Rhodri Jones on the growth of international Rugby League

[Martyn Sadler]

Rhodri speaks to Jake Kearnan

[Barley Mow]

He said the quiet bit out load there in mentioning Samoa for next year's end of season internationals.

I was disappointed with his answer to the question about what we can learn from the union world cup - the answer seemed to just be a justification for only having a ten team world cup next time. He said that they built numbers slowly from 1986 and 1995 and we can learn from that - It was as if he didn't realise the RLWC began in 1954.

Our international game isn't as big as union's, but our world cups have built slowly, then contracted, then built up again, and repeat...  If he truly believes that is the lesson to learn, then I think he's wrong.

[Damien]

51 minutes ago, Barley Mow said:

He said the quiet bit out load there in mentioning Samoa for next year's end of season internationals.

I was disappointed with his answer to the question about what we can learn from the union world cup - the answer seemed to just be a justification for only having a ten team world cup next time. He said that they built numbers slowly from 1986 and 1995 and we can learn from that - It was as if he didn't realise the RLWC began in 1954.

Our international game isn't as big as union's, but our world cups have built slowly, then contracted, then built up again, and repeat...  If he truly believes that is the lesson to learn, then I think he's wrong.

Built numbers slowly from 1986 to 1995? What like we did from RLWC2008 to RLWC 2021. 

[Man of Kent]

45 minutes ago, Barley Mow said:

He said the quiet bit out load there in mentioning Samoa for next year's end of season internationals.

I was disappointed with his answer to the question about what we can learn from the union world cup - the answer seemed to just be a justification for only having a ten team world cup next time. He said that they built numbers slowly from 1986 and 1995 and we can learn from that - It was as if he didn't realise the RLWC began in 1954.

Our international game isn't as big as union's, but our world cups have built slowly, then contracted, then built up again, and repeat...  If he truly believes that is the lesson to learn, then I think he's wrong.

Sorry but I think you’re the one who is wrong on this. The average winning point margin in the 3rd and final round of RLWC21 group stage fixtures was 55.

Fewer teams makes for closer games and a (more) credible competition. 

[gingerjon]

1 minute ago, Man of Kent said:

Fewer teams makes for closer games and a (more) credible competition. 

Rugby league's international credibility will not be enhanced by shrinking the numbers of countries who visibly play rugby league.

[Barley Mow]

1 minute ago, Man of Kent said:

Sorry but I think you’re the one who is wrong on this. The average winning point margin in the 3rd and final round of RLWC21 group stage fixtures was 55.

Fewer teams makes for closer games and a (more) credible competition. 

That may be an argument for having fewer nations compete (I can see both sides of the argument on that) but I don't think it necessarily supports Jones' stated position.

I just think that the best thing for our world cup (and international RL in general) is consistency - Whatever the type of world cup we're having, lets stick with it for a few cycles rather than changing numbers up and down and changing the format every single time we hold the event. Let's make sure everyone knows where they stand for the next ten years or so.

[Man of Kent]

Just now, gingerjon said:

Rugby league's international credibility will not be enhanced by shrinking the numbers of countries who visibly play rugby league.

Of course it will. It will enhance the product, as Jones states. 

Having countries like Greece and Jamaica (‘Ooh look, Greece & Jamaica! Oh hang on, they are just Aussies and Northerners’) as novelty acts does nothing for the credibility of international rugby league.

[Hull Kingston Bronco]

3 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Rugby league's international credibility will not be enhanced by shrinking the numbers of countries who visibly play rugby league.

Pretend teams aren't teams. There's no valour in delusion. 

I'd be running an emerging nations comp alongside the WC to give pathway nations a goal to strive for, but having a comp for competitive(ish) sides only is a key part of us rebuilding our international game. It's a turnaround not a start-up, and turnarounds have to be even more laser focused because they can afford less mistakes. They've had their second chances already. 

[gingerjon]

1 minute ago, Man of Kent said:

Of course it will. It will enhance the product, as Jones states. 

Yeah, that is absolute and total, pie in the sky, nonsense.

If it were quality then we'd not need to worry, would we? This sport is already streets ahead entertainment-wise than anything you'll see at the RUWC and yet, somehow, that's not the important bit. And that RUWC will have blow out after blow out at this stage and they will be played to full stadiums. And more countries in next time.

If, somehow, the pinnacle of international rugby league did become a three-test series between England and Australia would that distillation of sporting magnificence enhance the international game's credibility? Would it Dickens. It would be met with, "Well, obviously, no one else actually plays the game."

We should stop wincing about quality. It's embarrassing.

[Charlie]

2 minutes ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

Pretend teams aren't teams. There's no valour in delusion. 

I'd be running an emerging nations comp alongside the WC to give pathway nations a goal to strive for, but having a comp for competitive(ish) sides only is a key part of us rebuilding our international game. It's a turnaround not a start-up, and turnarounds have to be even more laser focused because they can afford less mistakes. They've had their second chances already. 

Let’s be real we’ve cocked it never going to have an international game because of small minded people. We might aswell just play a try nations a get rid of Tonga and Samoa because as you say there pretend teams 

[Man of Kent]

2 minutes ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

Pretend teams aren't teams. There's no valour in delusion. 

Quite. People aren’t fooled by this stuff.

We’re fooling ourselves.

[gingerjon]

3 minutes ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

Pretend teams aren't teams.

Interesting.

Did you note how, at a low level but still a level, Great Britain's baseball team got column inches and positive press this year based on a decent international run? How nobody remotely cared that the majority of the team were American born or American resident?

You're right though. Far better to aim small and miss.

[Man of Kent]

3 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Yeah, that is absolute and total, pie in the sky, nonsense.

If it were quality then we'd not need to worry, would we? This sport is already streets ahead entertainment-wise than anything you'll see at the RUWC and yet, somehow, that's not the important bit. And that RUWC will have blow out after blow out at this stage and they will be played to full stadiums. And more countries in next time.

If, somehow, the pinnacle of international rugby league did become a three-test series between England and Australia would that distillation of sporting magnificence enhance the international game's credibility? Would it Dickens. It would be met with, "Well, obviously, no one else actually plays the game."

We should stop wincing about quality. It's embarrassing.

I’m afraid international rugby league is widely seen as a bit of a joke.

Thankfully those who actually decide these things disagree with you and have taken steps to reduce the joke factor.

[Tommygilf]

15 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

Sorry but I think you’re the one who is wrong on this. The average winning point margin in the 3rd and final round of RLWC21 group stage fixtures was 55.

Fewer teams makes for closer games and a (more) credible competition. 

England beat Samoa by 54 points.

Lets just watch Australia vs Australia because nobody else plays competitive matches.

[Charlie]

4 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

I’m afraid international rugby league is widely seen as a bit of a joke.

Thankfully those who actually decide these things disagree with you and have taken steps to reduce the joke factor.

There doing a top job aren’t they

[gingerjon]

4 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Lets just watch Australia vs Australia 

Man of Kent needs new underpants now.

[Man of Kent]

6 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Lets just watch Australia vs Australia because nobody else plays competitive matches.

Many a true word spoken in jest.

Obviously not, but neither should we have Australia vs Equatorial Guinea in the World Cup for no apparent reasons other than for some in the RL community to crack one off over ‘expansion’.

[The Hallucinating Goose]

8 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

Many a true word spoken in jest.

Obviously not, but neither should we have Australia vs Equatorial Guinea in the World Cup for no apparent reasons other than for some in the RL community to crack one off over ‘expansion’.

Who've you been talking to?? What has Mrs. Goose said to you?! Don't believe a word she says! That was one time and if the England-Greece game happened to be on in the background then it was a coincidence!! 

[Man of Kent]

16 minutes ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

Who've you been talking to?? What has Mrs. Goose said to you?! Don't believe a word she says! That was one time and if the England-Greece game happened to be on in the background then it was a coincidence!! 

Well there you go.

In all seriousness, how much did Greece being in the World Cup enhance the credibility of international rugby league? Answer: sweet Fanni Adamopolous. It detracted it.

I’d love to see them play more games, perhaps a regular series against Turkey. But the World Cup? Nah. Not yet. 

Edited September 12, 2023 by Man of Kent

[OriginalMrC]

Let's face it the NRL and Superleague don't want an international game and until they are fully on board the international game will never truly grow. 

The only real success in recent years has been the emergence of pacific countries as contenders 

[The Hallucinating Goose]

20 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

Well there you go.

In all seriousness, how much did Greece being in the World Cup enhance the credibility of international rugby league? Answer: sweet Fanni Adamopolous. It detracted it.

I’d love to see them play more games, perhaps a regular series against Turkey. But the World Cup? Nah. Not yet. 

They didn't bring a whole lot to the World Cup in terms of quality but qualifying for the tournament did get the sport formally recognised in Greece after years of playing matches in the middle of the night in secret locations and having all assets confiscated. It gave the sport more credibility in the country, albeit amongst the half a dozen people that have heard of RL in Greece. 

[RugbyLeagueGeek]

26 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

In all seriousness, how much did Greece being in the World Cup enhance the credibility of international rugby league? Answer: sweet Fanni Adamopolous. It detracted it.

From whose perspective? I have some friends who went to watch England v Greece who had never been to a RL game before and they loved it.

[GeordieSaint]

3 minutes ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

From whose perspective? I have some friends who went to watch England v Greece who had never been to a RL game before and they loved it.

Usually the biggest critics of RL is RL fans themselves. THG’s point about formal recognition of Greek RL is so so important. We tend to forget the strategic implications over tactical short term views time and time again. 

[GeordieSaint]

 

[Angelic Cynic]

32 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

Well there you go.

In all seriousness, how much did Greece being in the World Cup enhance the credibility of international rugby league? Answer: sweet Fanni Adamopolous. It detracted it.

I’d love to see them play more games, perhaps a regular series against Turkey. But the World Cup? Nah. Not yet. 

   Just an amazing story that the people sitting on their backsides watching a screen will never understand.

  https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/63236572

Don't suppose the blowout scores from yesteryear have affected the other code despite their arrogant attitude.