Toulouse confirmed as Championship League Leaders Shield Winners

[Damien]

1 minute ago, GUBRATS said:

So maybe the best solution would be for the LLs to be automatically promoted ?

And a play off to decide who plays the next to bottom team in SL for the final SL spot ?

That would make things more interesting

I have always thought that finishing top in the Championship would be a truer test to see who's best equipped for the weekly grind of Super League.

Ive always liked the idea of a 14 team Super League with 2 up, 2 down and would be happy with something like you suggest too. I'm not sure with just 12 teams though and certainly not 10.

[Saint Toppy]

11 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Although had they beaten Wigan a few days later they would have still won it. 

I wonder were you one of those angry Saints fans who were outraged when the shield was packed away when Saints lost a few years back? I wonder why so many were outraged about something so insignificant. 

I've made my views well known on here for many years on the system in that I think its one of the dumbest ideas we've adopted form the NRL.

The League Champions should the team that finished top of the league. If we have to have 'loop fixtures' to bring in extra cash who teams play should be decided on their league position from the year before and not some random list based on who Sky want.   

If they still want extra games and some end of season play-off's then reintroduce the Premiership trophy where the top 6 teams can play-off for another cup, completely separate from the League Champions.

The team finishing top of the Championship also get automatic promotion to SL to replace the team finishing bottom of SL.

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, Saint Toppy said:

I've made my views well known on here for many years on the system in that I think its one of the dumbest ideas we've adopted form the NRL.

The League Champions should the team that finished top of the league. If we have to have 'loop fixtures' to bring in extra cash who teams play should be decided on their league position from the year before and not some random list based on who Sky want.   

If they still want extra games and some end of season play-off's then reintroduce the Premiership trophy where the top 6 teams can play-off for another cup, completely separate from the League Champions.

The team finishing top of the Championship also get automatic promotion to SL to replace the team finishing bottom of SL.

Personally I think the Grand Final is one of the best things we have done over the last few decades. 

I understand why people want the league winners recognised though, and this is why we brought in the LLS and have tried to boost its status to recognise the regular season efforts. 

I enjoy the guarantee of the champions being declared on the last game of the season in front of 65 to 70k.

[Davo5]

10 minutes ago, Saint Toppy said:

I've made my views well known on here for many years on the system in that I think its one of the dumbest ideas we've adopted form the NRL.

The League Champions should the team that finished top of the league. If we have to have 'loop fixtures' to bring in extra cash who teams play should be decided on their league position from the year before and not some random list based on who Sky want.   

If they still want extra games and some end of season play-off's then reintroduce the Premiership trophy where the top 6 teams can play-off for another cup, completely separate from the League Champions.

The team finishing top of the Championship also get automatic promotion to SL to replace the team finishing bottom of SL.

The only thing we adopted from NRL was the term Grand Final,pretty sure we’ve decided the champions by means of a playoff final far more than first past the post.

[Saint Toppy]

6 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Personally I think the Grand Final is one of the best things we have done over the last few decades. 

I understand why people want the league winners recognised though, and this is why we brought in the LLS and have tried to boost its status to recognise the regular season efforts. 

I enjoy the guarantee of the champions being declared on the last game of the season in front of 65 to 70k.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. Personally I think this system just allows teams to 'coast' for most of the season knowing they just have to do enough to make it into the play-offs and to then just have to be at their best for 2 or 3 games at the end of the year to pick up the biggest prize. Once they've secured that play-off place they can also be selective in team selection and be prepared to 'throw' games to ensure they peak for the last 2 or 3.

[Davo5]

1 minute ago, Saint Toppy said:

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. Personally I think this system just allows teams to 'coast' for most of the season knowing they just have to do enough to make it into the play-offs and to then just have to be at their best for 2 or 3 games at the end of the year to pick up the biggest prize. Once they've secured that play-off place they can also be selective in team selection and be prepared to 'throw' games to ensure they peak for the last 2 or 3.

How many of those teams who have “coasted”most of the season to scrape into the playoffs actually won it ? Leeds ?

[Tommygilf]

3 minutes ago, Davo5 said:

How many of those teams who have “coasted”most of the season to scrape into the playoffs actually won it ? Leeds ?

And even in both of those seasons, Leeds made both finals.

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

18 hours ago, FearNothing said:

you would hope so in France....Oz? doubt it very much...

 

16 hours ago, Gooleboy said:

I am sure it is the talk of Sydney!

A French side finishing both top of Super League and the Championship is a fairly big RL news story imo, something which is rather big over there 

[Damien]

1 minute ago, Saint Toppy said:

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. Personally I think this system just allows teams to 'coast' for most of the season knowing they just have to do enough to make it into the play-offs and to then just have to be at their best for 2 or 3 games at the end of the year to pick up the biggest prize. Once they've secured that play-off place they can also be selective in team selection and be prepared to 'throw' games to ensure they peak for the last 2 or 3.

Yep. Teams coast and it effects weekly rounds. Play off attendances are also very poor. When we are talking about the quality of the offering given to Sky the play off format contribute negatively for much of the season when it comes to the intensity of the competition. As said there wasn't even a LLS for the first 5 years, that was the value that was placed on finishing top by the RFL and clubs.

I love the Grand Final and as an event it is a special night but it seems to have cannibalised everything else. Before that we were getting steady 35k crowds for the Premiership final, big Challenge Cup semi final attendances and of course big crowds for Challenge Cup finals itself. There were also some epic league run ins. As I said it's a special night but I think it negatively impacts on the season overall. Whether returning to the Premiership trophy and the same night time match format can replicate that I'm not sure but I think it may and having the team that finishes top as champions would certainly restore more meaning to the season.

[Damien]

20 minutes ago, Davo5 said:

How many of those teams who have “coasted”most of the season to scrape into the playoffs actually won it ? Leeds ?

In 2013 when Wigan finished 4th and beat Warrington in the final they certainly coasted and didn't play to their ability.

[Davo5]

6 minutes ago, Damien said:

In 2013 when Wigan finished 4th and beat Warrington in the final they certainly coasted and didn't play to their ability.

So 3 times out of what,23 finals,I’d argue “coasting” the regular season isn’t a favoured way of being crowned champions.

[Tommygilf]

18 minutes ago, Damien said:

There were also some epic league run ins.

Has there not been any for the LLS? 

Its not the number one thing any top club will place at the top of their aims at the start of the season. But if they are within a shout with x games to go, most teams will be disappointed if they have effectively lost it as a trophy to a rival.

[Damien]

8 minutes ago, Davo5 said:

So 3 times out of what,23 finals,I’d argue “coasting” the regular season isn’t a favoured way of being crowned champions.

Well no, I was just giving an example off the top of my head. I also remember this one in particular as I had a long conversation about this very subject with Mark Bitcon who I know well and who was the strength and conditioning coach at the time. He told me that they had specifically chosen to peak for the Challenge Cup and the play offs. The LLS certainly wasn't an aim, just getting in the play offs, and this was the philosophy for quite some time. 

[Gooleboy]

2 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

 

A French side finishing both top of Super League and the Championship is a fairly big RL news story imo, something which is rather big over there 

If they both win their Grand Finals yes, but not sure for winning the Hub Caps.

[Dave T]

2 hours ago, Davo5 said:

So 3 times out of what,23 finals,I’d argue “coasting” the regular season isn’t a favoured way of being crowned champions.

I'd also argue that it isn't coasting. If Wigan now go on to win it from 4th, it doesn't mean they have coasted. It means they have just been average at times and then had a good run at the end of the year. Wigan's bad run isn't any kind of plan, just as Leeds' wasn't. 

[Blind side johnny]

29 minutes ago, Gooleboy said:

If they both win their Grand Finals yes, but not sure for winning the Hub Caps.

Really - are French RL fans equally cynical?

I didn't know that, but now I do.

[kiggy]

37 minutes ago, Gooleboy said:

If they both win their Grand Finals yes, but not sure for winning the Hub Caps.

Winning the league is a big thing over here. Hub Caps = Titles. They don't belittle their champions so much as the British do.

 

[bobbruce]

3 minutes ago, kiggy said:

Winning the league is a big thing over here. Hub Caps = Titles. They don't belittle their champions so much as the British do.

 

You’ll notice the people who belittle it are usually the ones who haven’t won it that year

[Griff]

3 hours ago, Damien said:

The big clubs don't aim to win the LLS.....

And your source for this is ....?

[Gooleboy]

35 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

You’ll notice the people who belittle it are usually the ones who haven’t won it that year

If you mean me, I don't belittle winning the Hub Caps, I have always been an advocate of if you play every team home and away you should be Champions, but that isn't the case in our game, unfortunately in my opinion. My earlier point was in reply to SKS that I wouldn't have thought who wins the Hub Caps over here would be big news Down Under, but winning the Grand Final probably would.

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

1 hour ago, Gooleboy said:

If they both win their Grand Finals yes, but not sure for winning the Hub Caps.

What did you think about Leeds winning the Grand Final from 5th?

[bobbruce]

22 minutes ago, Gooleboy said:

If you mean me, I don't belittle winning the Hub Caps, I have always been an advocate of if you play every team home and away you should be Champions, but that isn't the case in our game, unfortunately in my opinion. My earlier point was in reply to SKS that I wouldn't have thought who wins the Hub Caps over here would be big news Down Under, but winning the Grand Final probably would.

No one in particular just fans in general. If Teams win it they celebrate it but knowing the big prize is to come. If they lose it’s dismissed as the hub cap. In the same way premiership football teams love winning the FA or league cup but if another team wins it it’s Mickey Mouse. 

[Gooleboy]

40 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

What did you think about Leeds winning the Grand Final from 5th?

No problem with it, they peaked at the right time, with the rules as they are that the Play Off winners are Champions.

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

1 hour ago, Gooleboy said:

No problem with it, they peaked at the right time, with the rules as they are that the Play Off winners are Champions.

I agree, but think the League Leaders should also be recognised for their achievement 

[Gooleboy]

24 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

I agree, but think the League Leaders should also be recognised for their achievement 

It's difficult to give it much recognition when they aren't Champions. Pre SL as you know, finishing top you were the Champions and received that wonderful trophy. Then winning the Premiership Play Offs at Old Trafford also carried kudos with it too, and it was a great RL day.