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Stadia we should use for the 2013 World Cup


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#1 ParisSurtout

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 03:04 AM

Richard Lewis has said that most of the 2013 World Cup events weill be held in the northern heartlands.

I have no problem with that, so long as there are important games held at Wembley and in France.

But we must also restrict the venues in the north to those grounds which are modern and have a decent crowd capacity.

Let me propose the following list, which rewards those clubs which have a modern stadium. It should be a stadium with a capacity of at least 15,000, though at least 20,000 for all matches involving England, Australia, and New Zealand. This precludes Halliwell Jones, and the smaller stadia in out of the way places like Leigh, favored by the arch lowballer of rugby league, Nigel Wood.

I am sure that if this event is marketed properly you could be expecting crowds of 12,000-15,000 even for minor nation contests, like Lebanon vs USA.

Pool games:

DW Wigan,
St Helens,
Barton Salford,
Galpharm, Huddersfield
KC Hull
Headingley Leeds
Millenium Cardiff (for games involving Wales)
Ernest Wallon Toulouse (for games involving France)

Semi finals:

Old Trafford (for a match not involving England, Wales or France)
Wembley (if England is involved)
Charlety Paris (if France is involved against Australia or New Zealand)
Millenium, Cardiff (for a game involving Wales but not England)

Final:

Wembley


The controversial part of this plan is that I am suggesting Wembley for a semi-final if England plays Australia, New Zealand, Wales or France (which is almost certain). This event however should attract a huge crowd, because of the contestants, and because it involves England in a sudden death.

Should England lose a Wembley semi-final, there will still be a large core of people who attended the England semi-final, whose appetites will have been excited for the Wembley final in which England does not compete. It will therefore have boosted the final crowd over what it would have been had England played and lost its semi-final in the north of England.

The fact is that there is a huge soft core market for great sporting events located in London and the south. We saw that in the massive attendances for international rugby league at Wembley in 1990, 1992 and 1994. Many tens of thousands of them will attend a Wembley semi-final and final if it is marketed properly. If England is not playing, the crowd will simply be anti-Australia. Expect 30,000 London and southern England fans, and 30,000 northern England fans to want to attend a well publicised Wembley Final if it is a game that does not involve England. Expect a sellout (72,00 RFL ticket allocation plus 18,000 Wembley members) if England is involved.

Edited by ParisSurtout, 24 August 2010 - 05:50 AM.

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#2 roughyedspud

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 06:11 AM

the RLWC final,or any other RL game for that matter aside from the challenge cup final, would'nt be included in the club wembley package...


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What events will a Club Wembley Seat Licence entitle me to see?
You will receive one ticket per licensed seat for the following matches* **:

All England senior home games
The FA Cup Final
Both FA Cup Semi Finals
The FA Community Shield
The Football League Cup Final and
The Rugby League Challenge Cup Final

* Club Wembley International seat licence holders receive tickets for all England senior home games only.
** excludes bid events


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#3 1976PMJwires

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 06:16 AM

Don't worry about France and semi finals laugh.gif laugh.gif

Part of the post i did enjoy.............. for once. ohmy.gif

#4 Saint Toppy

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 06:44 AM

QUOTE (ParisSurtout @ Aug 24 2010, 04:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Pool games:

Headingley Leeds

Shedingly shouldn't be used, 3 sides of the stadium are utter ######, and given the time of year the WC will be played there's a pretty good chance anyone stood at the western end will get pi$$ wet through.

#5 Mumby Magic

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 09:07 AM

QUOTE (ParisSurtout @ Aug 24 2010, 04:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Richard Lewis has said that most of the 2013 World Cup events weill be held in the northern heartlands.

I have no problem with that, so long as there are important games held at Wembley and in France.

But we must also restrict the venues in the north to those grounds which are modern and have a decent crowd capacity.

Let me propose the following list, which rewards those clubs which have a modern stadium. It should be a stadium with a capacity of at least 15,000, though at least 20,000 for all matches involving England, Australia, and New Zealand. This precludes Halliwell Jones, and the smaller stadia in out of the way places like Leigh, favored by the arch lowballer of rugby league, Nigel Wood.

I am sure that if this event is marketed properly you could be expecting crowds of 12,000-15,000 even for minor nation contests, like Lebanon vs USA.

Pool games:

DW Wigan,
St Helens,
Barton Salford,
Galpharm, Huddersfield
KC Hull
Headingley Leeds
Millenium Cardiff (for games involving Wales)
Ernest Wallon Toulouse (for games involving France)

Semi finals:

Old Trafford (for a match not involving England, Wales or France)
Wembley (if England is involved)
Charlety Paris (if France is involved against Australia or New Zealand)
Millenium, Cardiff (for a game involving Wales but not England)

Final:

Wembley


The controversial part of this plan is that I am suggesting Wembley for a semi-final if England plays Australia, New Zealand, Wales or France (which is almost certain). This event however should attract a huge crowd, because of the contestants, and because it involves England in a sudden death.

Should England lose a Wembley semi-final, there will still be a large core of people who attended the England semi-final, whose appetites will have been excited for the Wembley final in which England does not compete. It will therefore have boosted the final crowd over what it would have been had England played and lost its semi-final in the north of England.

The fact is that there is a huge soft core market for great sporting events located in London and the south. We saw that in the massive attendances for international rugby league at Wembley in 1990, 1992 and 1994. Many tens of thousands of them will attend a Wembley semi-final and final if it is marketed properly. If England is not playing, the crowd will simply be anti-Australia. Expect 30,000 London and southern England fans, and 30,000 northern England fans to want to attend a well publicised Wembley Final if it is a game that does not involve England. Expect a sellout (72,00 RFL ticket allocation plus 18,000 Wembley members) if England is involved.


Paris, crikey a sensible post from you, wothin reason!! tongue.gif Agree with Pool games but Old Trafford will be the final I assume and I think Charlety is over egging it for a semi if France get there. Besides the stadia will have to be announced before hand.

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#6 Dave T

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 09:18 AM

Not a lot wrong with your proposals, but whilst we need to be ambitious, we also need to be careful. Taking a game like Lebanon v USA and getting 4k at the DW Stadium for example would be a PR disaster.

It is also far too easy for people to say 'get the marketing right'. What exactly does that mean?

I think a thread on how the RFL, the clubs, and the fans can publicise and market the tournament would be more relevant that just naming a load of big grounds.

#7 Derwent

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 09:21 AM

QUOTE (ParisSurtout @ Aug 24 2010, 04:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I am sure that if this event is marketed properly you could be expecting crowds of 12,000-15,000 even for minor nation contests, like Lebanon vs USA.


Why could you expect crowds of that size ?

In the 2008 RLWC, a total of 11 out of 18 games (61%) didn't attract crowds of that size. If they couldn't do it in Oz then why would it happen here ?

Are you saying that the ARL didn't market the event properly ?



#8 RP London

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 09:45 AM

i'd try and get bramall lane involved to be honest..

i also wouldnt take a game to france outside the pool stages.. becuase if france arent in.. which is just as likely.. then its an expenisve trip and hard to organise potentially on short notice for those basing themselves in the UK for the tournament. at least with a pool stage you know well in advance.

#9 HappyDave

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 10:27 AM

Seeing as England are the host nation surely holding any games in Wales or France would make us a laughing stock? Has the likes of Footy, RU, the Olympics, or an other sport (apart from the Tour de France which may have a stage in another Country? Belgium? Or is that another Tour?) held a game/event outside of the host nation?

Edited by HappyDave, 24 August 2010 - 10:29 AM.

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#10 West Country Eagle

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 10:39 AM

QUOTE (RP London @ Aug 24 2010, 10:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
i'd try and get bramall lane involved to be honest..


Yes! Sheffield United are very keen - ditto Sheffield City Council's events unit and the Eagles.

Stadiums are being invited to bid for matches - bids have to be in later this year. The venues will be announced in June 2011. The plan is for tickets to go on sale next summer.



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#11 yanto

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 10:49 AM

QUOTE (HappyDave @ Aug 24 2010, 12:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Seeing as England are the host nation surely holding any games in Wales or France would make us a laughing stock? Has the likes of Footy, RU, the Olympics, or an other sport (apart from the Tour de France which may have a stage in another Country? Belgium? Or is that another Tour?) held a game/event outside of the host nation?


1999 RU world cup was hosted by Wales but games played in Ireland (North and Republic),Scotland,England and even France.
In total 18 stadiums where used from Galashiels (6,000 capacity) to Staad France (80,000).

Only three Welsh grounds where used,Millennium,Wrexham and Llanelli.

2007 RU world cup was hosted by France but had games in Scotland and Wales.

Regarding your cycle racing
BOTH the Tour de France and the Tour of Italy started in Holland this year.One in Amsterdam and one in Rotterdam.
Tour de France also went through Belgium.




#12 MR51CUK

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 10:51 AM

QUOTE (ParisSurtout @ Aug 24 2010, 04:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Millenium Cardiff (for games involving Wales)


Why not keep Wales games up North at the Racecourse? If we get the kop stand sorted that would be 15k surely it's better to have 15k and a full stadium than 15k rattling around in the Millenium?


#13 HappyDave

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 11:03 AM

Fair enough. I didn't realise that, but I think we should be trying to keep the RLWC in the host nation. Even if the RFL have to grovel to the FA/Barcleys (?) Premiership/Premiership footy teams with nice medium size grounds as they'll probably be bigger & better than the newly built SL grounds, rather than bids on some occasions?

I definitely thing the quarter finals should be played in decent venues (say 25,000+? What's Brammel Lane's capacity?) and obviously we need good venues (like the City of Machester Stadium or Old Trafford?) for the semi's & definitely Wembley for the Final

Edited by HappyDave, 24 August 2010 - 11:07 AM.

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#14 West Country Eagle

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 11:03 AM

QUOTE (MR51CUK @ Aug 24 2010, 11:51 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why not keep Wales games up North at the Racecourse? If we get the kop stand sorted that would be 15k surely it's better to have 15k and a full stadium than 15k rattling around in the Millenium?


I'd agree on that score.

One game in South Wales would be good though maybe at one of the football grounds (Swansea or Cardiff City's stadiums).
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#15 1976PMJwires

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 11:08 AM

QUOTE (West Country Eagle @ Aug 24 2010, 12:03 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'd agree on that score.

One game in South Wales would be good though maybe at one of the football grounds (Swansea or Cardiff City's stadiums).


Agree, Cardiff or Swansea for the one game, the Rest in Wrexham (if they get the KOP end sorted)

#16 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 11:16 AM

QUOTE (ParisSurtout @ Aug 24 2010, 04:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Richard Lewis has said that most of the 2013 World Cup events weill be held in the northern heartlands.

I have no problem with that, so long as there are important games held at Wembley and in France.

But we must also restrict the venues in the north to those grounds which are modern and have a decent crowd capacity.

Let me propose the following list, which rewards those clubs which have a modern stadium. It should be a stadium with a capacity of at least 15,000, though at least 20,000 for all matches involving England, Australia, and New Zealand. This precludes Halliwell Jones, and the smaller stadia in out of the way places like Leigh, favored by the arch lowballer of rugby league, Nigel Wood.

I am sure that if this event is marketed properly you could be expecting crowds of 12,000-15,000 even for minor nation contests, like Lebanon vs USA.

Pool games:

DW Wigan,
St Helens,
Barton Salford,
Galpharm, Huddersfield
KC Hull
Headingley Leeds
Millenium Cardiff (for games involving Wales)
Ernest Wallon Toulouse (for games involving France)

Semi finals:

Old Trafford (for a match not involving England, Wales or France)
Wembley (if England is involved)
Charlety Paris (if France is involved against Australia or New Zealand)
Millenium, Cardiff (for a game involving Wales but not England)

Final:

Wembley


The controversial part of this plan is that I am suggesting Wembley for a semi-final if England plays Australia, New Zealand, Wales or France (which is almost certain). This event however should attract a huge crowd, because of the contestants, and because it involves England in a sudden death.

Should England lose a Wembley semi-final, there will still be a large core of people who attended the England semi-final, whose appetites will have been excited for the Wembley final in which England does not compete. It will therefore have boosted the final crowd over what it would have been had England played and lost its semi-final in the north of England.

The fact is that there is a huge soft core market for great sporting events located in London and the south. We saw that in the massive attendances for international rugby league at Wembley in 1990, 1992 and 1994. Many tens of thousands of them will attend a Wembley semi-final and final if it is marketed properly. If England is not playing, the crowd will simply be anti-Australia. Expect 30,000 London and southern England fans, and 30,000 northern England fans to want to attend a well publicised Wembley Final if it is a game that does not involve England. Expect a sellout (72,00 RFL ticket allocation plus 18,000 Wembley members) if England is involved.

1. The UK are the host nation. The Sports Minister has been pushing our tournament, so I think it would be bad to host games outside of the UK after finally getting support from the Government. They want this to be our decadeof sport.

2. You can't have four semi-final venues just incase someone like France or Wales makes it. It's ridiculous. We need to be selling tickets as early as possible (which for once I'm glad to hear we are doing). You can't do that if you wait until less than a week before to pick the venue!

3. The games need to be held up north apart from the odd big game and possibly Aus/NZ games. Wales can have home games as well, but I'd probably avoid Scotland and Ireland as they haven't really supported international RL well in the past crowd-wise.

4. The stadia you have named are too big for the smaller nations. We struggled to get 10k crowds over in Aus. But you think we can get 12-15k over here? Not likely. And not really that bright an idea.
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#17 East Coast Tiger

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 11:16 AM

Wales are in the WC and depending on the format will play at least two pool games. One at Wrexham and one down south would make sense.

France will also get at least two pool games so a game in Toulouse and another in Perpignan would make sense. If they get a third maybe try Paris, but even then another southern venue would probably get a better crowd. France might even host another game in that pool to save travel.

The most important thing is thinking about where certain teams will draw. Autsralia and NZ could both draw decent crowds in London at The Stoop, Loftus Road etc. Ireland should draw a decent crowd in the north west for example. So don't make Australia play in Hull or Gateshead like in 2000.

And forget Reading or Oxford or Gloucester or Nottingham or Edinburgh any other random non-RL places. Any expansion venues should be limited to London, Wales and maybe Paris. And in the north choose approproate sized venues that are easy to get to.

#18 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 11:19 AM

I'd like to see what format we use before specifically picking certain venues. If England are in a super group or not would completely change the type of venues we use IMO.
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#19 jim_57

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 12:30 PM

I'm not sure If France will get games, but I suppose if it's just there with gaurenteed bigger crowds then they'll use French venues. Not going to go into great detail but I'd like certain areas to have "adopted" developing nation teams, play lower drawing games at 10-15k heartland venues. It is essential to start with England V Australia at Wembley and play all other big games at 20k+ stadiums. A good mix is required IMO, a few games to "non-heartland" areas but most in the areas we know will draw a crowd.

Atleast 3 games in Wales and France, 1 at most in Scotland & Ireland and the rest in England.

#20 Wellsy4HullFC

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Posted 24 August 2010 - 12:40 PM

QUOTE (jim_57 @ Aug 24 2010, 01:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm not sure If France will get games, but I suppose if it's just there with gaurenteed bigger crowds then they'll use French venues. Not going to go into great detail but I'd like certain areas to have "adopted" developing nation teams, play lower drawing games at 10-15k heartland venues. It is essential to start with England V Australia at Wembley and play all other big games at 20k+ stadiums. A good mix is required IMO, a few games to "non-heartland" areas but most in the areas we know will draw a crowd.

Atleast 3 games in Wales and France, 1 at most in Scotland & Ireland and the rest in England.

Like I say, I don't think there will be games in France as they've specifically said that the host nation is the UK, rather than co-host or whatever.

I like the idea behind having certain nations being adopted by an area, for example Ireland being adopted by say Warrington (Carney connection), Tonga by Hull (Manu, Moa, Lauaki), etc. in order to get support from that area and develop a small connection.
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