Hull Junior Player Numbers Boost

[Damien]

Its really good to hear this. Hull has always been a hot bed of the game, with great numbers of clubs and players, albeit in decline since its heyday like many places. As such its fantastic to see both the Hull clubs working together to arrest this decline and it can only bode well for the future:

 

[Eddie]

Brilliant news  

[The Hallucinating Goose]

Great news! There's always junior games going on when you walk through the city's parks and playing fields, the games always gonna be really strong here!

[JM2010]

Great news. Just goes to show what can be done if clubs work together. Do any other clubs in close proximity work together to increase participation? Wigan/Leigh, Wakefield/Castleford etc

[unapologetic pedant]

Girls will likely represent a significant part of the increase.

One has to hope Hull or Rovers will soon take the steps required to ensure at least one Humberside club in WSL. So that more of the players coming through the grades don't go to York or elsewhere. 

[gingerjon]

8 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

Girls will likely represent a significant part of the increase.

One has to hope Hull or Rovers will soon take the steps required to ensure at least one Humberside club in WSL. So that more of the players coming through the grades don't go to York or elsewhere. 

By it's absence, the lack of mention of 'girls' in the full page is quite revealing about priorities.

https://www.hullfc.com/blog/2024/09/17/community-club-participation-levels-up-by-67-across-hull-since-2018/

[Wellsy4HullFC]

5 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

By it's absence, the lack of mention of 'girls' in the full page is quite revealing about priorities.

https://www.hullfc.com/blog/2024/09/17/community-club-participation-levels-up-by-67-across-hull-since-2018/

How so? That there aren't prioritised? Or that overall participation is prioritised and they are hidden among the total participation numbers to show an overall increase (and therefore a potential decrease in boys numbers)?

Edited September 18 by Wellsy4HullFC

[Damien]

6 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

By it's absence, the lack of mention of 'girls' in the full page is quite revealing about priorities.

https://www.hullfc.com/blog/2024/09/17/community-club-participation-levels-up-by-67-across-hull-since-2018/

That article makes for a great read. From that this is all so pleasing to see:

All ten clubs that were already formed in 2018 have seen significant increases in participation levels, while the formation of two new clubs in that time in the form of Kingswood Knights and Bransholme Bears have increased that figure even further.

2,518 youngsters now represent the region’s community clubs, compared to 1,505 six years ago meaning over 1,000 more junior players are now playing Rugby League in and around Hull.

Following the formation of the partnership in 2018, an increase in participation of 11% after the conclusion of the first 12 months was recorded – that figure is now dwarfed following a rapid increase over the past five years, even with the disruption of the Covid-19 pandemic in which all grassroots sport was halted.

Myton Warriors and Cottingham Tigers have seen the biggest increase in participation respectively, with increases of 130% and 113% – more than doubling their previous total number of players.

Meanwhile, well-established clubs Skirlaugh Bulls, West Hull, East Hull and Hull Wyke all continue to lead the way in terms of player numbers, all hosting over 300 junior players in 2024.

The Hull district is now the leading area in the country for increasing playing numbers, with the decline in grassroots participation seen during the 2010s has now been firmly reversed

[Just Browny]

26 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

By it's absence, the lack of mention of 'girls' in the full page is quite revealing about priorities.

https://www.hullfc.com/blog/2024/09/17/community-club-participation-levels-up-by-67-across-hull-since-2018/

You're going to need to explain the injustice here a bit more. If the 67% increase is attributable in some part to girls' participation, that shows prioritisation of it is taking place somewhere even if not in how the press release is written up.

[gingerjon]

29 minutes ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

How so? That there aren't prioritised? Or that overall participation is prioritised and they are hidden among the total participation numbers to show an overall increase (and therefore a potential decrease in boys numbers)?

You would just expect a specific mention of any increase in girls' participation within a whole article like that. There isn't one.

That is, along with pretty much everything else about the state of the women's game in RL, revealing.

It is very good news to see the increase in participation but I was responding to the other poster's comment about girls' participation in particular. RL makes it very clear through its actions that it mostly doesn't care about it.

[The Future is League]

I hope Saford and Huddersfield can show te same rise in Rugby League juniors in their areas.

[Wellsy4HullFC]

59 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

You would just expect a specific mention of any increase in girls' participation within a whole article like that. There isn't one.

That is, along with pretty much everything else about the state of the women's game in RL, revealing.

It is very good news to see the increase in participation but I was responding to the other poster's comment about girls' participation in particular. RL makes it very clear through its actions that it mostly doesn't care about it.

I'm not sure if it's that they don't care about it more than they're potentially using it as a cover to hide a drop in boys numbers. I could be wrong. But if they hype up the overall, it sounds more positive than if they release the girls' figures and it gives a potentially negative spin that boys are down.

[RayCee]

43 minutes ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

I'm not sure if it's that they don't care about it more than they're potentially using it as a cover to hide a drop in boys numbers. I could be wrong. But if they hype up the overall, it sounds more positive than if they release the girls' figures and it gives a potentially negative spin that boys are down.

I would very surprised if a growth of 1,000 players from 1,500 would mean a drop in boys playing. Girls increasingly playing the game would surely be part of the increase but boy numbers would be up too. 
 

The fact that is no mention of how many of the increase were girls could be down to genuine reasons of which we are not aware. 

[Eddie]

2 hours ago, gingerjon said:

You would just expect a specific mention of any increase in girls' participation within a whole article like that. There isn't one.

That is, along with pretty much everything else about the state of the women's game in RL, revealing.

It is very good news to see the increase in participation but I was responding to the other poster's comment about girls' participation in particular. RL makes it very clear through its actions that it mostly doesn't care about it.

I’d disagree with that, most professional clubs have women’s teams and I bet they’re not making any money from them. 

[Just Browny]

3 hours ago, gingerjon said:

You would just expect a specific mention of any increase in girls' participation within a whole article like that. There isn't one.

That is, along with pretty much everything else about the state of the women's game in RL, revealing.

It is very good news to see the increase in participation but I was responding to the other poster's comment about girls' participation in particular. RL makes it very clear through its actions that it mostly doesn't care about it.

I think it's a bit of a jump to conclude that. Either a large part of the increase is due to increased female participation or it isn't.

If it is, and I suspect it is, that's great news and hasn't happened by accident - the press release just hasn't picked it up. How the press release is drafted is still secondary to what is happening on the ground.

If there hasnt been increased girls participation, I'd be very surprised. But in that case there'd be no reason for the release to mention it.

I think it's likely Wellsy is right- boys numbers are stagnant and drawing attention to that takes the shine off the overall message. It is also equally possible the data is just poorly constituted and they don't actually know.

[glossop saint]

It would be very rugby league to have a huge increase in girls playing numbers and not actually mention it. Similarly if they did mention it then it would likely be downplayed as 'not a proper increase in playing numbers'.

[JM2010]

Only in RL can we find a negative in such a good news story

[unapologetic pedant]

2 hours ago, JM2010 said:

Only in RL can we find a negative in such a good news story

I wouldn't interpret any of the comments in this thread as negativity. The theme is more one of how to turn a positive into further positives.

Let's assume a rise in the number of female juniors is integral to the story. This clearly deserves distinct recognition. And consequent greater scrutiny of local pathways might help persuade the two pro clubs to be more ambitious at open-age level.

[Northern Eel]

17 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

Girls will likely represent a significant part of the increase.

One has to hope Hull or Rovers will soon take the steps required to ensure at least one Humberside club in WSL. So that more of the players coming through the grades don't go to York or elsewhere. 

I think you over-estimate the level of female participation in Hull, and therefore the significant impact on any increase, but I only speak from experience regarding secondary-aged girls. It may be a different story for younger ones. I wonder who might be able to tell us?

Edited September 18 by Northern Eel

[JM2010]

From the article it sounds like Hull has 12 community clubs in the city. How does that compare to other towns and cities. I think Wigan and Leeds might be the only two with more clubs within their boundaries 

[unapologetic pedant]

3 hours ago, Northern Eel said:

I think you over-estimate the level of female participation in Hull, and therefore the significant impact on any increase, 

I didn't attempt a figure, absolute or percentage. And as @RayCee said, those published appear large enough to indicate increases for boys as well as girls.

In recent years though, girls have contributed disproportionately in all RL nations to growth in junior participation. No reason to think Hull wouldn't follow the trend. 

4 hours ago, Northern Eel said:

but I only speak from experience regarding secondary-aged girls. 

In that age range, one piece of evidence is the success of Malet lambert and Archbishop Sentamu in Champion Schools Girls Rugby League. 

[Northern Eel]

15 minutes ago, unapologetic pedant said:

I didn't attempt a figure, absolute or percentage. And as @RayCee said, those published appear large enough to indicate increases for boys as well as girls.

In recent years though, girls have contributed disproportionately in all RL nations to growth in junior participation. No reason to think Hull wouldn't follow the trend. 

In that age range, one piece of evidence is the success of Malet lambert and Archbishop Sentamu in Champion Schools Girls Rugby League. 

But those girls in that competition are not registered with the RFL. They play for their schools. The figures being quoted are for community clubs. 

There’s an average of one team per age group from u13 to u16 from the Hull area actively participating in the whole of the girls leagues. I’d say that accounts for 100 or so girls. Where are the rest? 

I may well be wrong, and I’m many respects, I hope I am. 

[unapologetic pedant]

55 minutes ago, Northern Eel said:

But those girls in that competition are not registered with the RFL. They play for their schools. The figures being quoted are for community clubs. 

I said the record of those two schools is a piece of evidence. Participants at school usually play, or have played, for a club as well.

1 hour ago, Northern Eel said:

There’s an average of one team per age group from u13 to u16 from the Hull area actively participating in the whole of the girls leagues. I’d say that accounts for 100 or so girls. Where are the rest? 

My guess is that the bulk of the increase (male and female) is in mixed teams 12s and below.

Assuming the figures are reliable.

[Northern Eel]

41 minutes ago, unapologetic pedant said:

I said the record of those two schools is a piece of evidence. Participants at school usually play, or have played, for a club as well.

My guess is that the bulk of the increase (male and female) is in mixed teams 12s and below.

Assuming the figures are reliable.

And my guess is somewhat different. I see it physically on the ground, but you may have even more direct experience/ knowledge than I. The reality is that there are approximately 10 times the number of teams in the boys leagues aged 13+ than in the girls competition this year. The formation of two new clubs in recent years will have as much impact as any girls increase alone, I’d imagine. However, I’m happy to concede that mine is just one plausible opinion. 

There are some teams from out of the local geographical area who now take part in the City of Hull competition also. 
 

Irrespective, this is really good news for the area and to be celebrated. 

Edited September 18 by Northern Eel

[unapologetic pedant]

3 hours ago, Northern Eel said:

And my guess is somewhat different. I see it physically on the ground, but you may have even more direct experience/ knowledge than I. The reality is that there are approximately 10 times the number of teams in the boys leagues aged 13+ than in the girls competition this year. 

Are you saying numbers (male and female) aged 13 and over have grown at a faster rate than those aged 12 and under?

You might be reading too much into "significant" and "integral".

Until proven otherwise, it's a valid hypothesis that female participation is likely to be significant or integral to a story of rises in junior participation. By inference from consistent evidence across RL. 

My main purpose was to point up how young players in Hull cannot currently aspire to play for a local team in WSL.