Fri 16th Sept: SL: Wigan Warriors v Leeds Rhinos KO 20:00 (Sky)

[Live after death]

24 minutes ago, Ant said:

Disagree

 

Coming top after 27 rounds is a phenomenal achievement 

Winning a couple of knockout games is less so 

The fear and hatred that Leeds might do it from 5th again.

[StandOffHalf]

10 minutes ago, dkw said:

That's a brilliant 5 minutes of tv, a coach massively emotional, players with fans, players with family. Losing coaches and players showing class. Magnificent television. 

Matt Peet is a class act, turned the interview from being Wigan failed to Leeds succeeding. Been really impressed by him this season. 

Really well said. His compliments and humbleness have a genuine quality.

Both coaches were wonderful post-match.

[Damien]

1 minute ago, Live after death said:

The fear and hatred that Leeds might do it from 5th again.

Fair play to Leeds if they manage to go on and win the Grand Final and take advantage of the system in place.

However people can't then moan when much of the season becomes a procession once teams are safely in the play offs and teams play weakened sides and don't take games seriously.

[Niels]

Peet was being very magnaninous but I think he made a key mistake tonight at half time. French coming out for the second half was an error. He could hardly walk and it seemed to unsettle the defence. 

Also, with a weakened St Helen's side, this was a massive opportunity for Wigan. Leeds were 4/1 at half time so something went badly wrong. 

The sending off didn't really make a difference as it was 14-4 and Wigan did not look like scoring twice by then.

Leeds of course played very well. I think Smith has outcoached both McNamara and Peet. He has installed a great defensive system especially. 

 

 

[Tommygilf]

8 minutes ago, Damien said:

Fair play to Leeds if they manage to go on and win the Grand Final and take advantage of the system in place.

However people can't then moan when much of the season becomes a procession once teams are safely in the play offs and teams play weakened sides and don't take games seriously.

Judging by Catalans, Huddersfield and now Wigan too from just this year alone, that coast to the playoffs mentality doesn't seem to be that successful.

[7723]

Thought Peet got the game plan wrong today by trying to play through the forwards which isn’t really something we have done all year. Biggest loss for us was not having Cust, his organisation was really missed.

[Damien]

Just now, Tommygilf said:

Judging by Catalans, Huddersfield and now Wigan too from just this year alone, that coast to the playoffs mentality doesn't seem to be that successful.

I find this a very simplistic reply and a bit weird mentioning Catalans when they only won 1 game more than Leeds. Leeds also played a weakened team v Catalans 2 weeks before the play offs. Its by no means just the top teams that are doing this. The play offs simply result in too many meaningless games and we see it season after season.

The Grand Final is a great occasion and I understand why people like the play offs. However I feel like much if the season suffers as a result. This is all for a different thread though.

[Ray Cashmere]

18 minutes ago, Damien said:

Fair play to Leeds if they manage to go on and win the Grand Final and take advantage of the system in place.

However people can't then moan when much of the season becomes a procession once teams are safely in the play offs and teams play weakened sides and don't take games seriously.

If teams want to take their foot off the gas just before the play offs then they’ll end up being knocked out. 
 Salford have made the semis and Leeds the final because they’ve effectively been playing play off rugby for 2 months. 
 
The sooner people see the play offs make *more* games matter, due to the importance of momentum, the better. In a regular format, Leeds finish this season mid table and nothing to play for for months leading to sub-10k home crowds. Instead, they’ve had a  sellout final home game and 3,000+ away days. 
 

In a sport so desperate for narratives, Leeds and Salford’s stories (so far) have provided them.  

[Chris22]

I'm stunned by that result. I didn't think Leeds had a performance like that in them. Their defence was outstanding and to soak up so much pressure is testament to their improved discipline. If Leeds play like that next week, they have a very good chance, whoever they play.

For Wigan, I think we saw the value of Farrell tonight. Leuluai looked far slower than Cust in attack too and made me realise that I've probably underrated him this year.

Enjoyable play off match and 3 wins from 3 for away sides. I hope that ends tomorrow!

[sweaty craiq]

6 hours ago, Jim Prendle said:

To be honest the only thing we are ambivalent about is Leigh.

Let's face it, you are pretty pointless.

Oops

[Snowys Backside]

The best side won and Leeds' defence was fantastic.

Wigan looked a bit stereotyped and easy to read. More offloads and second phase carve any team up defensively but made it quite comfortable in the end.

As for Tomorrow ?  What an opportunity for Salford. Saints missing players (OK Salford missing Croft) and Leeds missing their star half back next week too. Could this season be THE season for a bit of change ?

[Damien]

1 minute ago, Ray Cashmere said:

If teams want to take their foot off the gas just before the play offs then they’ll end up being knocked out. 
 Salford have made the semis and Leeds the final because they’ve effectively been playing play off rugby for 2 months. 
 
The sooner people see the play offs make *more* games matter, due to the importance of momentum, the better. In a regular format, Leeds finish this season mid table and nothing to play for for months leading to sub-10k home crowds. Instead, they’ve had a  sellout final home game and 3,000+ away days. 
 

In a sport so desperate for narratives, Leeds and Salford’s stories (so far) have provided them.  

It's not just before the playoffs. There are too many games throughout the season like this. Additionally a league season should be much more than peaking for 1-2 months. A team could be easily the best team for 6 months then pick up bad injuries and not win anything as a result. Winning a league should be for the best team over the course of the season. What you describe is a cup, which is what the play offs essentially are.

Just to note I have no issue with whatever team wins under this system as it is the system set out at the start of the season. Everyone knows the rules and my team has won the Grand Final both when I think they were the best team that season and also when I don't think they were. However the point that was raised by another poster was if this system was a good one and I don't think it is. Again though this is a match thread, not a league structure thread.

[Ray Cashmere]

8 minutes ago, Damien said:

It's not just before the playoffs. There are too many games throughout the season like this. Additionally a league season should be much more than peaking for 1-2 months. A team could be easily the best team for 6 months then pick up bad injuries and not win anything as a result. Winning a league should be for the best team over the course of the season. What you describe is a cup, which is what the play offs essentially are.

Just to note I have no issue with whatever team wins under this system as it is the system set out at the start of the season. Everyone knows the rules and my team has won the Grand Final both when I think they were the best team that season and also when I don't think they were. However the point that was raised by another poster was if this system was a good one and I don't think it is. Again though this is a match thread, not a league structure thread.

And under a regular league format this season- with only Wigan and Saints in realistic contention to finish top with half a dozen games left- what happens? 

It works in football because you still have Europe to play for. Unless you’re in serious contention for that top spot *every* league game then becomes meaningless: Leeds’ season over by May, Catalans’ by July. 

In fairness though, Wire’s season would still be over by March…

Also, it is worth pointing out that the play offs do statistically reward the best teams: 

 

Unless we no longer want any unpredictability or narrative in our game…

Edited September 16, 2022 by Ray Cashmere

[Damien]

Just now, Ray Cashmere said:

And under a regular league format this season- with only Wigan and Saints in realistic contention to finish top with half a dozen games left- what happens? 

It works in football because you still have Europe to play for. Unless you’re in serious contention for that top spot *every* league game then becomes meaningless: Leeds’ season over by May, Catalans’ by July. 
 

In fairness though, Wire’s season would still be over by March…

Well thats better than 6 months not mattering. If a teams season is over early its a consequence of not being very good, thats sport. You obviously don't believe in a team finishing top of the league being league champions and that's fine. I don't really believe in contrived systems to fill some sort of insecurity about our sport. We also used to have the Premiership Trophy to still give teams something to play for. Again though this isn't the thread for this debate so I'll bow out.

[fieldofclothofgold]

1 hour ago, Ant said:

As well as Leeds have played tonight, this result entirely underline why I think the playoffs are a very poor way to crown the champions 

 

If Saints don't get crowned champions, it makes an absolute mockery of the regular season 

What not again 

[Futtocks]

May have been posted already, but buried in the annual "to play off or not to play off" argument.

 

[fieldofclothofgold]

1 hour ago, Live after death said:

The fear and hatred that Leeds might do it from 5th again.

Yes it's becoming a Leeds legend .not winning from 5th I wouldn't tempt fate ,but actually getting to the final playing all the games away from home .its happened quite a bit and its looks like a Leeds brand . 

[bobbruce]

3 hours ago, Damien said:

I'm disappointed O'Neil has been dropped for Powell too.

Shocking decision

[Padge]

Wigan first half great at keeping Leeds in their own half, not capable of taking advantage of all the good field position due to some excellent Leeds defence and some poor Wigan attacking decisions.

Second half Wigan's plan of give it to the fast lads came unstuck with French being knackered and bizarrely kept on, and the halves creating nothing, without Cust they seemed clueless.

Leeds got from under Wigan's cosh in the second half and once they got a good lead it was all over , Wigan had no ideas in attack and Bateman's brain fart sealed it.

Leeds worthy winners.

 

[bobbruce]

3 hours ago, daz39 said:

Is this a Huddersfield home game? all i can see are empty blue seats.

Obviously that makes the game irrelevant.

Are you out. You’d never guess. 

[fieldofclothofgold]

Noticed the body language of both teams coming off at halftime 

[Damien]

11 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

Shocking decision

Yeah I said this before the game and saw nothing to change my mind. I am not a big fan of Powell plus he'd been out for a while whilst O'Neil had been playing really well. It was a bad call.

[bobbruce]

16 minutes ago, Damien said:

Yeah I said this before the game and saw nothing to change my mind. I am not a big fan of Powell plus he'd been out for a while whilst O'Neil had been playing really well. It was a bad call.

Personally with the players knocking around I thought ONeil had done enough to give himself a shout at an England place. To drop him for Powell seems crazy. 

[Loiner]

Where's Saint Toppy when you need him/her ? What was that quote from a few weeks ago, Leeds will be lucky to get in the play offs and if they do they will go out in the first round. I can almost smell the s**t in your pants from 60 miles away.

[bobbruce]

2 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Where's Saint Toppy when you need him/her ? What was that quote from a few weeks ago, Leeds will be lucky to get in the play offs and if they do they will go out in the first round. I can almost smell the s**t in your pants from 60 miles away.

To be fair I don’t think anyone cares nobody thought you or they could beat Wigan. Basically you’ve just opened it up for anyone of the three teams left to win it.