The never-ending League Restructure debate (Many merged threads)

[Griff]

Just 1 flaw to your logic good sir.....

 

you are presuming london will survive the drop this year......and then be dreadful next...

 

If London go down this year and continue (lets say wakey as well)

 

then fev would be looking to replace widnes, cas, bradford, and hull KR in the 12 team SL?

 

if bradford go down then your model looks good (london to stay up, then go bad) but we are forgetting that wakey and bradford (in this example) would also be battling fev to replace London, I would back the 2 former any day of the week to do this!

 

To be fair, you can't know this - or even make a proper judgment.  Feisal's money is the great unknown factor in the equation.

[The Parksider]

Just 1 flaw to your logic good sir.....

 

you are presuming london will survive the drop this year......and then be dreadful next...

 

Thanks for the reply. No I am not assuming London will survive the drop. As it stands they hardly have a team, and have some loan kids in the 1st. X111.

 

On that I can safely say it will take a miracle for them to avoid relegation.

 

On Nahaboos pledge to spend the same salary cap as the eight Superleague clubs I can surmise he will outspend all the other clubs in the middle 8.

 

So I see those two clubs "changing places" as it stands.

[petesmithfan]

1. OK - it's the only experience on which the decision makers can draw as well.

 

2.  Why is it irrelevant ?

So the Swedish drew on no experience ?   They did not need to, it is a business structure as much as a League structure and what the RFL will have looked at was what type of system would give the overall business the most strength, they probably were not even aware of the Swedish system.  They just devised what they thought would be the best business and sporting structure for the game AT THIS TIME.   I think you are all looking into it way to deep.  The process has been a matter of looking at the problems over the whole and coming up with A (not necessary the best) structure to address some of these.

So I think overall it is irrelevant.

[petesmithfan]

So the Swedish drew on no experience ?   They did not need to, it is a business structure as much as a League structure and what the RFL will have looked at was what type of system would give the overall business the most strength, they probably were not even aware of the Swedish system.  They just devised what they thought would be the best business and sporting structure for the game AT THIS TIME.   I think you are all looking into it way to deep.  The process has been a matter of looking at the problems over the whole and coming up with A (not necessary the best) structure to address some of these.

So I think overall it is irrelevant.

 

The RFL and Chairman also have to actually make decisions they can not spend forever going over and over the pros and cons like we do on here, or  nothing would get done.  Some times its just a case of giving something a go!

[Griff]

So the Swedish drew on no experience ?   They did not need to, it is a business structure as much as a League structure and what the RFL will have looked at was what type of system would give the overall business the most strength, they probably were not even aware of the Swedish system.  They just devised what they thought would be the best business and sporting structure for the game AT THIS TIME.   I think you are all looking into it way to deep.  The process has been a matter of looking at the problems over the whole and coming up with A (not necessary the best) structure to address some of these.

So I think overall it is irrelevant.

 

Swedish ?  What have they got to do with it ?

 

You don't think it's a bit of a coincidence that they came up with it just after the Scottish Soccer Leagues had rejected a similar system ?  It certainly stretches my imagination.

 

I don't see your point really.  Some other organisation's experience is obviously relevant.

[gingerjon]

Swedish ?  What have they got to do with it ?

 

You don't think it's a bit of a coincidence that they came up with it just after the Scottish Soccer Leagues had rejected a similar system ?  It certainly stretches my imagination.

 

I don't see your point really.  Some other organisation's experience is obviously relevant.

 

KPMG came up with it having been asked to identify league systems that promised jeopardy.

 

Given that they copied almost everything about this system whether it worked or not in the richest country in the world playing the world's most popular sport is probably a teensy bit relevant.

[Dave T]

KPMG came up with it having been asked to identify league systems that promised jeopardy.

 

Given that they copied almost everything about this system whether it worked or not in the richest country in the world playing the world's most popular sport is probably a teensy bit relevant.

Did KPMG come up with this suggestion?

 

My experience of consultants isn't that they will give you a firm proposed solution. Didn't they evaluate the feasibility of a solution that was put to them?

[gingerjon]

Did KPMG come up with this suggestion?

 

My experience of consultants isn't that they will give you a firm proposed solution. Didn't they evaluate the feasibility of a solution that was put to them?

They were asked to provide league systems with jeopardy to replace the tired, drab world of Super League.

3x8 was one of three proposals.

[The Parksider]

Did KPMG come up with this suggestion?My experience of consultants isn't that they will give you a firm proposed solution. Didn't they evaluate the feasibility of a solution that was put to them?

 

Either way it was said the proposals would create meaningful, exciting matches and boost crowds.

 

Why they never said?

 

Do you know why Dave??

[The Parksider]

I think you are all looking into it way too deep. 

 

I've looked into it as far as the headline it is.

 

I have been unable to find any "depth" to the idea the proposals would create meaningful, exciting matches and boost crowds.

 

Can you help perchance?

[Dave T]

Either way it was said the proposals would create meaningful, exciting matches and boost crowds.

Why they never said?

Do you know why Dave??

i agree with them.

Imnot going to pull a business case together however.

[oldrover]

i think this thread has now reached the stage of people wanting the last word. (i don't expect this to be the last word btw)

[petesmithfan]

Swedish ?  What have they got to do with it ?

 

You don't think it's a bit of a coincidence that they came up with it just after the Scottish Soccer Leagues had rejected a similar system ?  It certainly stretches my imagination.

 

I don't see your point really.  Some other organisation's experience is obviously relevant.

 

I've looked into it as far as the headline it is.

 

I have been unable to find any "depth" to the idea the proposals would create meaningful, exciting matches and boost crowds.

 

Can you help perchance?

Sorry cannot help, infact thats kind of the point............... We will not know the outcome until it is given a chance.   Bit like going to the moon really you do not know you can do it until you try. 

I may add that under licensing FEV were knocking at the door louder than anyone, and under this system I see our progress stalling a little.  But its not just about MY team its about the good of the game and my view is we should give it a go.

[Terry Mullaney]

I may add that under licensing FEV were knocking at the door louder than anyone, and under this system I see our progress stalling a little.  But its not just about MY team its about the good of the game and my view is we should give it a go.

Absolutely right, Rovers were a shoe in but now they'll have to re-focus on something quite different with perhaps less certainty of the outcome. Nevertheless it will be fascinating to see the intensity of the game as a whole escalate. Really looking forward to it all starting and, regardless of whether Fev get to SL or not, it's going to be fantastic for RL fans at all levels and just what we needed to carry on the momentum from the World Cup.

[Robin Evans]

Absolutely right, Rovers were a shoe in but now they'll have to re-focus on something quite different with perhaps less certainty of the outcome. Nevertheless it will be fascinating to see the intensity of the game as a whole escalate. Really looking forward to it all starting and, regardless of whether Fev get to SL or not, it's going to be fantastic for RL fans at all levels and just what we needed to carry on the momentum from the World Cup.

couldn't agree more Terry.

[gingerjon]

its not just about MY team its about the good of the game

 

Must just be a coincidence all these Fev fans praising it without making any comment at all about the impact on the game in the lower half of the Championship and C1, and the wider spread of the game beyond that.

[tim2]

Absolutely right, Rovers were a shoe in but now they'll have to re-focus on something quite different with perhaps less certainty of the outcome. Nevertheless it will be fascinating to see the intensity of the game as a whole escalate. Really looking forward to it all starting and, regardless of whether Fev get to SL or not, it's going to be fantastic for RL fans at all levels and just what we needed to carry on the momentum from the World Cup.

 

It will be interesting to see the reckless spending of money escalate too.

[guess who]

It will be interesting to see the reckless spending of money escalate too.

 

 

Clubs in SL have spent beyond there means and ended in the poo.

[Terry Mullaney]

Must just be a coincidence all these Fev fans praising it without making any comment at all about the impact on the game in the lower half of the Championship and C1, and the wider spread of the game beyond that.

Not with you on that one Jon. How will it be any different to what it is now? There's a clear pathway to the top for all if they run their clubs properly and without the need for over spending. Sheffield are a shining example of how to run a club successfully on very limited financial resources.

Edited January 26, 2014 by Terry Mullaney

[The Parksider]

Sorry cannot help, infact thats kind of the point............... We will not know the outcome until it is given a chance.   Bit like going to the moon really you do not know you can do it until you try. 

 

 

I was hoping like Old Rover that that would be the very good last word.

[The Parksider]

Sheffield are a shining example of how to run a club successfully on very limited financial resources.

 

So how come they keep pipping your lot on a shoestring against Campbell's and Nahaboos hundreds of thousands? Are you not successfully run?

 

I think this should be the last word BTW Terry.

[Terry Mullaney]

So how come they keep pipping your lot on a shoestring against Campbell's and Nahaboos hundreds of thousands? Are you not successfully run?

I think this should be the last word BTW Terry.

Keep pipping our lot Parky? They pipped us once in a GF after we had hammered them the year before and we pipped the Eagles for the League leader's trophy last season to make it four in a row. As far as money spent is concerned, well it's not just about on the field is it? There's one or two SL clubs casting an envious eye on the present and future facilities at Post Office Rd.

Mark Aston's a shrewd operator though, that's for sure.

Close the damned thread now.

Edited January 26, 2014 by Terry Mullaney

[keighley]

So how come they keep pipping your lot on a shoestring against Campbell's and Nahaboos hundreds of thousands? Are you not successfully run?

 

I think this should be the last word BTW Terry.

 

Because it's sport and results on the field determine who wins. The finances and everything else often have a huge impact on who wins but sometimes not and this is the case with Sheffield.

[Rarefrith]

Because it's sport and results on the field determine who wins. The finances and everything else often have a huge impact on who wins but sometimes not and this is the case with Sheffield.

No point arguing with this bloke Keighley.

[gingerjon]

Not with you on that one Jon. How will it be any different to what it is now? There's a clear pathway to the top for all if they run their clubs properly and without the need for over spending. Sheffield are a shining example of how to run a club successfully on very limited financial resources.

 

The pathway is there, true, in that promotion and relegation exists between the two divisions.  But, the much heralded redistribution of funding stops about halfway down the second lot of 12 and doesn't enter tier 3 at all.  All of the 'jeopardy' focus is on the sides inside the 24 so all the resources envisaged by this 'whole game solution' go there.  The gap is going to get wider and wider.

 

And, like I've said before, this is a whole game solution that washes the RFL's hands of any responsibility or commitment to international development, expansion or taking positive action to sort out the community game - all the while whilst lowering the standards they expect their professional clubs to meet and telling them that they won't be monitoring them anyway.