England v Tonga series

[Tommygilf]

50 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I agree on the point on about having a 'home'. I don't think it needs to be overly strict, but one of the issues I have with internationals is that there is no continuity, there is little opportunity to build up a supporters base, get an atmosphere going etc. 

Tbh, they aren't very good events if we're gonna be brutally honest about it. 

Yeah I'd agree with that. There's no consistency. Where is the family end, where is the slightly boozy but more vocal bit etc.? 

As you say there's no consistency to build a fan culture up - and I don't think we are big enough to just ignore this either, we need to be actively encouraging this sort of activity to increase the "event feel". They tried initiatives like the "wall of white" and the England Memberships, but they had nothing to sell and seemed to have fallen on their face. 

Cricket does this quite well. The Barmy Army is actually well organised and serves as a core for a wider type of supporter at each day of a test match. They also have their own social media etc that supports the England Cricket stuff.

[Chris22]

It's all well and good saying we should play at Brentford, but let's look at the practicalities.

Would the football club want to host a rugby league international, mid-football season? London Irish also play at the stadium and, I know they've had financial problems, but are they still playing on the same pitch this season? If so, would there be appetite for a third sport from the stadium's owners? How much would they charge?

I have no doubt it would be a success in that there would be a decent crowd, with lots of locals. But it's not just an easy as saying "why don't we play a match at Brentford".

[Eddie]

35 minutes ago, Chris22 said:

It's all well and good saying we should play at Brentford, but let's look at the practicalities.

Would the football club want to host a rugby league international, mid-football season? London Irish also play at the stadium and, I know they've had financial problems, but are they still playing on the same pitch this season? If so, would there be appetite for a third sport from the stadium's owners? How much would they charge?

I have no doubt it would be a success in that there would be a decent crowd, with lots of locals. But it's not just an easy as saying "why don't we play a match at Brentford".

Well said. 

[Gomersall]

39 minutes ago, Chris22 said:

It's all well and good saying we should play at Brentford, but let's look at the practicalities.

Would the football club want to host a rugby league international, mid-football season? London Irish also play at the stadium and, I know they've had financial problems, but are they still playing on the same pitch this season? If so, would there be appetite for a third sport from the stadium's owners? How much would they charge?

I have no doubt it would be a success in that there would be a decent crowd, with lots of locals. But it's not just an easy as saying "why don't we play a match at Brentford".

Taking on board what you have said are you confident the RFL have asked these type of questions to the relevant people?

[Tommygilf]

44 minutes ago, Chris22 said:

It's all well and good saying we should play at Brentford, but let's look at the practicalities.

Would the football club want to host a rugby league international, mid-football season? London Irish also play at the stadium and, I know they've had financial problems, but are they still playing on the same pitch this season? If so, would there be appetite for a third sport from the stadium's owners? How much would they charge?

I have no doubt it would be a success in that there would be a decent crowd, with lots of locals. But it's not just an easy as saying "why don't we play a match at Brentford".

London Irish won't be playing at all this season, and certainly not at Brentford. The "bus stop in Hounslow" are the only tenants at the ground this season - financially, I'm sure they'd be open to any offers for additional income.

Hence why the free weekend due to Brentford being away makes it even more ideal. 

[meast]

On 01/08/2023 at 20:34, Havenlad80 said:

Be sure to point them towards the John smith’s stadium then

For Giants games as well as England games please

[meast]

14 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

I have full confidence that if the Huddersfield fixture was replaced with Brentford (who are also away that weekend), we would see an easy sell out of 18k. And being in London, I think you could reasonably charge a fiver more on tickets too for good measure, but anyhow.

Instead I think Huddersfield will take a hit from having a game in Leeds during the same series, just as Hull did in 2018 (down from 20k to 17k in 3 years) - and I think that effect may be greater on Huddersfield. 

Is there any real point playing a game in London and limiting the crowd to 18,000?

Surely you go big if you're gonna go to London?

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

1 hour ago, Chris22 said:

London Irish also play at the stadium and, I know they've had financial problems, but are they still playing on the same pitch this season? If so, would there be appetite for a third sport from the stadium's owner

London Irish no longer exist 

Not in a Bradford Bulls way but properly don't exist and never will again 

Look it up 

Even if they did Brentford had kicked them out of the GTECH 

I really think having a RL international there would be an easy sell and pretty much sell out.......it's a brilliant place to watch sport with good transport links and well located 

[The Masked Poster]

I thought Brentford was some kind of community stadium and a sort of not for profit thing? 

I'm probably talking blocks there

[crashmon]

On 02/08/2023 at 09:47, RP London said:

I'm actually surprised that the RFU arent bringing that fiji game (or one of the others) to the north as its normally been a success as clubs take kids etc and the novelty for RU fans in the north of a game that isnt a long trip to twickers etc.

Fully agree.  This should have been played in the north somewhere.  RU is just as bad keeping games in the South, as RL is keeping it in M62.   I've long advocated that England should play one of the Autumn internationals in the north every year instead at the same place

[crashmon]

On 02/08/2023 at 12:30, Tommygilf said:

How many top class stadiums have been built or redeveloped (or plan to be) in the past 20 years in areas international RL is played in? The RFL can't really afford or make a business case for a "national stadium", but an association with City of Manchester Stadium was never made, nor the Olympic Stadium in London, nor does it seem anything is being said to the new owners of LUFC who are clear in their plans to redevelop Elland Road to 50k, have we spoken to Man United about them redeveloping Old Trafford? These are just a few examples. I know the RFL is now based at the Etihad campus, but has that actually translated into anything there?

I like that we play around the country*, but a regular venue for every year with a guaranteed fixture seems a no brainer. I recall the new Wembley was originally labelled as the national stadium for Football and Rugby League. Oh how times have changed.

*obviously very limited use of the word country there

I thought Odsal was owned by the RFL.  Not saying England should play at Odsal of course, but its indicitive that Football has wembley, Union as Twickenham, and we have a speedway track with a tiny pitch in the middle

[Tommygilf]

4 minutes ago, crashmon said:

I thought Odsal was owned by the RFL.  Not saying England should play at Odsal of course, but its indicitive that Football has wembley, Union as Twickenham, and we have a speedway track with a tiny pitch in the middle

They own the leasehold I believe, taken on by the RFL when the current Bradford Director was CEO, hmmm.

But yes its indicative of an organisation that has essentially built sod all. Even the offices at Red Hall were rented weren't they?

[Barley Mow]

1 hour ago, Tommygilf said:

They own the leasehold I believe, taken on by the RFL when the current Bradford Director was CEO, hmmm.

But yes its indicative of an organisation that has essentially built sod all. Even the offices at Red Hall were rented weren't they?

I think Red Hall was RFL owned. It was certainly sold (whether by RFL or their landlord) when they moved out.

I assume the current HQ is rented?

[Dunbar]

20 hours ago, Chris22 said:

It's all well and good saying we should play at Brentford, but let's look at the practicalities.

Would the football club want to host a rugby league international, mid-football season? London Irish also play at the stadium and, I know they've had financial problems, but are they still playing on the same pitch this season? If so, would there be appetite for a third sport from the stadium's owners? How much would they charge?

I have no doubt it would be a success in that there would be a decent crowd, with lots of locals. But it's not just an easy as saying "why don't we play a match at Brentford".

Yes, but I could walk over to the game from my place and surely that is a big consideration. 

[gingerjon]

4 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

They own the leasehold I believe, taken on by the RFL when the current Bradford Director was CEO, hmmm.

But yes its indicative of an organisation that has essentially built sod all. Even the offices at Red Hall were rented weren't they?

No, they were owned by the RFL and sold to ease the bottom line.

(I'm 99% certain)

[Leyther_Matt]

On 02/08/2023 at 23:09, meast said:

Is there any real point playing a game in London and limiting the crowd to 18,000?

Surely you go big if you're gonna go to London?

I’d go with that. Even mid-high 20,000s would be a start at Charlton (who would need the cash more than Fulham). Although personally I feel any London internationals should be aiming much higher and sticking to whoever will have us from Spurs, Arsenal and Wembley.

 

[Tommygilf]

On 02/08/2023 at 23:09, meast said:

Is there any real point playing a game in London and limiting the crowd to 18,000?

Surely you go big if you're gonna go to London?

Ideally yes, but between Brentford and the Olympic stadium, Spurs and the Emirates at 60k plus, is there a suitable sized modern ground? Fulham, maybe at best?

I'd rather sell out a brand new stadium, at near world cup value ticket prices, at Brentford, than go for the same ticket prices as we will at Headingley or St Helens at the likes of 2nd rate facilities in Charlton, Millwall, or QPR for example. Or alternatively take an unproven test to a possibly half empty Olympic park or Spurs. 18k is well within the scope of expectations on this tour imo. Subsequent similar tours will hopefully outgrow it immediately.

[gingerjon]

1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

Ideally yes, but between Brentford and the Olympic stadium, Spurs and the Emirates at 60k plus, is there a suitable sized modern ground? Fulham, maybe at best?

I'd rather sell out a brand new stadium, at near world cup value ticket prices, at Brentford, than go for the same ticket prices as we will at Headingley or St Helens at the likes of 2nd rate facilities in Charlton, Millwall, or QPR for example. Or alternatively take an unproven test to a possibly half empty Olympic park or Spurs. 18k is well within the scope of expectations on this tour imo. Subsequent similar tours will hopefully outgrow it immediately.

What's The Valley like these days? I've not been since the days of the Broncos playing there but it looks like they've done work on it.

[Mattrhino]

On 02/08/2023 at 13:37, Tommygilf said:

Yeah I'd agree with that. There's no consistency. Where is the family end, where is the slightly boozy but more vocal bit etc.? 

As you say there's no consistency to build a fan culture up - and I don't think we are big enough to just ignore this either, we need to be actively encouraging this sort of activity to increase the "event feel". They tried initiatives like the "wall of white" and the England Memberships, but they had nothing to sell and seemed to have fallen on their face. 

Cricket does this quite well. The Barmy Army is actually well organised and serves as a core for a wider type of supporter at each day of a test match. They also have their own social media etc that supports the England Cricket stuff.

The ashes crowd was like a darts crowd this year, awful.

[gingerjon]

1 minute ago, Mattrhino said:

The ashes crowd was like a darts crowd this year, awful.

It may not always be possible but the trick is usually: find which area has been allocated to the Barmy Army and then sit on the opposite side of the ground.

Or drag a small child along and sit in the 'alcohol tolerated but alcoholic behaviour not' bit of any family stand.

[Mattrhino]

On 01/08/2023 at 08:11, The Masked Poster said:

For all most people know, Tonga could be as prestigious as the Kangaroos. But presenting it in a half assed way and mumbling about it instead of shouting about it from the rooftops will result in the usual half assed attendances we always get.
(With a pre tournament warning about the games being close to selling out of course) 

Well at least they are not trying to flog £95 seats this time.

From £95 to £50 for all 3 games rugby league is funny.

[Tommygilf]

17 minutes ago, Mattrhino said:

The ashes crowd was like a darts crowd this year, awful.

Depends where you sit doesn't it? 

I like the Western Terrace for Ashes games, I've sat in different bits of it even. But I'm also 25 going with other 20 odd year olds and I enjoy that environment at this stage in my life. I've sat in the nicer seats and even corporate and found it a bit boring, but for others it will be exactly what they want.

I'm hardly a cricket fanatic, but I know what I'm signing up for in the Western Terrace, the Hollies, or the "temporary" stand at Old Trafford etc.

Its important to have those clearly demarcated areas imo so that everyone gets their enjoyment from the day.

[Tommygilf]

9 minutes ago, Mattrhino said:

Well at least they are not trying to flog £95 seats this time.

From £95 to £50 for all 3 games rugby league is funny.

Its called strategy!

Or not...

[Tommygilf]

48 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

What's The Valley like these days? I've not been since the days of the Broncos playing there but it looks like they've done work on it.

The 3 newer stands are all 30 to 20 years old iirc. I can't remember when the Broncos played there but presumably within that timeframe?

[gingerjon]

25 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

The 3 newer stands are all 30 to 20 years old iirc. I can't remember when the Broncos played there but presumably within that timeframe?

Just. I think maybe one of the stands is newer and it looks like there's been some superficial work as well. It wouldn't be my choice but it is pretty easy to get to from central London and not an obvious wreck like, say, Millwall's ground.