Championship Meeting #2

[Harry Stottle]

Not read through this thread as it seems we are engaging in some differing points of view.

Q. As anything been resolved, do we know what is happening with L1 and the Championship next year?

Edited October 24, 2023 by Harry Stottle

[sheddingswasus]

16 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Not read through this thread as it seems we are engaging in some differing points of view.

Q. As anything been resolved, do we know what is happening with L1 and the Championship next year?

Harry, the meeting is tomorrow to resolve this.

[Griff]

1 hour ago, sheddingswasus said:

Under the IMG proposals every club will have to have a foundation set up, which is a charity. This is to develop the game. As it is a charity it is eligible for grants. The RFL.can match fund grants raised, as well as local authorities who can access funds for this purpose. Other fund raising can be matched as well. 

I'm surprised they don't already.

[Rovers13]

4 minutes ago, paul hicks said:

worked for most of the season for fev

For me that’s not entirely true we had the best team In the league as table never lies for me, but to say it worked I’d say it didn’t because we didn’t reach our goal. I’ve never been a fan of hybrid squads myself I just don’t think they work. You have guys turning up on silly money then you have guys turning up on peanuts after a 12 hour shift doesn’t work for me. 

Edited October 24, 2023 by Rovers13

[paul hicks]

20 minutes ago, Griff said:

I'm surprised they don't already.

a lot of clubs already have them. indeed, i can think of one club that's got a successful one that brings in close to a million quid a year. with of course the provision that it is spend on work in the community and not on propping up the club. thus, enabling a large reach into the community clubs and youth development as well as schools. also, it provides none rugby events such as dementia groups and refugee outreach among other things

[Rovers13]

The meeting is about the game, but it won’t be it will be about what’s best for each individual club, champ clubs won’t want the 8 in champ and the league 1 clubs will want to be in the champ, to blame anyone is silly as their all in it for themselves imo. 

[paul hicks]

7 minutes ago, Rovers13 said:

For me that’s not entirely true we had the best team In the league as table never lies for me, but to say it worked I’d say it didn’t because we didn’t reach our goal. I’ve never been a fan of hybrid squads myself I just don’t think they work. You have guys turning up on silly money then you have guys turning up on peanuts after a 12 hour shift doesn’t work for me. 

fair enough. for me it sems a good thing. think of the guy who wants to have a job outside of rugby that may well be skilled and pays well and will last a lot longer than the average rugby 10 year or so playing pro rugby.  I'm not saying all players have to be pro or all part time but that element of flexibility can bring in some good players who want to also look far into there life after rugby and have a good job well paid until they retire. the productive years for progression in work is often the early 20s to 35 according to research .

[Rovers13]

1 minute ago, paul hicks said:

fair enough. for me it sems a good thing. think of the guy who wants to have a job outside of rugby that may well be skilled and pays well and will last a lot longer than the average rugby 10 year or so playing pro rugby.  I'm not saying all players have to be pro or all part time but that element of flexibility can bring in some good players who want to also look far into there life after rugby and have a good job well paid until they retire. the productive years for progression in work is often the early 20s to 35 according to research .

I agree just depends which way you look at it tbh, as I’m guessing hybrid squads will pay best PT wages too, so swings and roundabouts I guess, it’s my personal preference I don’t like it because say x is on 100k a season and y is on 30k a season y could think he’s not putting it in why should I etc, not saying that happens but it is human nature tbf. 

[Blind side johnny]

Back on topic for me, I hope.

Tomorrow's meeting is specifically to decide what should happen in 2024, not any hypothetical discussions of future structures. The latter is certainly in the interests of the game but simply cannot be introduced or imposed for 2024.

Some may regard this as a quick fix, I see it as pragmatism: if you can't sole the short-term problem there may not be a long-term for some clubs.

[Rovers13]

Just now, Blind side johnny said:

Back on topic for me, I hope.

Tomorrow's meeting is specifically to decide what should happen in 2024, not any hypothetical discussions of future structures. The latter is certainly in the interests of the game but simply cannot be introduced or imposed for 2024.

Some may regard this as a quick fix, I see it as pragmatism: if you can't sole the short-term problem there may not be a long-term for some clubs.

A decision either way jonny imo as to be made tomorrow as teams can’t plan for future etc, the longer this goes on the longer teams are in limbo. 

[paulwalker71]

12 hours ago, Rovers13 said:

No that’s me not standing for your holier than thou snide comments yet you were in wrong as you quoted me, so for me you can take your snide comments and shove em somewhere it might hurt. You try to belittle folk I’ve seen you before but you’ve picked wrong one this time. If you can’t be civil don’t quote my posts again. 

This is why these threads keep getting locked.

[paul hicks]

41 minutes ago, Rovers13 said:

I agree just depends which way you look at it tbh, as I’m guessing hybrid squads will pay best PT wages too, so swings and roundabouts I guess, it’s my personal preference I don’t like it because say x is on 100k a season and y is on 30k a season y could think he’s not putting it in why should I etc, not saying that happens but it is human nature tbf. 

from what i know of the game no player says that. i know im an old sod but at whatever level i played and watched i always saw player putting in what they had. if not, the coach would drop them.

having said that i suppose times and attitudes change but i would hope not by much

[Colin James]

2 hours ago, Blind side johnny said:

Back on topic for me, I hope.

Tomorrow's meeting is specifically to decide what should happen in 2024, not any hypothetical discussions of future structures. The latter is certainly in the interests of the game but simply cannot be introduced or imposed for 2024.

Some may regard this as a quick fix, I see it as pragmatism: if you can't sole the short-term problem there may not be a long-term for some clubs.

They need to decide 2025 now also. Clubs need to start the season knowing what they are playing for. If finishing places in 2024 will have no relevance to what happens in 2025 clubs may as well slash their playing budgets now.

Edited October 24, 2023 by Colin James

[Rovers13]

19 minutes ago, paulwalker71 said:

This is why these threads keep getting locked.

I speak my mind always have, if I’m in wrong I hold my hands up but I wont take no one’s s h I t e. If he can’t be civil he deserves all he gets. 

Edited October 24, 2023 by Rovers13

[Dovster]

1 hour ago, Rovers13 said:

The meeting is about the game, but it won’t be it will be about what’s best for each individual club, champ clubs won’t want the 8 in champ and the league 1 clubs will want to be in the champ, to blame anyone is silly as their all in it for themselves imo. 

And if this attitude is allowed to prevail, it will surely mean we will loose more clubs and the game will get smaller and smaller. An 8 team league with £15k each CF is not practicle.

For once we need strong leadership who can persaude, influence and argue for what is right. I'm not holding my breath.

[SUPERSTUD]

12 hours ago, paul hicks said:

so, if as you say fev had a lot of part time players what did happen as i presume that would be a blueprint for it

The full time players worked in the community visiting schools etc in conjunction with the Fev Rovers foundation I believe. As previously stated they were also available to complete some training during the day. I can’t name all the full timers but I know that Craig Hall was one of them. The whole squad then came together and trained at 5pm.

[Rovers13]

11 minutes ago, Dovster said:

And if this attitude is allowed to prevail, it will surely mean we will loose more clubs and the game will get smaller and smaller. An 8 team league with £15k each CF is not practicle.

For once we need strong leadership who can persaude, influence and argue for what is right. I'm not holding my breath.

I agree but I’ve seen no strong leadership for 30 years where the governing body takes control so I don’t see it changing now. Clubs shouldn’t get a vote on anything for me no club. Self interest as brought us to where we are now it doesn’t work obviously. 

Edited October 24, 2023 by Rovers13

[Midlands hobo]

15 hours ago, paul hicks said:

or indeed Workington and Whitehaven may do so.  depends what part of the country you're in i suppose as to which is the worse journey

Also any future L1 standard teams looking forwards. I had heard there was another South Wales outfit with aspirations and also pre COVID weren't Devon sharks looking at stepping up?

Whatever decision is made has to leave an ope. Door for new teams and be viable. The south could have had it's own league with teams that have dropped out. 

[sheddingswasus]

2 hours ago, paul hicks said:

from what i know of the game no player says that. i know im an old sod but at whatever level i played and watched i always saw player putting in what they had. if not, the coach would drop them.

having said that i suppose times and attitudes change but i would hope not by much

Please can you and Rovers13 have a separate conversation! This thread is getting hijacked as did the last one. No wonder John Drake s so pee'ed off!

[sheddingswasus]

1 hour ago, Dovster said:

And if this attitude is allowed to prevail, it will surely mean we will loose more clubs and the game will get smaller and smaller. An 8 team league with £15k each CF is not practicle.

For once we need strong leadership who can persaude, influence and argue for what is right. I'm not holding my breath.

If each L1 club only gets £15k the so be it. It certainly isn't enough compared to the Champ funding.

Possibly a bigger issue is the disparity between what clubs in the championship get. Why they should get differing amounts is barmy when clubs in SL & L1 all get the same per club in that league. This means lower clubs in the championship will always be second class to the higher clubs. If finding was equal then this wouldn't be the case.

Edited October 24, 2023 by sheddingswasus

[Dovster]

1 minute ago, sheddingswasus said:

If each L1 club only gets £15k the so be it. It certainly isn't enough compared to the Champ funding.

Possibly a bigger issue is the disparity between what clubs in the championship get. Why they should get differing amounts is barmy when clubs in SL & L1 all get the same per club in that league. This means lower clubs in the championship will always be second class to the higher clubs. If finding was equal then this wouldn't be the case.

I might be wrong but I think the top Championship clubs started to get more CF because the step up from Championship to SL was seen as too great and to help with making the middle eights more competitive. 

I agree that CF should be equal for all teams in the same division with prize money for winning the competition.

[Griff]

4 minutes ago, sheddingswasus said:

If each L1 club only gets £15k the so be it. It certainly isn't enough compared to the Champ funding.

Possibly a bigger issue is the disparity between what clubs in the championship get. Why they should get differing amounts is barmy when clubs in SL & L1 all get the same per club in that league. This means lower clubs in the championship will always be second class to the higher clubs. If finding was equal then this wouldn't be the case.

Yet London won the Championship after finishing 11th last year.

[sheddingswasus]

1 minute ago, Dovster said:

I might be wrong but I think the top Championship clubs started to get more CF because the step up from Championship to SL was seen as too great and to help with making the middle eights more competitive. 

I agree that CF should be equal for all teams in the same division with prize money for winning the competition.

No evening up should be required. Give clubs the same money and let then make it work. That way everyone is on an even playing field.

[sheddingswasus]

2 minutes ago, Griff said:

Yet London won the Championship after finishing 11th last year.

Well done to London, but they should have had equal funding.

[crashmon]

3 hours ago, Blind side johnny said:

Back on topic for me, I hope.

Tomorrow's meeting is specifically to decide what should happen in 2024, not any hypothetical discussions of future structures. The latter is certainly in the interests of the game but simply cannot be introduced or imposed for 2024.

Some may regard this as a quick fix, I see it as pragmatism: if you can't sole the short-term problem there may not be a long-term for some clubs.

100% agree

As the great Terry Prachett once said

"Build a man fire and he will be warm for a night

Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life"

Right now we need to get through the next season and not try to set the game of fire.  Worry about completing 2024 first