League Express Twitter Account

[gingerjon]

Do take a look at the quote tweets and replies to the League Express account’s most recent posts if you enjoy childish bickering with serious implications …

[Hull Kingston Bronco]

I guess Martyn's underlying point is you can't please all of the people all of the time, and he thinks Gavin and Andrew are always actively looking for reasons to slag off League Express whatever he does?

Not saying I agree, but I think it's got to that now really. Silence is always the best option. Well, that and not stealing other people's content in the first place I suppose 

[Jughead]

The latest images of the League Express brand strategy meeting. 

[RigbyLuger]

Will Gav get banned from here? 

[OriginalMrC]

Clickbait is a modern curse unfortunately. I unfollowed League Express socials a while ago as a result. Clickbait is bad enough but plagiarism should quite rightly be called out. I think it's completely unacceptable for a journalist to copy someone else's work 

[Martyn Sadler]

1 hour ago, RigbyLuger said:

Will Gav get banned from here? 

Gavin is always welcome on Totalrl.com.

He doesn't need our approval for his comments, either on here or on Twitter, unless of course he would like to submit his comments for my approval. 

[Martyn Sadler]

1 hour ago, OriginalMrC said:

Clickbait is a modern curse unfortunately. I unfollowed League Express socials a while ago as a result. Clickbait is bad enough but plagiarism should quite rightly be called out. I think it's completely unacceptable for a journalist to copy someone else's work 

Clickbait is a modern curse in many ways, regardless of how you define it, but I'm not aware of any online publication that doesn't engage in it to a greater or lesser extent.

Plagiarism should also be called out, but the recent accusation against Callum is that he copied the TV fixtures directly from RugbyLeagueonTV.com.

That isn't actually true, but even if it were, TV broadcast schedules are not the exclusive property of anyone, whether online or not, otherwise we would all have to buy the Radio Times to discover what is on TV next week.

Plagiarism in journalism is usually defined as copying quotes sourced from someone else without attribution, which doesn't happen on our website to my knowledge, despite the fact that in the past there were plenty of occasions when others copied quotes from League Express without attribution.

[Amber Avenger]

If it isn't true that Callum directly copied and pasted from the Rugby League On Tv Website, then it is certainly an extremely unfortunate coincidence that both they and he both made a mistake over the internationals tomorrow

 

 

 

[JohnM]

Surely it depends on the original source. Where did RLonTv cut and paste it from?

[RigbyLuger]

At least League Express haven't retweeted Andrew Tate, like SBW!

[Martyn Sadler]

I notice that someone has tweeted that "Callum Walker is the ultimate clickbait journalist", believing that to be an insult.

In fact, if he were, he would be earning a fortune from a mainstream media organisation working in its online department.

I'm afraid that in the Internet age, clickbait journalism is here to stay. It actually makes serious journalism possible in the modern age and, in so far as it's true for Callum (which it is, but only a little), it pays for this forum. Non-clickbait journalism would otherwise never pay for itself.

[JonM]

18 minutes ago, JohnM said:

Surely it depends on the original source. Where did RLonTv cut and paste it from?

I believe he spends a small amount of time each week collating the information and putting it on his website, which he runs at his own cost. And I'm very grateful that he does.

[Amber Avenger]

16 minutes ago, JohnM said:

Surely it depends on the original source. Where did RLonTv cut and paste it from? 

Perhaps I'm wrong but I can't find this error anywhere else. Ultimately Sky would be responsible for their own listings and it isn't on there, nor can I see it on the Radio Times or Tv Guide.co.uk website.

If you take a look on the RLonTv Twitter feed you'd hopefully see it was a specifically curated hub of information freely available elsewhere. Mistakes can be made on there, sometimes it's human error, sometimes it's because broadcasters don't give two hoots about RL and the info is wrong. Looks like this specific error is human error fair enough. But cut and paste merchants that site is not - in my opinion.

But even if it was an error at source that's one that should be more easily caught out by a professional journalist rather than missed twice you'd think. Like I say calling it an unfortunate coincidence is giving the extreme benefit of the doubt especially as RLonTV was maybe the only place where you got a rundown of every fixture available in the UK until recently even with radio comms. Funny how the League Express article copies the formatting of fixtures, times, stations etc. Again maybe an unfortunate coincidence 

Look yes it's small fry at the end of the day and not the biggest thing in the world but it's worth highlighting that - it seems to me - that the LE/TRL is starting to get a bad reputation for this sort of stuff and it's sad. If Martyn doesn't see it as that big an issue that's fine - he often says if you don't like it, don't read it and to be honest in the past couple of years I don't read any LPL output save for the very occasional article on TRL - maybe once per month. 

[gingerjon]

1 minute ago, Amber Avenger said:

Perhaps I'm wrong but I can't find this error anywhere else. Ultimately Sky would be responsible for their own listings and it isn't on there, nor can I see it on the Radio Times or Tv Guide.co.uk website.

If you take a look on the RLonTv Twitter feed you'd hopefully see it was a specifically curated hub of information freely available elsewhere. Mistakes can be made on there, sometimes it's human error, sometimes it's because broadcasters don't give two hoots about RL and the info is wrong. Looks like this specific error is human error fair enough. But cut and paste merchants that site is not - in my opinion.

But even if it was an error at source that's one that should be more easily caught out by a professional journalist rather than missed twice you'd think. Like I say calling it an unfortunate coincidence is giving the extreme benefit of the doubt especially as RLonTV was maybe the only place where you got a rundown of every fixture available in the UK until recently even with radio comms. Funny how the League Express article copies the formatting of fixtures, times, stations etc. Again maybe an unfortunate coincidence 

Look yes it's small fry at the end of the day and not the biggest thing in the world but it's worth highlighting that - it seems to me - that the LE/TRL is starting to get a bad reputation for this sort of stuff and it's sad. If Martyn doesn't see it as that big an issue that's fine - he often says if you don't like it, don't read it and to be honest in the past couple of years I don't read any LPL output save for the very occasional article on TRL - maybe once per month. 

This won't be the case here but it does remind me of how some maps and dictionaries deliberately put errors/typos in so they knew if they saw them elsewhere that they'd had their stuff copied.

[Martyn Sadler]

21 minutes ago, Amber Avenger said:

Perhaps I'm wrong but I can't find this error anywhere else. Ultimately Sky would be responsible for their own listings and it isn't on there, nor can I see it on the Radio Times or Tv Guide.co.uk website.

Most errors online are corrected when they are spotted.

 

21 minutes ago, Amber Avenger said:

If you take a look on the RLonTv Twitter feed you'd hopefully see it was a specifically curated hub of information freely available elsewhere. Mistakes can be made on there, sometimes it's human error, sometimes it's because broadcasters don't give two hoots about RL and the info is wrong. Looks like this specific error is human error fair enough. But cut and paste merchants that site is not - in my opinion.

Like you, I think the RLonTV website serves a very useful purpose.

 

21 minutes ago, Amber Avenger said:

But even if it was an error at source that's one that should be more easily caught out by a professional journalist rather than missed twice you'd think. Like I say calling it an unfortunate coincidence is giving the extreme benefit of the doubt especially as RLonTV was maybe the only place where you got a rundown of every fixture available in the UK until recently even with radio comms. Funny how the League Express article copies the formatting of fixtures, times, stations etc. Again maybe an unfortunate coincidence 

It would be nice if we never made mistakes, but sometimes they do happen.

And it's not a League Express article, it's a Totalrl.com article. Sorry to point out your mistake. Perhaps you can try harder next time.

And on your latter point, there are not many potential alternative formats for fixtures, times and stations, so if you invent a good format for presenting that information, someone is likely to copy you.

21 minutes ago, Amber Avenger said:

Look yes it's small fry at the end of the day and not the biggest thing in the world but it's worth highlighting that - it seems to me - that the LE/TRL is starting to get a bad reputation for this sort of stuff and it's sad. If Martyn doesn't see it as that big an issue that's fine - he often says if you don't like it, don't read it and to be honest in the past couple of years I don't read any LPL output save for the very occasional article on TRL - maybe once per month. 

I have never said that I don't see it as a big issue, but the truth is that some of the attacks against us that you see on Twitter are frankly misconceived, sometimes fuelled by animus against me personally, or Callum or our organisation, particularly from people whose identity is not openly revealed.

We do correct posters on Twitter when we can, and if we are wrong about something, we will admit it.

You are, of course, perfectly entitled to read what you want from any source you like, but, as I've said several times before, we have never been in a healthier situation with the number of visitors to our website and the income it's generating.

Some people are reluctant to concede that even though they don't like something, plenty of other people do.

You with LPL are a bit like me with Scotch Whisky.

The difference is that I don't go online or onto forums to criticise Scotch Whisky, its producers or its consumers, particularly while using facilities that Scotch Whisky is actually paying for.

[Amber Avenger]

Most errors online are corrected when they are spotted. 

 
Sorry, to be clear, are you are saying there was an error at source then that both RL on TV and TRL failed to pick up that has then been corrected everywhere else except here? It's still on the TRL article tonight so not always hey. Perhaps you can try harder next time!

And it's not a League Express article, it's a Totalrl.com article. Sorry to point out your mistake. Perhaps you can try harder next time.

And on your latter point, there are not many potential alternative formats for fixtures, times and stations, so if you invent a good format someone is likely to copy you. 

Good to see some credit RL on TV's great work. I profusely apologise for confusing your brands, you see I saw it being tweeted from the League Express Twitter account. How on earth could anyone get confused over that...! And in a thread with League Express in the title too. All the clues were there.

 You with LPL are a bit like me with Scotch Whisky.

The difference is that I don't go online or onto forums to criticise Scotch Whisky, its producers or its consumers, particularly while using facilities that Scotch Whisky is actually paying for. 

A great analogy. The only tiny way in which I could improve it, it would be if I'd really liked Scotch Whisky, was actually really fond of it and bought hundreds if not thousands of pounds of it's products over two and a half decades, and had maybe even used their forum facilities over that time to make thousands of posts in good faith discussions with fellow like minded individuals and - if I can say so - had a (small) reputation for being a reasonable and fair minded poster.  Then one day, they've changed the recipe of the whiskey and I just stop buying it and leave the website no fuss. Then over the past few months I see on social media they see other people concerned about the reputation of the company after some interesting feed back on the Whisky Twitter today from people running the account to then use the forums again to see what the response to this was having been emotionally invested in the brand before even if I wasn't physically buying the product any more. 

Listen I get it, I've come on here to not only say this isn't a good look but I don't buy your products any more, I'm not expecting a ticker tape parade, but even if you don't agree with me, I'd hope you'd understand why some people might think the optics of incidents like this are poor, as have IMO, some of the LPL replies on Twitter today. For the record my issue isn't with the clickbait reputation (although for the record - surprise I'm not a fan), it's more that it's the reputation that a couple of articles on your site are being accused of being copied wholesale from other sources without credit. You've been on here and defended the incidents in question. You know the truth, not us. I guess not much more to it but it doesn't look great to me but it's not my company as you've been particularly keen to make very clear. 

Happy to pay the server costs for my posts if it's the issue. Hear the website is doing pretty well though...!

I guess in the analogy, I'd never changed the master distillers mind with any of my feedback in the past, what did I expect now. That's on me!

Plenty of people like it - good for you. As sure as people are struggling to not like that I hope you are at peace with the fact that there are plenty who aren't. I'm sure you'll say you are!

Edited April 28, 2023 by Amber Avenger

[JohnM]

2 hours ago, JonM said:

I believe he spends a small amount of time each week collating the information and putting it on his website, which he runs at his own cost. And I'm very grateful that he does.

I don't disagree with any of that. It's the site of record for me. I did, though, feel it reasonable to ask if the error was made by the original source and had slipped through more than one net.

[Chris22]

It's quite a remarkable claim to say that the information wasn't copied and pasted and both author's simply happen to make the same typo.

[The Blues Ox]

Ad-Blockers are your friend, it is one of the very small ways that you can actually hit them where it hurts if you are that way inclined that and the obvious about avoiding clicking links.

[RigbyLuger]

No tweets about the internationals but one about Ryan Hampshire playing for Wigan reserves? Someone lost the password?

[Dunbar]

On 28/04/2023 at 18:06, Martyn Sadler said:

I notice that someone has tweeted that "Callum Walker is the ultimate clickbait journalist", believing that to be an insult.

In fact, if he were, he would be earning a fortune from a mainstream media organisation working in its online department.

I'm afraid that in the Internet age, clickbait journalism is here to stay. It actually makes serious journalism possible in the modern age and, in so far as it's true for Callum (which it is, but only a little), it pays for this forum. Non-clickbait journalism would otherwise never pay for itself.

Do journalists on online departments of mainstream media organisations really earn a fortune?

[Amber Avenger]

I see that this week the TV page on TRL has slightly changed the format for presenting fixtures, putting the kick off time at the end of the fixture and adding the words "kick off", not how it appears on the RL on TV website at all.

I guess a different way can be found of presenting that information after all...!

[Martyn Sadler]

18 hours ago, Amber Avenger said:

I see that this week the TV page on TRL has slightly changed the format for presenting fixtures, putting the kick off time at the end of the fixture and adding the words "kick off", not how it appears on the RL on TV website at all.

I guess a different way can be found of presenting that information after all...!

Callum did it deliberately, hoping someone would notice.

Thanks for doing so.

Perhaps you can give us a weekly report on the style used to present TV viewing information on this website.

[Amber Avenger]

Sure thing

The Ten fixtures Callum has copied from RL on TV this week - and the last one will SHOCK you 

 

(Was actually checking to see if RL on TV got a credit this week as suggested on Twitter last week. I guess that was decided against)

Edited May 3, 2023 by Amber Avenger