2025 World Cup Qualification

[Young Blood]

With 9 team confirmed for next years tournament hosts France, and quarter-finalist Australia, New Zealand, England, Tonga, Samoa, Lebanon, Papua New Guinea and Fiji how does qualification for 2025 look how many spots open for each region? 

[UTK]

https://www.intrl.sport/news/road-to-france-rlwc2025-qualifying-process-announced/

Structures that are already decided are contained in there, so we've got (auto-qualified in bold):

Europe (6-8): England, France - Somewhat undefined in the above release but qualifying will occur through the European championships and repechage, with 6 guaranteed we'll likely see Wales and Ireland take two places with Scotland and Italy short favourites to take the remaining two - provides a conundrum to the IRL on enforcing minimum standards as it looks like Greece will miss out to these two nations despite the work being done there.

Americas (2): 2 finalists of 2023 Americas Champs - Jamaica, USA, Canada, Brazil or Chile (whoever placed highest in South American Champs goes to Americas Cup)

Asia-Pacific (5-7): Australia, NZ, Tonga, Samoa, PNG, Fiji - Cook Islands will compete in the repechage for the final spot, very likely to win said repechage yet again.

MEA (1-2): Lebanon - Highest placed outside of Lebanon in 2023 MEA Cup will enter repechage for the potential second spot - Nigeria, South Africa, Ghana and Lebanon.

Initial thoughts: We may have made a mistake giving 2 guaranteed places to the Americas this time around due to the problems in the USA, perhaps MEA may have been a better choice given some of the positive work done in Nigeria and the heritage players that could buffer them in a WC or the fact that South Africa has a more consistent domestic comp with junior competitions present. 

The Scotland/Italy problem is a real one, they may at this stage be more competitive than the Greeks but this is on the strength of heritage alone. It would be a real shame to see the Greeks miss 2025 in favour of nations with dubious eligibility according to the prescribed IRL minimum standards, especially now that Greece can put covid and legality status behind them to move forward.

 

[jim_57]

2 hours ago, UTK said:

https://www.intrl.sport/news/road-to-france-rlwc2025-qualifying-process-announced/

Structures that are already decided are contained in there, so we've got (auto-qualified in bold):

Europe (6-8): England, France - Somewhat undefined in the above release but qualifying will occur through the European championships and repechage, with 6 guaranteed we'll likely see Wales and Ireland take two places with Scotland and Italy short favourites to take the remaining two - provides a conundrum to the IRL on enforcing minimum standards as it looks like Greece will miss out to these two nations despite the work being done there.

Americas (2): 2 finalists of 2023 Americas Champs - Jamaica, USA, Canada, Brazil or Chile (whoever placed highest in South American Champs goes to Americas Cup)

Asia-Pacific (5-7): Australia, NZ, Tonga, Samoa, PNG, Fiji - Cook Islands will compete in the repechage for the final spot, very likely to win said repechage yet again.

MEA (1-2): Lebanon - Highest placed outside of Lebanon in 2023 MEA Cup will enter repechage for the potential second spot - Nigeria, South Africa, Ghana and Lebanon.

Initial thoughts: We may have made a mistake giving 2 guaranteed places to the Americas this time around due to the problems in the USA, perhaps MEA may have been a better choice given some of the positive work done in Nigeria and the heritage players that could buffer them in a WC or the fact that South Africa has a more consistent domestic comp with junior competitions present. 

The Scotland/Italy problem is a real one, they may at this stage be more competitive than the Greeks but this is on the strength of heritage alone. It would be a real shame to see the Greeks miss 2025 in favour of nations with dubious eligibility according to the prescribed IRL minimum standards, especially now that Greece can put covid and legality status behind them to move forward.

 

So essentially the only likely change is USA replacing Greece. Barring of course someone like Serbia or Germany stacking their team with heritage players.

Do Cook Islands go straight in to the repecharge or would they have to face other Asian & Pacific teams first like Phillipines or Solomon Islands? Not that any team will trouble them.

[UTK]

34 minutes ago, jim_57 said:

So essentially the only likely change is USA replacing Greece. Barring of course someone like Serbia or Germany stacking their team with heritage players.

Do Cook Islands go straight in to the repecharge or would they have to face other Asian & Pacific teams first like Phillipines or Solomon Islands? Not that any team will trouble them.

Yeah Greece to USA would be short money as the only change.

Good question about the CI, based on the article below I believe the Phillipines are the only other full member in the Asia-Pacific - Vanuatu and the Solomons are only observers I think. The article seems to indicate the Phillipines have applied to enter a wheelchair team in 2025 and are working towards entering 2029 qualifiers so I'd take that to suggest the CIs will go straight into repechage for 2025.

https://www.rugbyleagueplanet.com/2022/06/13/philippine-olympic-committee-approves-rugby-league-recognition/

[Mathius Hellwege]

5 hours ago, UTK said:

https://www.intrl.sport/news/road-to-france-rlwc2025-qualifying-process-announced/

Structures that are already decided are contained in there, so we've got (auto-qualified in bold):

Europe (6-8): England, France - Somewhat undefined in the above release but qualifying will occur through the European championships and repechage, with 6 guaranteed we'll likely see Wales and Ireland take two places with Scotland and Italy short favourites to take the remaining two - provides a conundrum to the IRL on enforcing minimum standards as it looks like Greece will miss out to these two nations despite the work being done there.

Americas (2): 2 finalists of 2023 Americas Champs - Jamaica, USA, Canada, Brazil or Chile (whoever placed highest in South American Champs goes to Americas Cup)

Asia-Pacific (5-7): Australia, NZ, Tonga, Samoa, PNG, Fiji - Cook Islands will compete in the repechage for the final spot, very likely to win said repechage yet again.

MEA (1-2): Lebanon - Highest placed outside of Lebanon in 2023 MEA Cup will enter repechage for the potential second spot - Nigeria, South Africa, Ghana and Lebanon.

Initial thoughts: We may have made a mistake giving 2 guaranteed places to the Americas this time around due to the problems in the USA, perhaps MEA may have been a better choice given some of the positive work done in Nigeria and the heritage players that could buffer them in a WC or the fact that South Africa has a more consistent domestic comp with junior competitions present. 

The Scotland/Italy problem is a real one, they may at this stage be more competitive than the Greeks but this is on the strength of heritage alone. It would be a real shame to see the Greeks miss 2025 in favour of nations with dubious eligibility according to the prescribed IRL minimum standards, especially now that Greece can put covid and legality status behind them to move forward.

 

Great analysis...share your Americas thoughts as well as Greece(Serbia) vs SCO/ITA

 

deny every nonPIcountry without proper domestic league

[Damien]

I'd have liked to have seen a guaranteed African team. When far more domestic activity is taking place there than the likes of Lebanon, Ireland or Scotland then it needs to be better rewarded.

[langpark]

I cannot work out how Americas got a 2nd guaranteed spot. Was that decision made during the euphoria of Wolfpack, where they hoped Canada might become competitive? 

As for the RLWC2025 draw. I would like to see France in pot 1 with Aus, NZ, and England. So as to avoid having any of them in their group. As a small reward for hosting the tournament. (Yes, reward, without them stepping up, we are endlessly just alternating between UK and Aus). 

[Toby Chopra]

6 minutes ago, langpark said:

I cannot work out how Americas got a 2nd guaranteed spot. Was that decision made during the euphoria of Wolfpack, where they hoped Canada might become competitive? 

As for the RLWC2025 draw. I would like to see France in pot 1 with Aus, NZ, and England. So as to avoid having any of them in their group. As a small reward for hosting the tournament. (Yes, reward, without them stepping up, we are endlessly just alternating between UK and Aus). 

Both good points, which I agree with. 

I'd also like to see the finals draw being made almost immediately, so the top 9 sides know where and when they will be playing with as much notice as possible for travelling fans. 

[jim_57]

3 hours ago, langpark said:

I cannot work out how Americas got a 2nd guaranteed spot. Was that decision made during the euphoria of Wolfpack, where they hoped Canada might become competitive? 

As for the RLWC2025 draw. I would like to see France in pot 1 with Aus, NZ, and England. So as to avoid having any of them in their group. As a small reward for hosting the tournament. (Yes, reward, without them stepping up, we are endlessly just alternating between UK and Aus). 

I vaguely remember the decision was made when USA was penciled in as host but that may be my mind playing tricks on me as that was a while ago.

Ideally it should have been Europe 7, Pacific 7, MEA 2 & Americas 2 playing a repecharge tournament for 2 spots.

[jim_57]

5 hours ago, UTK said:

Yeah Greece to USA would be short money as the only change.

Good question about the CI, based on the article below I believe the Phillipines are the only other full member in the Asia-Pacific - Vanuatu and the Solomons are only observers I think. The article seems to indicate the Phillipines have applied to enter a wheelchair team in 2025 and are working towards entering 2029 qualifiers so I'd take that to suggest the CIs will go straight into repechage for 2025.

https://www.rugbyleagueplanet.com/2022/06/13/philippine-olympic-committee-approves-rugby-league-recognition/

Thanks.

After doing some digging on hecanplayfor the only country I could see maybe breaking the status quo if they go down the heritage route is Germany. The likes of Nigeria, South Africa, Greece, Serbia etc will likely go down to the usual suspects. USA & Jamaica have been gifted spots really.

[pahars]

3 hours ago, langpark said:

 

As for the RLWC2025 draw. I would like to see France in pot 1 with Aus, NZ, and England. So as to avoid having any of them in their group. As a small reward for hosting the tournament. (Yes, reward, without them stepping up, we are endlessly just alternating between UK and Aus). 

I would imagine the French  tournament organisers would quite like a big opening game against NZ or England.  

[Damien]

12 minutes ago, pahars said:

I would imagine the French  tournament organisers would quite like a big opening game against NZ or England.  

Surely a good win would be better.

[gingerjon]

20 minutes ago, pahars said:

I would imagine the French  tournament organisers would quite like a big opening game against NZ or England.  

The English organisers were quite chuffed with a big opening game against Samoa.

It's the opening game ness that's the important bit, really.

[jim_57]

7 minutes ago, Damien said:

Surely a good win would be better.

A European opponent they can beat would probably be best to start the tournament.

[The Partisan]

France v PNG would be a suitable game. Promoters play on the 'national game' angle for PNG.  

Wales another option with European Championship history played on. 

Edited October 31, 2022 by The Partisan

[pahars]

6 minutes ago, Damien said:

Surely a good win would be better.

What’s the opening game then? There is a good chance France will lose against a nation full of heritage players and if it happens with a so so crowd then it’s not good for the tournament.
 

They managed to get 18k vs the Kiwis in Avignon in 2013 and if they play England there will be thousands of our fans there. 

[Damien]

1 minute ago, pahars said:

What’s the opening game then? There is a good chance France will lose against a nation full of heritage players and if it happens with a so so crowd then it’s not good for the tournament.
 

They managed to get 18k vs the Kiwis in Avignon in 2013 and if they play England there will be thousands of our fans there. 

I think for France it is important to win to then setup the tournament. I don't think France getting 50 points put on them by NZ or England would be a good start. The opening game can be a big event no matter who you play. I'd say someone like Wales would be a good, a beatable team that would provide good opposition.

[pahars]

6 minutes ago, Damien said:

I think for France it is important to win to then setup the tournament. I don't think France getting 50 points put on them by NZ or England would be a good start. The opening game can be a big event no matter who you play. I'd say someone like Wales would be a good, a beatable team that would provide good opposition.

I get what you’re saying and I guess a lot of the new audience they are trying to reach would see Wales as a big ‘Rugby’ nation because of the 6 nations.

They have got a few 10k crowds against them too even outside of World Cup hype…. though conversely that was pretty much the only international RL the French could watch those years. 
 

The concern is that RL has much fewer fans in France compared to any nation who has hosted before. It would be great to have an opening game that’s as close as you can get  nailed on to be 30k+ 

[Harry Stottle]

4 hours ago, Damien said:

I'd have liked to have seen a guaranteed African team. When far more domestic activity is taking place there than the likes of Lebanon, Ireland or Scotland then it needs to be better rewarded.

Honest question Damien, which African team(s) are you thinking of?

Would any of those teams have any high ranking 'Heritage' players to call on to bolster their ranks, if not would you be prepared to subject what I should think would be no more than player's of an amatuer status to the World Cup finals competition, and especially after the results we have seen this last weekend?

[MatthewWoody]

4 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Honest question Damien, which African team(s) are you thinking of?

Would any of those teams have any high ranking 'Heritage' players to call on to bolster their ranks, if not would you be prepared to subject what I should think would be no more than player's of an amatuer status to the World Cup finals competition, and especially after the results we have seen this last weekend?

Agree with this. Having a team made of amateur players would bring scores worse than those seen at the 2021 RLWC. 

[Damien]

7 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Honest question Damien, which African team(s) are you thinking of?

Would any of those teams have any high ranking 'Heritage' players to call on to bolster their ranks, if not would you be prepared to subject what I should think would be no more than player's of an amatuer status to the World Cup finals competition, and especially after the results we have seen this last weekend?

There has been great work going on in the likes of Nigeria and Ghana and I don't see why African nations would perform any worse than say the USA or Canada. Heritage players who knows but for me that shouldn't be a key criterion when it comes to a team qualifying for the World Cup. If America has 2 guaranteed World Cup spots then Africa could certainly have one of those at least.

[jim_57]

1 minute ago, Damien said:

There has been great work going on in the likes of Nigeria and Ghana and I don't see why African nations would perform any worse than say the USA or Canada. Heritage players who knows but for me that shouldn't be a key criterion when it comes to a team qualifying for the World Cup. If America has 2 guaranteed World Cup spots then Africa could certainly have one of those at least.

https://www.instagram.com/hecanplayfor/?hl=en

Nigeria & South Africa could call on some decent heritage players if they choose to. Can’t see either beating Cook Islands but you could argue they’d be just as strong as USA/Canada, one of which will get a spot.

[Damien]

Just now, jim_57 said:

https://www.instagram.com/hecanplayfor/?hl=en

Nigeria & South Africa could call on some decent heritage players if they choose to. Can’t see either beating Cook Islands but you could argue they’d be just as strong as USA/Canada, one of which will get a spot.

Yes, I presume they can but as I said to me it shouldn't be the prime motivator behind a team being in the World Cup. I think we need to look beyond that.

[jim_57]

2 minutes ago, Damien said:

Yes, I presume they can but as I said to me it shouldn't be the prime motivator behind a team being in the World Cup. I think we need to look beyond that.

I wasn’t disagreeing, just posting to give people an idea of the heritage pool for those countries should they choose to use it since @Harry Stottleasked.

[Damien]

3 minutes ago, jim_57 said:

I wasn’t disagreeing, just posting to give people an idea of the heritage pool for those countries should they choose to use it since @Harry Stottleasked.

Yeah, I know mate, I didn't mean to sound like I was criticising.