Am I right about the game?

[bromleybulldog]

31 minutes ago, ATLANTISMAN said:

I can see magic ending up at Elland Road:((((

No way. It'll be Leigh Sports Village for sure.

[Tre Cool]

2 hours ago, Whippet13 said:

Plus IMG dont have any actual power or control - SL clubs still pull the strings, for example, we have Magic again next year when IMG wanted it (rightly or wrongly) scrapped.

Wrongly 

[Coco]

There seems to be lots of comments about the international scene.  But as a family we should be concerned about our own household. Has anyone realised how many fans have we lost in Cumbria. I don't really care about playing Australia or New Zealand. I more interested about what has happened in Cumbria. There are three sides in the region, and right now,  all are struggling. This area is a massive rugby league region. Is just something we have just accepted. 

[sheddingswasus]

1 hour ago, Damien said:

A 20 team SL with clubs sharing approximately 700k each isn't going to be too super, would have clubs that cant even be full time and wouldn't be sustainable for many clubs.

The Rugby League Premiership was never the name to decide the league championship either.

Maybe 18 though. Getting around £750k funding then working to promote their club and build their attendances try and aim for 10k attendances. That would generate say £120k per match so say £2.04m. Add sponsorship, corporate funding, lotteries etc and then you are starting to set a self sufficient product

Edited November 12, 2023 by sheddingswasus

[Midlands hobo]

40 minutes ago, Coco said:

By ignoring our roots, I mean our identity as a Rugby League Family. Our teams in our heartlands.

Ding ding we have a winner in RL bingo. 

[glossop saint]

44 minutes ago, Coco said:

By ignoring our roots, I mean our identity as a Rugby League Family. Our teams in our heartlands. There are clubs that are sustainable in a new Rugby League Premiership. We have lost too many fans. Yes London, South of France are included. Wales are included. Doncaster is also included, once they are financially sustainable. 

I have noticed certain clubs are only interested in their interests, these clubs have actually caused the game to lose too many fans. We have lost  many fans and have not gained any new ones. Featherstone Vs Castleford was a game to watch. Then you add Wakefield to the mix and it's great rivalry. Bradford Vs Leeds. Then you put in Halifax and that was a great rivalry. 

We seem to have lost what made the identity of the sport. The sport had its own identity, family values and great rivalry and friendship. These have been lost. 

Which teams aren't included in your return to roots? You've listed plenty that are so just wondering where we are returning to them from.

Which clubs aren't 'only interested in their interests'?

I think all those values are great. A big part of why I got into and love the sport. Which bits have we lost and how would you get them back? Other than changing the name of the top division and virtually doubling the number of teams?

[Damien]

10 minutes ago, sheddingswasus said:

Maybe 18 though. Getting around £750k funding then working to promote their club and build their attendances try and aim for 10k attendances. That would generate say £120k per match so say £2.04m. Add sponsorship, corporate funding, lotteries etc and then you are starting to set a self sufficient product

18 clubs aren't averaging 10k, we can't even get 6 at the moment. It's fantasy stuff.

[sheddingswasus]

35 minutes ago, Damien said:

18 clubs aren't averaging 10k, we can't even get 6 at the moment. It's fantasy stuff.

But that is why we are failing. Clubs need to work harder and aim higher rather than rely on handouts. If we were achieving this it would then make it more attractive to TV and hopefully increase that revenue stream 

[EssexRL]

Just to bring this discussion back on point: as a southern based fan what is the future of RL mean to me? Do the powers that be care? In terms of a professional experience is it a sport that is limited to Humberside, Yorkshire and Lancashire? 

[Damien]

1 minute ago, EssexRL said:

Just to bring this discussion back on point: as a southern based fan what is the future of RL mean to me? Do the powers that be care? In terms of a professional experience is it a sport that is limited to Humberside, Yorkshire and Lancashire? 

I really don't think the RFL now care about the game outside the heartland areas. They have shown an appalling dereliction of duty when it comes to their role as a governing body and a complete lack of leadership and strategy when it comes to developing and sustaining the game outside the heartlands.

[Gomersall]

2 minutes ago, Damien said:

I really don't think the RFL now care about the game outside the heartland areas. They have shown an appalling dereliction of duty when it comes to their role as a governing body and a complete lack of leadership and strategy when it comes to developing and sustaining the game outside the heartlands.

They aren’t doing a great job in the heartlands either.

[Damien]

3 minutes ago, Gomersall said:

They aren’t doing a great job in the heartlands either.

Yep I agree but they have certainly showed their priorities lie there.

[glossop saint]

11 minutes ago, Damien said:

I really don't think the RFL now care about the game outside the heartland areas. They have shown an appalling dereliction of duty when it comes to their role as a governing body and a complete lack of leadership and strategy when it comes to developing and sustaining the game outside the heartlands.

I think for too long, for whatever reason, they have chased that bottom of the SL/top of Champsionship 'market'. Whether that was in the hope that those clubs would take a step up (potentially worked in the case of Leigh?) or to prevent fans of those clubs being disillusioned I don't know. What it has done has alienated the top and bottom, not incentivising the top clubs to grow and cutting off the bottom clubs. Unfortunately a sport seemingly obsessed with mediocrity. 

Edit. To be fair, I don't think that it is a heartland/expansion thing, just that the majority of the clubs in that band are heartland. London are/were also in that group however I think they just failed to take advantage of it for many reasons that are often discussed when talking about London.

Edited November 12, 2023 by glossop saint

[Damien]

2 minutes ago, glossop saint said:

I think for too long, for whatever reason, they have chased that bottom of the SL/top of Champsionship 'market'. Whether that was in the hope that those clubs would take a step up (potentially worked in the case of Leigh?) or to prevent fans of those clubs being disillusioned I don't know. What it has done has alienated the top and bottom, not incentivising the top clubs to grow and cutting off the bottom clubs. Unfortunately a sport seemingly obsessed with mediocrity. 

Absolutely  the race to the bottom mentality has held the sport back for far too long.

[JT RL]

51 minutes ago, Damien said:

I really don't think the RFL now care about the game outside the heartland areas. They have shown an appalling dereliction of duty when it comes to their role as a governing body and a complete lack of leadership and strategy when it comes to developing and sustaining the game outside the heartlands.

It would be accurate to extend that comment to include sustaining the game inside the heartlands.

The successful clubs are successful without any great central strategic plan.

Think of the clubs in the heartland that have withered or collapsed

 

[JT RL]

46 minutes ago, glossop saint said:

I think for too long, for whatever reason, they have chased that bottom of the SL/top of Champsionship 'market'. Whether that was in the hope that those clubs would take a step up (potentially worked in the case of Leigh?) or to prevent fans of those clubs being disillusioned I don't know. What it has done has alienated the top and bottom, not incentivising the top clubs to grow and cutting off the bottom clubs. Unfortunately a sport seemingly obsessed with mediocrity. 

Edit. To be fair, I don't think that it is a heartland/expansion thing, just that the majority of the clubs in that band are heartland. London are/were also in that group however I think they just failed to take advantage of it for many reasons that are often discussed when talking about London.

The rise of Leigh is due to the club + Derek + a busy stadium 

[bigbaldnmad]

1 hour ago, Damien said:

Yep I agree but they have certainly showed their priorities lie there.

And that is with the current incumbents of SL and nothing else.

SL has existed for over 20% of the existence of the game, not something that is new. It purely works on a top down structure in which the sport at lower levels is slowly dying due to lack of funding.

But as long as the top clubs, who are probably in the best position to generate income anyway, receive the lions share of the media funding then nothing will change.

And not allowing clubs, outside of the chosen few as allocated by the RFL, to be able to develop their own players further restricts RL below SL.

[RigbyLuger]

Obvious trolls are obvious.

[Damien]

14 minutes ago, bigbaldnmad said:

And that is with the current incumbents of SL and nothing else.

SL has existed for over 20% of the existence of the game, not something that is new. It purely works on a top down structure in which the sport at lower levels is slowly dying due to lack of funding.

But as long as the top clubs, who are probably in the best position to generate income anyway, receive the lions share of the media funding then nothing will change.

And not allowing clubs, outside of the chosen few as allocated by the RFL, to be able to develop their own players further restricts RL below SL.

It is not media funding. It is TV rights funding for Super League, of course SL clubs should take the lions share so that they can put on decent quality games for Sky. This is the very thing Sky are paying for.

[RigbyLuger]

8 minutes ago, Damien said:

It is not media funding. It is TV rights funding for Super League, of course SL clubs should take the lions share so that they can put on decent quality games for Sky. This is the very thing Sky are paying for.

Do we think Championship clubs gave any money to their L1 counterparts from the Viaplay deal? 

[bigbaldnmad]

7 minutes ago, Damien said:

It is not media funding. It is TV rights funding for Super League, of course SL clubs should take the lions share so that they can put on decent quality games for Sky. This is the very thing Sky are paying for.

By giving aging Aussies one last pay pay day.

As I said, SL has been in charge of the game for a long period of time, and SL club chairman are in charge, not the RFL. The funding of the game, from amateur upwards just isn't there. Any funding for junior / community clubs will only decrease due to funding of girls football.

There has been over 20 years for SL to grow the game, but if growing the game conflicts with self interest then nothing seems to happen. How long do we need to keep going down the same path and getting the same results, is that not the definition of insanity?

 

 

[bigbaldnmad]

9 minutes ago, RigbyLuger said:

Do we think Championship clubs gave any money to their L1 counterparts from the Viaplay deal? 

Not really sure that championship clubs got much out of Viaplay, except reduced attendances on TV games.

[Coco]

The areas I am mentioning have over 2 million fans we have lost. Can we afford to have lost that number? Also how many have we gained? 

I believe our top clubs have only focused on their own self interests and alienated a lot of fans. It's a disgrace how the funding that the game has received, has not been made available to clubs outside of Super League. 

The identity of the game has been lost. We lost everything what made our sport special. I am not ignoring teams in France / London / Midlands / they have a place, but what the top clubs have done is focus on their self interests, and not the games. This new PR fraud scam, they have done with IMG, will only destroy the game further. A lot of clubs outside Super League will be lost, like the fans we once had.

 

[gingerjon]

9 hours ago, Damien said:

Yep I agree but they have certainly showed their priorities lie there.

Indeed. A decade's worth of indulgence of the heartlands myth and a relentless focus on mediocrity, combined with a meat raffle style promotion of our key events and a weird nostalgia fetish has seen the heartlands contract, the game's value diminish, and it become less and less visible, let alone viable, outside a falling number of communities.

And, no, I don't have a solution. Because for more than ten years I've been saying: see all of the above, it is going to wreck the game.

[FileyBulldog]

10 hours ago, EssexRL said:

Just to bring this discussion back on point: as a southern based fan what is the future of RL mean to me? Do the powers that be care? In terms of a professional experience is it a sport that is limited to Humberside, Yorkshire and Lancashire? 

Those in charge of the sport have not cared about anything outside of the Super League for years. The future of League One is very much in question and with a Southern club in Cornwall being forced (which is exactly what has happened) out of the 1895 Cup shows how little they care about growing the sport outside of the protected A grade clubs. Hey if they get rid of all those other clubs outside the Super Dooper League then they will be saving more money than they already are by not investing in the lower league clubs.