What's happening at 'Haven?

[Anita Bath]

2 hours ago, Neutralfan7 said:

I don't think that is the case. I'm lead to believe it was only a cash flow problem during the off season due to paying off outstanding debt/bills and not getting support to events to provide funds. They'll be fine come season time.

Maybe need better events than an Elton John tribute act though

Hope thats the case….always a great day out.

But dont risk the drop….league 1 down to 9 homes games and for afair few of those few if any away fans.

[Tommygilf]

9 hours ago, LeeF said:

Cumbria isn’t strong from an RL perspective. Numbers of players, teams and clubs are reducing. The number of regular spectators are falling

That is happening everywhere, so relatively, it is as strong as it ever has been in the past 40/50 years.

How RL fans in Cumbria are interacting with the game is changing. Poor semi pro sides playing out of poor facilities against teams that are going to whollop you and/or are full of no marks anyway might not be what the RL fans in the general populace want. If they had a decent ground up there, I could see Wigan taking a home game there during the summer pitch relaying and getting 10x the average crowds of Workington and Whitehaven. By all reports, attendances at amateur clubs are more than healthy.

[Tommygilf]

11 hours ago, Griff said:

Every club would say that.

Exactly. You can't guarantee that, indeed you're more likely to lose, so you are better off controlling the controllables to make sure attendees have a good time. Barrow do this excellently, as do Batley.

[Hemi4561]

28 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

That is happening everywhere, so relatively, it is as strong as it ever has been in the past 40/50 years.

How RL fans in Cumbria are interacting with the game is changing. Poor semi pro sides playing out of poor facilities against teams that are going to whollop you and/or are full of no marks anyway might not be what the RL fans in the general populace want. If they had a decent ground up there, I could see Wigan taking a home game there during the summer pitch relaying and getting 10x the average crowds of Workington and Whitehaven. By all reports, attendances at amateur clubs are more than healthy.

I take it you are going to pull your boots on and replace one of the "no marks". 

[GUBRATS]

39 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Exactly. You can't guarantee that, indeed you're more likely to lose, so you are better off controlling the controllables to make sure attendees have a good time. Barrow do this excellently, as do Batley.

Explain how you are more likely to lose than win ?

[Davo5]

33 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

That is happening everywhere, so relatively, it is as strong as it ever has been in the past 40/50 years.

How RL fans in Cumbria are interacting with the game is changing. Poor semi pro sides playing out of poor facilities against teams that are going to whollop you and/or are full of no marks anyway might not be what the RL fans in the general populace want. If they had a decent ground up there, I could see Wigan taking a home game there during the summer pitch relaying and getting 10x the average crowds of Workington and Whitehaven. By all reports, attendances at amateur clubs are more than healthy.

It really isn’t.

Attendances are healthy at NCLderby games & two or three

occasionally get crowds in three figures for other games but the amateur game outside a handful of clubs is in a poor state.

Wigan getting a 9-10k crowd in West Cumbria would require them to a huge contingent of their own fans.

[Mr Frisky]

1 hour ago, Tommygilf said:

That is happening everywhere, so relatively, it is as strong as it ever has been in the past 40/50 years.

How RL fans in Cumbria are interacting with the game is changing. Poor semi pro sides playing out of poor facilities against teams that are going to whollop you and/or are full of no marks anyway might not be what the RL fans in the general populace want. If they had a decent ground up there, I could see Wigan taking a home game there during the summer pitch relaying and getting 10x the average crowds of Workington and Whitehaven. By all reports, attendances at amateur clubs are more than healthy.

To be fair, most West Cumbrians who support Town and Haven also tend to support Saints or Leeds in the SL rather than Wigan - if Wigan played in Cumbria they could maybe be a curtain raiser for the West Cumbria Derby match - as long as they didn't mess up the pitch and their fans bought XLs Cheese Crisps and Taty Pot rather than Pies at half time.

If they can agree to that then ok - we will let them play

[Tommygilf]

7 hours ago, GUBRATS said:

Explain how you are more likely to lose than win ?

Last year alone showed that more than half the league lost more games than they won.  If you've already admitted you've got an underfunded team those odds are going to be worse.

[Tommygilf]

7 hours ago, Hemi4561 said:

I take it you are going to pull your boots on and replace one of the "no marks". 

It quite literally wouldn't make a difference if I did, which is rather the point. 

If the amateur game and the semi pro game look too similar, people are going to ask what is the point of the latter?

[Tommygilf]

7 hours ago, Davo5 said:

It really isn’t.

Attendances are healthy at NCLderby games & two or three

occasionally get crowds in three figures for other games but the amateur game outside a handful of clubs is in a poor state.

Wigan getting a 9-10k crowd in West Cumbria would require them to a huge contingent of their own fans.

That's more than NCL games elsewhere come close to.

That descriptor could be used for the amateur game across the country, Cumbria is relatively no worse off than it historically has been.

Wigan almost certainly would, it was just a hypothetical. The same could be said for Leeds or Saints but they have less incentive. Regardless, its crucially missing the modern stadium bit.

[Phil W]

Lots of differing views on this.

Firstly hope everything works out for Whitehaven and rugby league in West Cumbria in general.

I'm hoping that between IMG and The RFL they will have strategies for each represented area in the top three leagues to help clubs along the way a bit. I think grading helps a bit so clubs can understand where they are and what they need to do to get a higher grading.

But there also needs to be a lot of public consultation beyond the current rugby league fan base to understand why people don't attend matches. Here we've had cost of living and facilities as a couple of examples. But in my mind initially around the existing clubs from Cornwall to Newcastle there's a lot of market research to do!

[Davo5]

2 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

That's more than NCL games elsewhere come close to.

That descriptor could be used for the amateur game across the country, Cumbria is relatively no worse off than it historically has been.

Wigan almost certainly would, it was just a hypothetical. The same could be said for Leeds or Saints but they have less incentive. Regardless, its crucially missing the modern stadium bit.

So Cumbria is relatively (what does that even mean) no worse off than it’s ever been because 3 amateur clubs can attract a crowd for a Derby game,I think you need to research the history of RL in this county or even make a visit & ask the people involved in the game up here about its “relative” health.

[Tommygilf]

Just now, Davo5 said:

So Cumbria is relatively (what does that even mean) no worse off than it’s ever been because 3 amateur clubs can attract a crowd for a Derby game,I think you need to research the history of RL in this county or even make a visit & ask the people involved in the game up here about its “relative” health.

Saying the amateur game outside a handful of clubs is in a poor state could apply to literally any area where RL is played currently. Cumbria isn’t unique in this.

[Davo5]

15 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Saying the amateur game outside a handful of clubs is in a poor state could apply to literally any area where RL is played currently. Cumbria isn’t unique in this.

But it’s not just the amateur game in which the West Cumbria league is down to 1 division with half of its clubs failing to finish last season that’s on it knees in Cumbria.

[Tommygilf]

Just now, Davo5 said:

But it’s not just the amateur game in which the West Cumbria league is down to 1 division with half of its clubs failing to finish last season that’s on it knees in Cumbria.

Again, have you seen the rest of Rugby League in this country?

[Davo5]

Just now, Tommygilf said:

Again, have you seen the rest of Rugby League in this country?

Yes but I’m guessing you haven’t any knowledge of the game & it’s problems in this county.

[Tommygilf]

1 minute ago, Davo5 said:

Yes but I’m guessing you haven’t any knowledge of the game & it’s problems in this county.

Ah that is how you want to go with this? Lets leave it there then.

[Davo5]

3 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Ah that is how you want to go with this? Lets leave it there then.

So a no then,yeah let’s.

[steve oates]

1 hour ago, Davo5 said:

Yes but I’m guessing you haven’t any knowledge of the game & it’s problems in this county.

The game on the Cumbria coast was born out of the coastal industries, mining and steelworks.  Firstly that has all gone and secondly the demographic has changed from families to many retirees who can't afford to retire to the lakes so they retire to the Cumbrian coast.

Places like Oldham and Rochdale are literally 10 times bigger than Workington and Whitehaven yet Rugby League struggles there, where travel to games is easy thanks to the M62.  That there is still Amateur and Junior RL in the county of Cumbria is impressive, but it is continuing to shrink. It maybe a matter of time before that disappears.

Union retains a significant foothold in Cumbria, especially in Whitehaven and Workington so I would guess this creates a further and significant pressure for the survival of our game there.  I seem to remember the idea Workington and Whitehaven were encouraged to merge some years back, that they held onto tradition, probably stopped them from  collapse then. 

You have this right Davo......

[Mr Frisky]

7 minutes ago, steve oates said:

The game on the Cumbria coast was born out of the coastal industries, mining and steelworks.  Firstly that has all gone and secondly the demographic has changed from families to many retirees who can't afford to retire to the lakes so they retire to the Cumbrian coast.

Places like Oldham and Rochdale are literally 10 times bigger than Workington and Whitehaven yet Rugby League struggles there, where travel to games is easy thanks to the M62.  That there is still Amateur and Junior RL in the county of Cumbria is impressive, but it is continuing to shrink. It maybe a matter of time before that disappears.

Union retains a significant foothold in Cumbria, especially in Whitehaven and Workington so I would guess this creates a further and significant pressure for the survival of our game there.  I seem to remember the idea Workington and Whitehaven were encouraged to merge some years back, that they held onto tradition, probably stopped them from  collapse then. 

You have this right Davo......

Think you will find the old British Steel (steelworks) engineering site is still there and employing 100s in the steelwork industry and the new West Cumbria coal mine is approved- so West Cumbria still has a steel industry and a mining industry. 

[steve oates]

7 minutes ago, Mr Frisky said:

Think you will find the old British Steel (steelworks) engineering site is still there and employing 100s in the steelwork industry and the new West Cumbria coal mine is approved- so West Cumbria still has a steel industry and a mining industry. 

Thanks for the correction on the steelworks. However the Mine is still strongly opposed. 

Despite the steelworks RL has declined significantly anyway. Do you believe a modern day mine (which may not be as labour intensive as the old mines) if opened will somehow get people playing Rugby League again in Cumbria??

[steve oates]

12 hours ago, Davo5 said:

It really isn’t. Attendances are healthy at NCL derby games & two or three occasionally get crowds in three figures for other games but the amateur game outside a handful of clubs is in a poor state.

Even with a steel industry still in place (but probably far less labour intensive) and 500 coal miners on the Horizon?

I'm  still with you!!

[Griff]

4 hours ago, Davo5 said:

So Cumbria is relatively (what does that even mean) no worse off than it’s ever been because 3 amateur clubs can attract a crowd for a Derby game,I think you need to research the history of RL in this county or even make a visit & ask the people involved in the game up here about its “relative” health.

If he did research it, what would he find?

Or is it a secret?

[Davo5]

1 hour ago, steve oates said:

The game on the Cumbria coast was born out of the coastal industries, mining and steelworks.  Firstly that has all gone and secondly the demographic has changed from families to many retirees who can't afford to retire to the lakes so they retire to the Cumbrian coast.

Places like Oldham and Rochdale are literally 10 times bigger than Workington and Whitehaven yet Rugby League struggles there, where travel to games is easy thanks to the M62.  That there is still Amateur and Junior RL in the county of Cumbria is impressive, but it is continuing to shrink. It maybe a matter of time before that disappears.

Union retains a significant foothold in Cumbria, especially in Whitehaven and Workington so I would guess this creates a further and significant pressure for the survival of our game there.  I seem to remember the idea Workington and Whitehaven were encouraged to merge some years back, that they held onto tradition, probably stopped them from  collapse then. 

You have this right Davo......

Union in WestCumbria is in a bigger mess than RLwith only a handful of teams & virtually no youth sides,even the once powerful Aspatria & Wigton up the road are a shadow of the clubs they were.

[Davo5]

1 hour ago, steve oates said:

Even with a steel industry still in place (but probably far less labour intensive) and 500 coal miners on the Horizon?

I'm  still with you!!

Yeah,we have no steel industry,I’m not even sure Mr Confused even lives in the area.