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Is there some confusion here about the difference between 'artwork' and 'design'??

Or is it me?

The logo is a bit of artwork, and it's quite nice I think.  Design is a bit more than that, isn't it?  It's surely about function not just appearance?    A Dyson might win an award for design, so might a Henry. 

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14 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

Is there some confusion here about the difference between 'artwork' and 'design'??

Or is it me?

The logo is a bit of artwork, and it's quite nice I think.  Design is a bit more than that, isn't it?  It's surely about function not just appearance?    A Dyson might win an award for design, so might a Henry. 

I think you are getting confused a bit. The logo has been designed, there are many forms of design. Artwork in my industry would be the actual file, i.e ‘can you send me the artwork please’ . The design is the creative choices that lead to the final artwork being created. Now in the olden days the creative designers would hand it over to a dedicated artworker to create but that is getting rarer as we have to be allrounders these days!

I’m not quite getting the vacuum cleaner analogy to be honest.

Edited by Chrispmartha

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22 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

I think you are getting confused a bit. The logo has been designed, there are many forms of design. Artwork in my industry would be the actual file, i.e ‘can you send me the artwork please’ . The design is the creative choices that lead to the final artwork being created. Now in the olden days the creative designers would hand it over to a dedicated artworker to create but that is getting rarer as we have to be allrounders these days!

I’m not quite getting the vacuum cleaner analogy to be honest.

We've been through this before so I'm no even commenting on the first paragraph.

As for the vacuum cleaner I think he means that the functionality of the vacuum cleaner is an essential component of the actual design...they are not mutually exclusive but he might have other ideas...but that is sort of what I think he means.

37 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

Is there some confusion here about the difference between 'artwork' and 'design'??

Or is it me?

The logo is a bit of artwork, and it's quite nice I think.  Design is a bit more than that, isn't it?  It's surely about function not just appearance?    A Dyson might win an award for design, so might a Henry. 

Am I right on this Rupert Prince?

Edited by Kayakman

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10 hours ago, Kayakman said:

We've been through this before so I'm no even commenting on the first paragraph.

As for the vacuum cleaner I think he means that the functionality of the vacuum cleaner is an essential component of the actual design...they are not mutually exclusive but he might have other ideas...but that is sort of what I think he means.

Am I right on this Rupert Prince?

Broadly.  I'm trying to say that whilst for sure someone designed the cover for the cover for the Sgt Pepper album,  "design" is also about function ...  Issigonis designed the Mini. Key parts of that were the sideways engine and the wheels at the far corners. It was not designed from the outset to "look" the way it did.

Of course someone also designed the White Album... put perhaps we are going there into the realms of high art?

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56 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

Broadly.  I'm trying to say that whilst for sure someone designed the cover for the cover for the Sgt Pepper album,  "design" is also about function ...  Issigonis designed the Mini. Key parts of that were the sideways engine and the wheels at the far corners. It was not designed from the outset to "look" the way it did.

Of course someone also designed the White Album... put perhaps we are going there into the realms of high art?

There are many forms of design; product design, industrial design, fashion design, automotive design, etc etc, so again I'm really to sure what you are getting at with the car and hoover analogies, yes they were 'designed' but so are logos. All you seem to be saying is there are many things that are designed, which is obviously true.

Edited by Chrispmartha

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On this logo there is not any mention of the sport.It's as if the sport is ashamed of mentioning rugby league.

If the logo is to adorn the side of the main stand,should it be constructed at the Olympic Legacy Park,it would fail to inform the viewing public which sport it represents.

As the city has a number of diverse sports played there,this logo fails to identify which sport it is.


     No reserves,but resilience,persistence and determination are omnipotent.                       

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Just now, Angelic Cynic said:

On this logo there is not any mention of the sport.It's as if the sport is ashamed of mentioning rugby league.

If the logo is to adorn the side of the main stand,should it be constructed at the Olympic Legacy Park,it would fail to inform the viewing public which sport it represents.

As the city has a number of diverse sports played there,this logo fails to identify which sport it is.

Do you see a reference to the sport on the badges of Manchester United, Barcelona, Real Madrid, Tottenham Hotspur, Arsenal, Everton, Juventus etc?

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57 minutes ago, Oliver Clothesoff said:

Do you see a reference to the sport on the badges of Manchester United, Barcelona, Real Madrid, Tottenham Hotspur, Arsenal, Everton, Juventus etc?

In point of fact, there are footballs on the Man Utd, Barcelona and Spurs badges...

But more importantly, football is on a different planet in terms of profile. Rugby League needs to operate differently to football to help get in to the public consciousness.

Edited by RugbyLeagueGeek
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43 minutes ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

In point of fact, there are footballs on the Man Utd, Barcelona and Spurs badges...

But more importantly, football is on a different planet in terms of profile. Rugby League needs to operate differently to football to help get in to the public consciousness.

 

1 hour ago, Angelic Cynic said:

On this logo there is not any mention of the sport.It's as if the sport is ashamed of mentioning rugby league.

If the logo is to adorn the side of the main stand,should it be constructed at the Olympic Legacy Park,it would fail to inform the viewing public which sport it represents.

As the city has a number of diverse sports played there,this logo fails to identify which sport it is.

I hadnt really noticed it but this is a fair point. I am surprised Rugby league isnt on it somewhere or even RLFC... the old one at least had a ball on it 

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47 minutes ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

In point of fact, there are footballs on the Man Utd, Barcelona and Spurs badges...

But more importantly, football is on a different planet in terms of profile. Rugby League needs to operate differently to football to help get in to the public consciousness.

 

3 minutes ago, RP London said:

 

I hadnt really noticed it but this is a fair point. I am surprised Rugby league isnt on it somewhere or even RLFC... the old one at least had a ball on it 

Leeds Rhinos, Salford Red Devil’s, Catalans, Cas, Hull FC, Warrington, Wigan and Toronto have no reference to Rugby League and Saints are RFC not RLFC. 

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11 minutes ago, Oliver Clothesoff said:

 

Leeds Rhinos, Salford Red Devil’s, Catalans, Cas, Hull FC, Warrington, Wigan and Toronto have no reference to Rugby League and Saints are RFC not RLFC. 

Two points to that -  firstly, some of those teams are the biggest player in their respective towns/cities and the wider public in their region is probably already well aware of who they are. Secondly, maybe some of them should have reference to RL on there to help strengthen their identify. Sheffield Eagles are way down the pecking order of sports teams in their city, so probably need to do something different to what the likes of Wigan have to do.

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2 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

There are many forms of design; product design, industrial design, fashion design, automotive design, etc etc, so again I'm really to sure what you are getting at with the car and hoover analogies, yes they were 'designed' but so are logos. All you seem to be saying is there are many things that are designed, which is obviously true.

That is not what he is saying...that is not his meaning.  You seem to be constrained somehow in your understanding of the meaning he is trying to convey.  This is exactly what happened the last time I tried to  get you to understand....these constraints ultimately  limit artistic freedom and expression....I know, I know...you just don't get it.

Its Okay....its Okay not to know that you don't know.

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1 hour ago, Oliver Clothesoff said:

 

Leeds Rhinos, Salford Red Devil’s, Catalans, Cas, Hull FC, Warrington, Wigan and Toronto have no reference to Rugby League and Saints are RFC not RLFC. 

 

1 hour ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

Two points to that -  firstly, some of those teams are the biggest player in their respective towns/cities and the wider public in their region is probably already well aware of who they are. Secondly, maybe some of them should have reference to RL on there to help strengthen their identify. Sheffield Eagles are way down the pecking order of sports teams in their city, so probably need to do something different to what the likes of Wigan have to do.

I agree with RLG on this that just because one set of clubs dont do it doesnt make that the correct or best way to go, or even a good way to go. For Sheffield I tend to think that reference to Rugby League would be a good idea (under the name) as people in a city that dont know they exist necessarily would be able to put the two together.. 

 

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33 minutes ago, RP London said:

 

I agree with RLG on this that just because one set of clubs dont do it doesnt make that the correct or best way to go, or even a good way to go. For Sheffield I tend to think that reference to Rugby League would be a good idea (under the name) as people in a city that dont know they exist necessarily would be able to put the two together.. 

 

I think, and I stress that I may be far wide of the mark, clubs don’t see themselves as a Football Club or a Rugby League club, they see themselves as brands and organisations and this is reflected in their work within their communities that often isn’t just teaching Rugby League but offering a number of different activities and events to people of all ages. 

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13 minutes ago, Oliver Clothesoff said:

I think, and I stress that I may be far wide of the mark, clubs don’t see themselves as a Football Club or a Rugby League club, they see themselves as brands and organisations and this is reflected in their work within their communities that often isn’t just teaching Rugby League but offering a number of different activities and events to people of all ages. 

I dont think that is true.. 

They may see themselves offering different things to the communities but in the end this is based around the sport that they play... what that sport offers is team work, respect etc etc but the sport is still key to it. You can see that in the work done by the Sheffield Hatters, the Sharks, the Steelers. it is still based around the sport even though they do push it as "keeping your child active" "teaching teamwork" "teaching respect" (all of which i have seen on different things). 

The Sport is hugely important as it is what makes their offering different.

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4 hours ago, RP London said:

 

I hadnt really noticed it but this is a fair point. I am surprised Rugby league isnt on it somewhere or even RLFC... the old one at least had a ball on it 

  Because Sharks are meant to be getting an arena on the same site I checked their website,and it seems all of the Basketball clubs have logos which feature a ball - http://sheffieldsharks.co.uk/


     No reserves,but resilience,persistence and determination are omnipotent.                       

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5 hours ago, Angelic Cynic said:

  Because Sharks are meant to be getting an arena on the same site I checked their website,and it seems all of the Basketball clubs have logos which feature a ball - http://sheffieldsharks.co.uk/

“Arena” is pushing it a bit but yes the site is getting a lot of development. 

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