Super league addition to NRL vegas double-header

[gingerjon]

14 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

I must have missed something... Isn't that what everyone says?

There's no money to be made from US gambling as, unlike Australia, bookies do not pay a licence fee for betting on a particular sport or league. Therefore there is no profit for the NRL that way. Not even V'landys pretends there's a market there now, the wording changed once he (or the wider NRL) realised the realities of the US betting market.

The success of Vegas this year was entirely in boosted visibility and branding within Australia. That's not going to change.

[northamptoncougar]

Whatever happens I’m off to watch it next year.

There’s only a select amount of other SL teams that could realistically go, Leeds, Saints, Cats, Wigan and maybe Hull KR, the rest are too poor or are basket cases (Leeds are a basket case but commercially they’re fine.)

A SL game on the Saturday and then a double header in the Sunday would be immense.

[John bird]

4 minutes ago, northamptoncougar said:

Whatever happens I’m off to watch it next year.

There’s only a select amount of other SL teams that could realistically go, Leeds, Saints, Cats, Wigan and maybe Hull KR, the rest are too poor or are basket cases (Leeds are a basket case but commercially they’re fine.)

A SL game on the Saturday and then a double header in the Sunday would be immense.

Would they really have a lone super league game in a 61k stadium ?

[sam4731]

4 hours ago, Whippet13 said:

It would badly disrupt both the SL and NRL seasons, neither organisation would support a world club series at present.

I can potentially see more league games being played over there in a season though, maybe 2 SL games in 2026 for example, if 2025 works.

What's the endgame here though? With the NFL's international series the goal is to eventually have a team in London but developing the game in USA doesn't even seem to be the aim of this concept.

[gingerjon]

1 hour ago, sam4731 said:

With the NFL's international series the goal is to eventually have a team in London 

That is one option. It is not the preferred option for most of the people involved.

It also doesn't explain the international series games in Mexico, Brazil and Germany.

Having multiple ideas and taking time to explore them - that's a strength of the NFL approach.

[sam4731]

28 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

That is one option. It is not the preferred option for most of the people involved.

It also doesn't explain the international series games in Mexico, Brazil and Germany.

Having multiple ideas and taking time to explore them - that's a strength of the NFL approach.

Yes but the commissioner has gone on record as saying that having an NFL team in London is the aim. The international series is 17 years old and it's still not fully on the cards. Taking games to Mexico, Brazil and Germany is very much in it's infancy.

[John bird]

7 minutes ago, sam4731 said:

Yes but the commissioner has gone on record as saying that having an NFL team in London is the aim. The international series is 17 years old and it's still not fully on the cards. Taking games to Mexico, Brazil and Germany is very much in it's infancy.

Saying one thing and doing another are two completely different things. Peter v’landys says one week he wants an NRL team in Perth and then the next week he says he wants a team in Christchurch and the following week he says he wants another team in Melbourne.

maybe the NFL are content with just taking regular season games to London every year and make a few million in the process.

[THE RED ROOSTER]

9 hours ago, Fly-By-TheWire said:

New to watching Warrington, are we? 
 

Ahem not a Warrington fan actually, but interesting to know you have no faith in your team. Try watching mine and you would have something to complain about....

Couple more comments relevant to this thread, Firstly the idea was post - Vegas to have NRLW game as the third match at Vegas. This seems to have gone out the window.

V'landys has sold this as a four year plan, it's not looking good if you then have to import to UK teams to bump up the number in attendance at Allegiant Stadium because it indicates the NRL is not cutting through and to be changing strategy after one event smacks of panic.

Now going slightly off topic, on the NFL London Franchise, speaking last year at an NFL UK function at Battersea Power Station Commissioner Roger Goodell stated the long term goal for the NFL is to establish a European Division with four teams to increase revenue from TV in the US and Europe and to reduce logistical issues this side of the pond. Remember Jacksonville Jaguars already play two games in the UK (Home and Away) anyway and this will increase while the Jags stadium is rebuilt with the possibility of three games so in effect the Jags are already promoted as London's team.

Comparing the NFL with over 40 years of International Games with the NRL in Vegas after one year is like comparing apples and oranges. Though perhaps the NRL missed a trick in not allowing the Roosters to return and buiold a following, to become the Jacksonville equivalent in the US as "America's team". as Uncle Nick wanted.

 

[N2022]

11 hours ago, Damien said:

The thing is our big clubs aren't bad off financially and many have big backers and assets. You mention Wigan but the owner, Mike Danson, is a billionaire. They are not ripe for takeover and the owners certainly have no need to allow it. I don't think they will be railroaded into any takeover. Similarly Leeds, Warrington, Saints and Catalans. Hull KR are strong these days too. Smaller clubs may well be after whatever money they can get but nothing will happen without the big clubs and with the best will in the world the NRL won't really be interested in the smaller ones.

The biggest differentiator between the clubs in both competitions is the size of the NRL TV deal compared to SL. That has been the cause of the NRL pulling away and the gap widening between the NRL and SL. That is absolutely a result of the failings by the games adminstrators in this country over the last decade or so. It is the TV deal the RFL/IMG need to greatly improve more than anything else.

Gap widening but their amazing multiple champions can't get a win in WCC at the third time of trying?

[Damien]

7 hours ago, N2022 said:

Gap widening but their amazing multiple champions can't get a win in WCC at the third time of trying?

Ah, lets just pretend everything is equal between SL and the NRL because of one game and that the NRL isn't ahead at all.

[Sports Prophet]

10 hours ago, THE RED ROOSTER said:

…

V'landys has sold this as a four year plan, it's not looking good if you then have to import to UK teams to bump up the number in attendance at Allegiant Stadium because it indicates the NRL is not cutting through and to be changing strategy after one event smacks of panic...

This is the first thing that comes to mind. Accusations at the same time from a club CEO that Vegas was a disaster seems to support the theory SL clubs are being brought in to help bolster the numbers of travelling support.

I expect it will work. What it does compete with is the discretionary spend of British SL club supporters. Surely it will mean an immediate reduction in fans willing to afford both a Vegas trip and/or Magic/Challenge Cup Semi/Final.

I don’t really see what the SL clubs have to gain out of this because I’m sure it won’t be a healthy pay day.

[The Future is League]

6 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

This is the first thing that comes to mind. Accusations at the same time from a club CEO that Vegas was a disaster seems to support the theory SL clubs are being brought in to help bolster the numbers of travelling support.

I expect it will work. What it does compete with is the discretionary spend of British SL club supporters. Surely it will mean an immediate reduction in fans willing to afford both a Vegas trip and/or Magic/Challenge Cup Semi/Final.

I don’t really see what the SL clubs have to gain out of this because I’m sure it won’t be a healthy pay day.

IF the Super Leagues expenses are met in full and its for competion points that will do me.

[N2022]

16 hours ago, Damien said:

Ah, lets just pretend everything is equal between SL and the NRL because of one game and that the NRL isn't ahead at all.

Realistically I'm partly having a bit of fun with my post, but actually when Penrith repeatedly fail to beat our champions they leave a question unanswered. And you challenge a view that NRL 'isn't ahead at all' which people's admiration of NRL and Aus v Eng record makes me think is sensible of you, but iirc I was replying to a post which said the NRL was 'streets ahead' or something like that, and there I think there's some hype going on that is harder to evdence.

[N2022]

On 27/05/2024 at 15:41, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

I wonder if another English WCC win will start to get the Aussie thinking?

Especially if it was another team....i.e. maybe Wire do them this time 

 

Thinking what? Let's make it a bigger comp to boost NRL chances, or let's not bother as we don't need this? Genuine question...

[Damien]

6 hours ago, N2022 said:

Realistically I'm partly having a bit of fun with my post, but actually when Penrith repeatedly fail to beat our champions they leave a question unanswered. And you challenge a view that NRL 'isn't ahead at all' which people's admiration of NRL and Aus v Eng record makes me think is sensible of you, but iirc I was replying to a post which said the NRL was 'streets ahead' or something like that, and there I think there's some hype going on that is harder to evdence.

I mean if you just ignore stuff like the respective TV deals, crowds, participation numbers, club profits, NRL profits, salary cap and just about every metric available I suppose you could say the NRL isn't ahead and the gap isn't widening. 

Edited May 29, 2024 by Damien

[RP London]

On 27/05/2024 at 19:57, gingerjon said:

That is one option. It is not the preferred option for most of the people involved.

It also doesn't explain the international series games in Mexico, Brazil and Germany.

Having multiple ideas and taking time to explore them - that's a strength of the NFL approach.

Sometimes things are said to garner headlines and to test the reaction. Realistically how was a London team going to be included in the Conference and Divisional structures? who was going to make way (Jacksonville was always spoken about mainly due to Khan but taking teams off cities often has blow back) or were you looking at expansion, at which point how many teams would you need and where etc etc.. 

They very much looking at testing waters with the UK being one of the safest "new" options out there and then to see where it went from there, as you say having many options means they can test many things, what they are doing every year is selling more merch and growing the game. 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

9 hours ago, N2022 said:

Thinking what? Let's make it a bigger comp to boost NRL chances, or let's not bother as we don't need this? Genuine question...

Maybe that SL isn't as *hite as they think 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

2 hours ago, Damien said:

I mean if you just ignore stuff like the respective TV deals, crowds, participation numbers, club profits, NRL profits, salary cap and just about every metric available I suppose you could say the NRL isn't ahead and the gap isn't widening. 

Oooo....you mentioned metrics 

Some people are very sensitive on here about metrics 

I would try and practice metric- caution 

Edited May 29, 2024 by Bedfordshire Bronco

[Dave T]

It would be nice if SL had its own plans and went about delivering them. 

 

[Damien]

4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

It would be nice if SL had its own plans and went about delivering them. 

Yeah, this just seems like SL wanting a free ride and hanging onto the coat tails of the NRL. Now I'm sure the NRL are on board because of the fan element, which is essentially what SL bring to the table, but it does come across as SL being typically reactive and desperate to be honest.

[N2022]

17 hours ago, Damien said:

I mean if you just ignore stuff like the respective TV deals, crowds, participation numbers, club profits, NRL profits, salary cap and just about every metric available I suppose you could say the NRL isn't ahead and the gap isn't widening. 

I credit you with most of those but participation is not necessarily NRL v SL, other factors at play.

I'm still interested to see when the seemingly minor/secondary metric of winning a WCC match next points to NRL.leaving SL behind. If they're so superior you'd have thought they'd be strolling them every year. 

[John bird]

https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl-premiership/nrl-2024-news-canberra-raiders-emerge-as-las-vegas-dark-horse-amid-nfl-nod/news-story/0fd720354cdec309e78201ecd1558a6c