't have central funding. I'm saying that whilst they seem to be concentrating the quite large allocation of funding they are getting, which again is almost entirely drawn from the Super League TV Deal, in barely a handful of top clubs pockets, then its not a great place to start complaining about "unfairness". 

If every Championship (and League 1) club was given the same amount of money of the allocation now, and there was still a crisis at several clubs, then it could be fair to start thinking Super League might need to be more generous. As it stands that is neither the case currently, nor looks likely.

Super League are supporting the lower divisions. The Championship and RFL are happy to say League 1 clubs warrant £25k per annum. Super League should not be funding the championship to be full time or anything like, especially if the Super League TV deal is down as it has been.

I personally don’t see CF as charity, it is RFL income and should be distributed accordingly. 

I’m aware that Championship funding used to be based on league position, but I will admit that I thought this was no longer the case, and I agree entirely that it should be distributed equitably. All Championship clubs should receive the same allocation. A cash prize for the finalists maybe makes sense, but I’m open to either option. 

Perhaps we’re not so far apart in our thinking, but I also think that the lower leagues support SL by being a part of the sport, increasing interest, nurturing and producing players. 

[Tubby]

Just now, ShropshireBull said:

But giving the club money and falling by wayside are different. Any extra cash in future has to go to infrastructure of target teams. It sounds like picking winners but I am not fussed. Sport badly needs a 3k ground for oldham and to regrow in manchester. That means not sharing equally.

This is an entirely different discussion as far as I am concerned. Equal funding is the way I see it, although obviously at different levels depending on the division you’re in, but what you’re talking about I see as grants/loans to match a clubs own funding for such things. But first, IMG need to find a way to increase income. 

Anyway, I’m off to try to work out how to get The Sportsman on my TV, so I can watch Swinton and Doncaster. 
 

[nadera78]

49 minutes ago, Tubby said:

It’s a pointless argument, but we need to do enough to keep working whilst at the same time providing for our ‘family’.

But this always becomes ‘us and them’, when we used to be (and need to be) all ‘us’. 

RL is it one sport and whilst we need to make sure we provide a saleable product, we also need to keep a viable structure alive to provide the materials for that product. 
 

Absolutely 100% agree. That's why we should take the money we give to a handful of Championship clubs so they pretend to be full-time operations and instead give it to the community clubs. All of us, indeed.

[Tommygilf]

4 minutes ago, Tubby said:

I personally don’t see CF as charity, it is RFL income and should be distributed accordingly. 

I’m aware that Championship funding used to be based on league position, but I will admit that I thought this was no longer the case, and I agree entirely that it should be distributed equitably. All Championship clubs should receive the same allocation. A cash prize for the finalists maybe makes sense, but I’m open to either option. 

Perhaps we’re not so far apart in our thinking, but I also think that the lower leagues support SL by being a part of the sport, increasing interest, nurturing and producing players. 

I agree it seems we aren't far away at all. 

Hopefully IMGs involvement will raise the standards of clubs and Leagues across the board and raise incomes on the back of that.

[Harry Stottle]

On 30/09/2022 at 11:43, Tommygilf said:

Not thinking about Leeds fans getting the last train home*, but whatever they need of course.

*halfway through the second half!

But away fans don't matter do they Tommy?

[Harry Stottle]

On 30/09/2022 at 17:42, Hemi4561 said:

Let's not hold our  breath for an answer. It would not surprise me if Jughead supports his own club to the death (of others), and has little interest in the wider community of the Championship and L1. 

 

That is very true, look at the threads for the Championship and L1 finals, not many of the fans of SL clubs have seemingly much interest.

[Stuff Smith]

18 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

That is very true, look at the threads for the Championship and L1 finals, not many of the fans of SL clubs have seemingly much interest.

To be fair Harry, most people see the Championship final as a foregone conclusion. Not just SL fans.

[Stuff Smith]

On 30/09/2022 at 17:42, Hemi4561 said:

Let's not hold our  breath for an answer. It would not surprise me if Jughead supports his own club to the death (of others), and has little interest in the wider community of the Championship and L1. 

 

Saw this quoted in Harry's post. The phrase, "supports his own club to the death (of others)". Love it.

If he did think like that, it would hardly make him unique: it's the way most supporters of any team in any sport think.

(Not me though. Or, at least, I hope not.)

 

Edited October 2, 2022 by Stuff Smith

[Tommygilf]

1 hour ago, Harry Stottle said:

But away fans don't matter do they Tommy?

They don't in football, having 3000 Leeds fans there is costing Liverpool hand over fist on every ticket.

[Derwent Parker]

4 hours ago, GeordieSaint said:

Do your kids have the ability to go make money and sell their product themselves? 

probably in the future, but not if you leave them to starve now.

[bobbruce]

29 minutes ago, Derwent Parker said:

probably in the future, but not if you leave them to starve now.

The only reason they’d be starving is a couple of fat kids in the family are eating all the food. 

[Wakefield Ram]

23 hours ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

Again, you do realise why Sky pay this money don't you? 

You seem to be of the impression it's free money that should be distributed equally amongst all member clubs. 

May I suggest you go watch the amateur leagues if the distribution of money to pay players upsets you? Professional sport clearly isn't for you.

Super League wouldn't exist without junior rugby, amateur rugby, Championship and League One for both players and officials. Unless there's any players in SL who only took the game up at 18 in a SL Academy.

[Tommygilf]

4 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

The only reason they’d be starving is a couple of fat kids in the family are eating all the food. 

Exactly, even now there is lots of money going into the Championship and League 1, its not Super League's fault they are rubbish at divvying it up fairly.

[Tommygilf]

1 minute ago, Wakefield Ram said:

Super League wouldn't exist without junior rugby, amateur rugby, Championship and League One for both players and officials. Unless there's any players in SL who only took the game up at 18 in a SL Academy.

Ahh the classic conflate professional teams outside of super league with amateur and junior rugby move...

To tell the truth, Super League would, like the NRL, probably run strong reserve/farm teams in the absence of the Championship and League 1, many of whom would take the form of clubs currently in those two leagues anyway.

[bobbruce]

2 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Exactly, even now there is lots of money going into the Championship and League 1, its not Super League's fault they are rubbish at divvying it up fairly.

I can’t get the figure but I’m sure I read over £5m to the RFL and lower leagues. 

[Tubby]

1 minute ago, bobbruce said:

I can’t get the figure but I’m sure I read over £5m to the RFL and lower leagues. 

I Know Ken Davy said that was agreed, but I can’t find anywhere that confirms how it was used. That was the figure that was being allocated to the RFL as a governing body. 

I thought the allocation being based on league positions wasn’t the case now.