This is all our fault...

[Jughead]

2 minutes ago, sam4731 said:

My original point was that we have no sway in the international game now. 'Demanding' a test against Samoa just isn't in our hands anymore. It's in the hands of the NRL which just isn't going to be receptive to us.

We’ve played tests every year for years. It’s knee jerk to suggest we have no pull anymore. 

[redjonn]

14 minutes ago, unapologetic pedant said:

You`re jumping to a full set of false conclusions.

The current strength of Samoa and Tonga is the culmination of over half a century of migration patterns. Polynesians in the 1960s settled in areas of Auckland where League was strong, and they naturally gravitated towards inner-city clubs like Richmond and Ponsonby. That trend spread through Auckland and the rest of New Zealand to the point where League is now overwhelmingly Pasifika/Māori.

In the past generation or two, substantial numbers from those communities have relocated to Australia taking advantage of the Trans-Tasman Travel Arrangement which allows for free movement between Oz and NZ. In addition, there`s been some migration to Oz directly from the islands.

All this is why there are so many talented players coming through Aussie and Kiwi junior systems who are qualified to play for Samoa and Tonga. It has nothing to do with "Australia developing the game in the pacific islands".

Let's not have intelligent insights please... we like it simples.. 

We are rubbish, the rfl, the country, the population for not understanding RL is best... etc, etc, moan moan moan

The NH are great at everything

[redjonn]

We could of course go on end of season tour every year, to play Tonga  Samoa  etc...

[Man of Kent]

‘International game is dead’. Turn it in.

England need to play more internationals. Then some more. Then some more again.

[Dunbar]

I think the bottom line is that we were all delighted when Samoa and Tonga came to the fore to challenge the big 3 and add a new and exciting dimension to the world game.  We can't complain too much now that it has scuppered our hopes.

New Zealand lose a World Cup semi by 2 points, we lose by 1 point in extra time.

The top of the international tree delivers great games.

[sam4731]

Just now, Man of Kent said:

‘International game is dead’. Turn it in.

England need to play more internationals. Then some more. Then some more again.

Beating France and Wales 40-0 every year is not a solution. Maybe there is a way we can test ourself out against the best foreigners in Super League...

Getting the SH teams to play us might not be so easy going forward now. What motivation do the NRL have to release their players?

[Griff]

These IMG lads will sort it all out.

[Man of Kent]

6 minutes ago, sam4731 said:

Beating France and Wales 40-0 every year is not a solution. Maybe there is a way we can test ourself out against the best foreigners in Super League...

Getting the SH teams to play us might not be so easy going forward now. What motivation do the NRL have to release their players?

We may have to go there, then, won’t we. Half the team plays club rugby down under anyway.

[Tommygilf]

1 hour ago, Mark S said:

But we let a French team into SL and all they have done is fill the team with Aussie/Kiwi players who most often played like they are on a stag do to Benidorm. 
 

They've won more than most Rugby League clubs have in the past few decades.

[redjonn]

Just now, ShropshireBull said:

And make no money. 

That I don't know... as I was thinking the games in NZ or Aus or both

[Toby Chopra]

This thread is hysterical. 

We lost a match we could have won because key players - most of whom play in the NRL - made bad decisions at crucial moments. 

But the strengths of the Northern and Southern hemispheres are no different than they were yesterday. 

Just breathe. 

[Toby Chopra]

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Edited November 12, 2022 by Toby Chopra

[Toby Chopra]

. 

Edited November 12, 2022 by Toby Chopra

[Toby Chopra]

Multiple posts 

Edited November 12, 2022 by Toby Chopra

[Toby Chopra]

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Edited November 12, 2022 by Toby Chopra

[Bolton Leyther]

1 hour ago, sam4731 said:

Of course you don't just shove in teams in areas where there is no support but getting rugby balls in hands outside of the heartlands would be a start. We need proper youth development in place across the home nations and beyond. Its a long term project but its just not happening.

This is right.

The priority and focus has to be on developing grass roots infrastructure. 

Provide those interested with the opportunity to play, coach, form clubs and leagues and then go from there.

[The Legend]

2 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

The international game isn’t dead it will just be exclusively oceanic cup. Not building Wales or France in last decade is where the fault lies and that’s on the RFL because begging Australia and New Zealand was their only strategy and they have outgrown us.

I don’t see any nation coming up here before World Cup and why should they?

Agree. But not just Wales and France. Scotland and Ireland too. There's only so many players that can represent those nations in Rugby onion. There's room for some to play the greatest code of Rugby

[Stuff Smith]

England should play France.

In France.

Every year.

[Tosh]

2 hours ago, sam4731 said:

I've never been motivated to speak up on here but I feel I have to vent...

We have brought this on ourselves. Australia for years have been developing the game in the pacific Islands for years, not only benefiting those countries but also their own by creating strong competition for places in the NRL, therefore strengthening the kangaroos.

 

What has our attitude been? We've just limited the number of overseas teams in the British system to 2. We sneer at any team outside the M62 corridor, starving them of any support and the game is pretty much non existent in any of the home nations.

For me the international game is probably dead now, we can no longer claim to be on a similar level to Oz and NZ so why should they bother with us?

I personally think the mentality is too ingrained now and there isn't much that we can do to reverse our fortunes.

 

I know I might get slated and there is a strong opposing view but I can't see a way back

Outside of the PNG Hunters and Kaiviti silktails the Aussies haven’t developed anything in the pacific.

Although this could all change now with Samoa reaching the final and although highly unlikely even winning the final might see the ridiculous calls for a “pacific” team based in New Zealand entering the NRL grow even louder.

[Tosh]

1 minute ago, Stuff Smith said:

England should play France.

In France.

Every year.

On Bastille Day without their NRL players.

[Stuff Smith]

Just now, Tosh said:

On Bastille Day without their NRL players.

On Bastille Day! That's exactly what I was about to post...

[Tosh]

7 minutes ago, Stuff Smith said:

On Bastille Day! That's exactly what I was about to post...

Maybe even try a big 30k+ stadium in the south of France or even Paris.

[anjado]

2 hours ago, Phil said:

We had our chance, a few years ago the RFL had 10 (I think) development officers in London. They didn’t renew their contracts as a cost cutting measure.

False economy of the worst possible kind 

Thanks as someone who is overseas and remember people having high hopes with how well junior development was going in London especially amongst minorities I always wondered what happened. Again short sightedness and self interest kills the sport. 

In general though the SL needs to expand become a 14-16 teams competition. 

12 traditional clubs with P/R 

Wigan, St Helens, Hull, Leeds, Warrington, Castleford, Wakefield, Huddersfield, Hull KR, Salford, Bradford, Widnes. 

4 expansion clubs which would eventually grow replacing a couple of the traditional ones. 

Catalans, Toulouse, Welsh club, London. 

From there you have P&R for the traditional teams you weed out the teams without the support or infrastructure to be a professional team and by then the expansion clubs should be in a stronger position. Then those other teams basically become regional teams you still get a chance if you are Batley or Dewsbury to get to the top flight. 

The game is under threat in England purely because it needs more growth, I don't know why there aren't teams in other northern areas, Lincolnshire, Staffordshire, the North East in general and Cumbria. 

It's been 127 years and still every professional club in England is in Yorkshire and Lancashire which means if the people lose interest or you have an influx of people with no interest or understanding of the game it's going to be a bad thing. 

I think Wales performances in this tournament shows the talent is out their and if they were given a team for 10 years they would contribute to the growth of the game. 

Anyways I don't mean it as a rant or against certain clubs which have contributed a lot to the game over the years but something needs to be done. 

25 years ago there were teams in  Sheffield, Bradford, Halifax, Gateshead & London in the super league the game seems to be regressing as an outsider looking in. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jughead]

The obsession with playing France on Bastille Day when many on here moaned that Toulouse and Catalans played on a national holiday and people couldn’t go, is strange. 

[Gomersall]

If the RFL/SL wave enough £ at the Aussies they will come here even if it’s just to give their players some kind of incentive to stick with RL over RU.