Reality check again

[Live after death]

Here we are again same old same old. 
after the shock and domination and 82 86 kangaroos, we ltd overseas players to 3 then early mid 90’s we caught right up and came within a whisker. We now are further and further behind and not even top 3 side.

fact is if we want to compete again we need the salary up and reduce overseas quota to 5 then 3 within 5 years and no loop holes. 

 

[Jughead]

Or instead of blaming foreigners (bit weird, that) we need to make sure that clubs have structures and strategies in place to develop high quality players to compliment the players we have in Super League and the NRL. IMG’s grading system should certainly play a part in this. 

[Sports Prophet]

15 minutes ago, Live after death said:

Here we are again same old same old. 
after the shock and domination and 82 86 kangaroos, we ltd overseas players to 3 then early mid 90’s we caught right up and came within a whisker. We now are further and further behind and not even top 3 side.

fact is if we want to compete again we need the salary up and reduce overseas quota to 5 then 3 within 5 years and no loop holes. 

 

Funny analogy. The NRL has no such overseas quota and doesn’t stop Australia doing well.

[Live after death]

1 minute ago, Sports Prophet said:

Funny analogy. The NRL has no such overseas quota and doesn’t stop Australia doing well.

Australia brought in an overseas players  ban in the 70’s as too many english players  were going over, hey presto 5-6 years later they went up several levels. 
Australia don’t need a quota as still the vast majority of their league are eligible  for The national side, and the ones that don’t  make the cut go okay for samoa tonga fiji. 

[Jughead]

1 minute ago, Live after death said:

Australia brought in an overseas players  ban in the 70’s as too many english players  were going over, hey presto 5-6 years later they went up several levels. 
Australia don’t need a quota as still the vast majority of their league are eligible  for The national side, and the ones that don’t  make the cut go okay for samoa tonga fiji. 

There’s bundles of players in the NRL that aren’t born in Australia. 

[Live after death]

4 minutes ago, Jughead said:

There’s bundles of players in the NRL that aren’t born in Australia. 

But they aren’t losing failing every time, all by one world cup and one tri nations haven’t lost a series  for 50 years. And France were the last to beat them.

Edited November 12, 2022 by Live after death

[Jughead]

29 minutes ago, Live after death said:

But they aren’t losing failing every time, all by one world cup and one tri nations haven’t lost a series  for 50 years. And France were the last to beat them.

They took their ball home and didn’t play a game after Tonga beat them in 2019, lost two of the last five Anzac Tests, lost two of their last four games before this World Cup and were pushed all the way in the previous World Cup final. 

[Davo5]

We simply don’t produce enough quality players,the number of non English players in our club sides does need looking at especially as they invariably occupy the spine positions,7:players + exemptions is too many but it is far from being the only problem we have.

[eal]

Super League just doesn't provide the intensity required for these big games. Look how calm Samoa were in golden point. Luai, To'o, Crichton, etc have seen it all in the NRL. 

[Agbrigg]

If we had more uk players to chose from you also need a coach to take the risk and pick them. For years we seem to only look at players from a few clubs and also select on reputation as opposed to form

[Agbrigg]

Just now, eal said:

Super League just doesn't provide the intensity required for these big games. Look how calm Samoa were in golden point. Luai, To'o, Crichton, etc have seen it all in the NRL. 

Disagree about golden point, we have had plenty this season. I think wakey alone have had three

[Colin James]

2 minutes ago, Agbrigg said:

If we had more uk players to chose from you also need a coach to take the risk and pick them. For years we seem to only look at players from a few clubs and also select on reputation as opposed to form

That's because there's a few clubs who produce players and a lot that don't.

[Jughead]

6 minutes ago, Colin James said:

That's because there's a few clubs who produce players and a lot that don't.

This is one of the reasons that domestic clubs are to blame, not players from overseas. 

[Davo5]

6 minutes ago, Agbrigg said:

If we had more uk players to chose from you also need a coach to take the risk and pick them. For years we seem to only look at players from a few clubs and also select on reputation as opposed to form

But we had players from,Saints,Leeds,Wigan,Huddersfield,Catalans,Salford,Warrington,Newcastle,Sydney Roosters,South Sydney,Canterbury Bulldogs,Canberra & Brisbane.

[Farmduck]

1 hour ago, Live after death said:

Australia brought in an overseas players  ban in the 70’s as too many english players  were going over, hey presto 5-6 years later they went up several levels. 
Australia don’t need a quota as still the vast majority of their league are eligible  for The national side, and the ones that don’t  make the cut go okay for samoa tonga fiji. 

What year was that? In the 70s there was barely even 1 Brit per club in the NSWRL.

[Tommygilf]

25 minutes ago, Davo5 said:

We simply don’t produce enough quality players,the number of non English players in our club sides does need looking at especially as they invariably occupy the spine positions,7:players + exemptions is too many but it is far from being the only problem we have.

The quality of Super League as a space for the production of top class Rugby League talent has declined over the past decade.

Its twofold. From the bottom, there are less players playing, less quality academy games and less quality top quality players coming through. From the top, the salary cap is too low to attract and/or retain the best talent. So even the top talent we do have ultimately becomes stagnant somewhat.

As the league has become worse interest goes down and its a vicious cycle.

[jacksy]

19 hours ago, Davo5 said:

We simply don’t produce enough quality players,the number of non English players in our club sides does need looking at especially as they invariably occupy the spine positions,7:players + exemptions is too many but it is far from being the only problem we have.

I've said it before and I'm saying it again. The standard in SL is poor.

Its no good raving about Saints, they win and look world beaters because the majority of the opposition is very poor.

Edited November 13, 2022 by jacksy

[Jughead]

3 minutes ago, jacksy said:

I've said it before and I'm saying it again. The standard in SL is poor.

Its no good raving about Saints, they win and look world beaters because the majority of the opposition is very poor.

It’s every bit vital we rave about Saints. They’re the benchmark on and off the pitch. They own their stadium, they’re excellent on the field, they create revenue on non-matchdays through their assets and have an excellent pathway system. The rest need to get up to speed or move out the way. Hopefully the criteria IMG place on clubs is strict and forces change. 

[jacksy]

9 minutes ago, Jughead said:

It’s every bit vital we rave about Saints. They’re the benchmark on and off the pitch. They own their stadium, they’re excellent on the field, they create revenue on non-matchdays through their assets and have an excellent pathway system. The rest need to get up to speed or move out the way. Hopefully the criteria IMG place on clubs is strict and forces change. 

Can't argue with off field facts above.

However, as i said saints look world beaters because the opposition is increasingly poor.

I hope I'm(keegan rant v aussies) wrong but i think saints will get well beaten in the wcc.

 

Edited November 13, 2022 by jacksy

[Jughead]

Just now, jacksy said:

Can't argue with off field facts above.

However, as i said saints look world beaters because the opposition is increasingly poor.

I hope I'm(keegan rant v aussies) wrong but i think saints will get well beaten in the wcc.

That’s not Saints’ fault that the competition is so poor and that they’ve got their house in order (as have one or two others) and the vast majority of others are stuck in a cycle of short-termism. 

We probably will get beat against a full-strength Penrith side, that’s no disgrace, their competition as a whole is far superior on and off the pitch to ours and perspective is required. 

[jacksy]

3 minutes ago, Jughead said:

That’s not Saints’ fault that the competition is so poor and that they’ve got their house in order (as have one or two others) and the vast majority of others are stuck in a cycle of short-termism. 

We probably will get beat against a full-strength Penrith side, that’s no disgrace, their competition as a whole is far superior on and off the pitch to ours and perspective is required. 

Its certainly not saints fault. It truly is the other clubs fault..especially mine.

[Guest]

All comes down to money. That will allow more investment in youth, attract players to the game, allow SL to bring in top tier talent to increase the competitiveness etc.

That's not only crowds, but TV money, sponsors etc.

Until that is sorted it will always be difficult.

That or we become to the NRL what Elite 1 is to SL and we funnel all our talent to the NRL to provide a competitive side.

[Mr Frisky]

4 hours ago, Jughead said:

That’s not Saints’ fault that the competition is so poor and that they’ve got their house in order (as have one or two others) and the vast majority of others are stuck in a cycle of short-termism. 

We probably will get beat against a full-strength Penrith side, that’s no disgrace, their competition as a whole is far superior on and off the pitch to ours and perspective is required. 

Saints will probably lose to Penrith but Saints are a quality side and have a real chance as thry have top players. 

I wonder if we will be so negative about England if Samoa beat Australia next week as we only lost in extra time.

[binosh]

Until it’s mandatory for SL clubs to have a Reserves & Academy we will never have enough competition for places in the player pool. 
 

The league itself is not big enough and should be a minimum of 14 teams, France offer the English game nothing, Samoa, New Zealand, Tonga, Fiji all enhance the NRL.

Funding is needed.

[Tommygilf]

3 minutes ago, binosh said:

Until it’s mandatory for SL clubs to have a Reserves & Academy we will never have enough competition for places in the player pool. 
 

The league itself is not big enough and should be a minimum of 14 teams, France offer the English game nothing, Samoa, New Zealand, Tonga, Fiji all enhance the NRL.

Funding is needed.

Half the English teams offer the English game nothing. France on the other hand currently offers the English game 2 fully professional squads of players, of which 3 of the current England team, including the captain, play for.

Catalans have also won more in their 15 or so year history in the English game than Super League clubs Wakefield, Cas, Huddersfield, Salford, Hull KR have in over 30 years (equalling the 2 pieces of "Treble Silverware" that Hull FC have got in that time too). I only included current Super League sides who have been consistently in the division there, the list is of course much longer.