RLIF: Pacific Championship split in two conferences - GB tour only NZ 2019

[GeordieSaint]

11 hours ago, DavidM said:

Bizarre . GB tours but dont play the iconic opponent Australia . Can’t get my head round that . Defeats the purpose 

Who’s purpose? The Aussies left GB behind 20yrs ago... it’s elements of the English game who are still nostalgic about GB.

[thirteenthman]

http://www.rlif.com/article/8493/new-era-for-rugby-league-in-the-pacific-

Nothing officially confirmed and the RLIF will undertake "further feasibility work ahead of a formal decision later this year". I'd hate to think they'd rush into something.

As for the proposal in the OP, Aus/NZ/Tonga is more or less what we've got this year, plus NZ v Tonga in mid season. And the Samoa/PNG/Fiji trio just adds two extra matches at the end of the season on top of the mid season Pacific test. So basically 3 extra games. And that requires "further feasibility work"?

[GeordieSaint]

England are getting sidelined... the RFL needs to get its act together as we’ll have no worthy opposition at this rate.

[roughyedspud]

1 hour ago, GeordieSaint said:

England are getting sidelined... the RFL needs to get its act together as we’ll have no worthy opposition at this rate.

We need to cancel that ###### tour...sod em....

We and the RLEF should organize a proper full blown European Championship,8 teams,2 groups of 4 with a proper final not like the absolute nonsense this pacific "championship" is..it's just the NRL paying lip service to the international game and Nigel wood and he's eaten it and the platter the NRL served it on...

[Oliver Clothesoff]

Really don’t see why it can’t be a four team group of Australia, England, New Zealand and Tonga. 

England could play New Zealand in mid-season during one of the Origin weeks then at the end of the season travel Down Under for games with Australia and Tonga. 

England v New Zealand - June

England v Tonga, Australia v NZ, Australia v England, NZ v Tonga, Australia v Tonga - End of Season in October/Nov

[Rupert Prince]

9 hours ago, 17 stone giant said:

I only put them in because the original poster mentioned about Lebanon and the Cook Islands being forgotten about. I wanted to show that I was remembering them.

Yes I understand your referencing. I was just making a point.    Cheers. 

In respect of the general comments on the ideas, is this not load of baloney by Nigel Woods?

What is the earthly point of relegating anyone from anything to something else. I mean you no sooner think you have an interesting team  in Tonga than you relegate it!  Why?   And what is the point of 'relegating' NZ (or Australia even and for gawdsake!).

The whole point of this is cobblers. The IRL or whatever they call themselves (basically one man and his dog) are a total waste of space.

Hitler in his bunker moving all his phantom divisions around made more sense than than Mr Woods'.

[Jim from Oz]

6 hours ago, rzesiej13 said:

Group 1

Australia,  Fiji, and Samoa

Group 2

New zealand, Tonga, and PNG

Play each team once in your group. Then top in each group for 1st and 2nd. 2nd in each group for 3rd and 4th. Last in each group for 5th in each group for 5th and 6th. Every team plays 3 games.

Next year group 1 is 1st, 4th, and 5th

Group 2 is 2nd, 3rd, and 6th.

 

Much more sensible proposal!

[rlno1]

4 hours ago, thirteenthman said:

http://www.rlif.com/article/8493/new-era-for-rugby-league-in-the-pacific-

Nothing officially confirmed and the RLIF will undertake "further feasibility work ahead of a formal decision later this year". I'd hate to think they'd rush into something.

As for the proposal in the OP, Aus/NZ/Tonga is more or less what we've got this year, plus NZ v Tonga in mid season. And the Samoa/PNG/Fiji trio just adds two extra matches at the end of the season on top of the mid season Pacific test. So basically 3 extra games. And that requires "further feasibility work"?

Shouldn't they have done the feasibility study before making the announcement.

[JoneslessBishop]

Feels like Nigel Wood wanting to suggest he is doing something. Which is having watched a few UEFA Nations League games and seeing how he can doctor it to RL 

[B rad]

6 hours ago, roughyedspud said:

Australian haven't developed fxxk all you clown

Australia have developed all the players in every pacific nation, New Zealand, Lebanon and Italy and a few in other nations as well. They all play in NRL clubs, that's how they got so good. 

Australia has bankrolled every game for the pacific except the world cup

Australia organises every game for the Pacific Nations, the RLIF does nothing. 

Australia has toured PNG with the PMs13 most years

Australia has bought the PNG Hunters in not to mention the New Zealand Warriors.

Its Australian coaches that coach most of the Pacific Nations, USA, Italy

What a ridiculous comment. 

 

[thirteenthman]

2 hours ago, rlno1 said:

Shouldn't they have done the feasibility study before making the announcement.

To be fair, they haven't formally announced anything concrete. The various proposals are all "leaks" from the Sydney media (which like a lot of stuff they print, may turn out to be complete ).

All that's been confirmed is that the RLIF and members of the Asia Pacific  Confederation have met, discussed the calendar for the next two years, and it will be discussed a bit more. If nothing else, it confirms that they are doing something. Not very quickly, but they are doing something. 

[JM2010]

Any plans for the Northern Hemisphere?

[GeordieSaint]

2 hours ago, B rad said:

Australia organises every game for the Pacific Nations, the RLIF does nothing. 

I have no issue with any of your post (it’s all true) apart from this bit in bold. What exactly would you like them to do, especially since they are Wood and 2 x other blokes? 

Their only real source of financial income is the RLWC, which they don’t get paid in full by some of the organisers. This along with certain member organisations preventing them achieving further income generation (Intercontinental Cup/9s) and changing agreed calendars doesn’t help very much does it? 

[Damien]

2 hours ago, B rad said:

Australia have developed all the players in every pacific nation, New Zealand, Lebanon and Italy and a few in other nations as well. They all play in NRL clubs, that's how they got so good. 

Australia has bankrolled every game for the pacific except the world cup

Australia organises every game for the Pacific Nations, the RLIF does nothing. 

Australia has toured PNG with the PMs13 most years

Australia has bought the PNG Hunters in not to mention the New Zealand Warriors.

Its Australian coaches that coach most of the Pacific Nations, USA, Italy

What a ridiculous comment. 

 

That's a one sided view if ever I've seen one.

Australia have developed players for themselves and their clubs primarily. The fact that some of these players have heritage and qualify for another is irrelevant and Australia have not developed these players with the intention of them bolstering the international game or the countries in question.

Have they really bankrolled? Or have they sold the TV rights, sponsorship and not allowed the Pacific Nations to arrange their own matches and play who they want to play. It's quite bizarre that these matches continue to supposedly lose money when the players get paid little and they could have let Tonga play in NZ and get a 25,000 sell out and presumably make money. No instead let's do a double header at a small ground.

Is the RLIF allowed by the NRL to arrange these games? We saw what happened with the Denver test and if it wasn't for the NZ player's insisting that they play it would have been torpedoed by the NRL. Tonga wanted to arrange their own match and weren't consulted. It could easily be argued that it's a form of control by the NRL to limit the growth of these tests and to sell the TV rights for these tests.

New Zealand Warriors? You do realise that the NRL receives more in TV revenue from NZ than it gives back don't you. Some would say it's a commercial decision rather than any great development motive.

Australian coaches in their off season or unemployed doing a bit if paid work. That's nice of them. Hardly anything special though is it and it's not like there wasn't coaches from other nations coaching the minnows is it?

[thirteenthman]

30 minutes ago, JM2010 said:

Any plans for the Northern Hemisphere?

http://rlif.com/article/8444/rlif-board-makes-progress-on-international-calendar-and-governance

Only what was planned in the RLIF's proposed calendar (still to be formally ratified in November). Even then,  the World 9s seems unlikely to go ahead.

There will also be the RLWC Qualifying Tournament in 2019 including the bottom two from this years Euro Championship. 

[B rad]

2 hours ago, Damien said:

That's a one sided view if ever I've seen one.

I think "Australia do #### all for the international game" is a little more one sided.

 

2 hours ago, Damien said:

Australia have developed players for themselves and their clubs primarily. The fact that some of these players have heritage and qualify for another is irrelevant and Australia have not developed these players with the intention of them bolstering the international game or the countries in question.

Yes they have developed these players for their clubs, but tell me who develops players for other nations other then through clubs in their competition? Does England sponsor a French academy or any other nation for that matter? Players get developed through school and club competitions. That's just life. If it wasn't for club competitions youth development programs in Australia how many nations would be able to field teams of professional standard?

2 hours ago, Damien said:

Have they really bankrolled? Or have they sold the TV rights, sponsorship and not allowed the Pacific Nations to arrange their own matches and play who they want to play. It's quite bizarre that these matches continue to supposedly lose money when the players get paid little and they could have let Tonga play in NZ and get a 25,000 sell out and presumably make money. No instead let's do a double header at a small ground.

How are the Pacific Nations going to arrange their own matches when they have no money? Tonga vs NZ and Tonga vs England was in the RLWC. Did they get a share? I don't know ask the RLIF. Probably not much considering how little they had to pay their players. Nothing is stopping the Pacific Nations from putting on their own games except their own ability to do so.

If it wasn't for the NRLs mid season Pacific Tests there would be no games for those nations until the next world cup. That's not enough games in my opinion but its better then the alternative, nothing. I'm glad they came to the party so we have this Tongan game this weekend. I wish there was games for Fiji and Samoa as well. 

You know the Australian players took a 75% pay cut so they could be paid the same as the Tongans and so this game could go ahead right?

2 hours ago, Damien said:

Is the RLIF allowed by the NRL to arrange these games? We saw what happened with the Denver test and if it wasn't for the NZ player's insisting that they play it would have been torpedoed by the NRL. Tonga wanted to arrange their own match and weren't consulted. It could easily be argued that it's a form of control by the NRL to limit the growth of these tests and to sell the TV rights for these tests.

What happened in Denver by the NRL was short sighted and damaging to our own game. I think it was terrible that they didn't back it. The RLIF can arrange any international tournaments with any nation they want. They are the RLIF its their job. The clubs dragging their feet was an issue since the players are contracted to them, which was a dog act. The NRL should have been firm against the clubs and made them release players and should have been more supportive of the concept. Still the game went on though didn't it, the NRL didn't stop it from happening, they just didn't like that it did happen. 

There is no Denver test next year because the Moore group didn't make the money to pay the nations. The NRL didn't block it, but their poor attitude didn't help it be a success. 

2 hours ago, Damien said:

New Zealand Warriors? You do realise that the NRL receives more in TV revenue from NZ than it gives back don't you. Some would say it's a commercial decision rather than any great development motive.

So what. Is it a pathway to professionalism for New Zealand players and does it help them become a more competitive nation? The NRL is still a business not a charity. Its still a major factor in developing and maintaining the game in New Zealand. 

2 hours ago, Damien said:

Australian coaches in their off season or unemployed doing a bit if paid work. That's nice of them. Hardly anything special though is it and it's not like there wasn't coaches from other nations coaching the minnows is it?

Australian coaches are currently coaching Australia, New Zealand, England, Tonga, Fiji, and Samoa. That's also the current international ranking. Apologies they are not doing it for free, though I doubt the pay cheque from Tonga Fiji or Samoa is going to buy them a new house. 

 

The point is although I often think Australia could do more for the international game they are still doing plenty and more then any other nation. 

Its funny the biases on these forums sometimes. If Australia do nothing you get the "Australia don't care about international RL they are ######" mob, and when they do do something its "Australia are in a power play to take over RL they are trying to control everything"

So which is it, do you want them to sit back and do nothing or get involved and be seen as some kind of aggressor. Either way they cant win the public opinion of many in this forum and in England because some people just dislike them and no matter what they do good or bad they want to see the worst of them no matter what.  

Australia isn't perfect, in fact they do some $hitty things sometimes and annoy the ###### out of me. I still stand by point that to say they do nothing for the international game is ridiculous statement. 

 

 

[yipyee]

On 10/19/2018 at 8:17 AM, roughyedspud said:

Australian haven't developed fxxk all you clown

NZ warriors in NRL. 

PNG hunters

Fiji team for NSW cup

You #### ###

[17 stone giant]

11 minutes ago, yipyee said:

NZ warriors in NRL. 

PNG hunters

Fiji team for NSW cup

You ?

Fair enough. You win this round. But Marmite is still better than Vegemite. And they should be the two sponsors of GB and Australia next year. Another one to add to the ideas thread. I'll be the saviour of rugby league if my good ideas continue at their current rate.

[roughyedspud]

On 10/20/2018 at 11:01 PM, yipyee said:

NZ warriors in NRL. 

PNG hunters

Fiji team for NSW cup

You #### ###

Warriors in the NRL is about money

The hunters in the QLD cup is because it's commercially viable...and it was agreed by the QRL not ARLC

FIJI aren't in the NSW cup yet because it's not commercially viable!

Australia doesn't do anything unless it pays to do so..

They pay lip service towards international RL...the pacific tests were undersold,this pacific "championship" is Aload of Tosh...

They could have proposed having 2 groups of 3 with a final at the end..but nah...that's too logical to make sense..

This "championship" as also destroyed the GB tour that Australia apparently wanted!

 

######

[yipyee]

On 10/22/2018 at 7:02 AM, roughyedspud said:

Warriors in the NRL is about money

The hunters in the QLD cup is because it's commercially viable...and it was agreed by the QRL not ARLC

FIJI aren't in the NSW cup yet because it's not commercially viable!

Australia doesn't do anything unless it pays to do so..

They pay lip service towards international RL...the pacific tests were undersold,this pacific "championship" is Aload of Tosh...

They could have proposed having 2 groups of 3 with a final at the end..but nah...that's too logical to make sense..

This "championship" as also destroyed the GB tour that Australia apparently wanted!

 

######

The GB tour is fruitless and stuck in the past. 

The tours died a death and not halted abruptly.

NZ are in the Aus top division and their national team can now beat the Aussies

Half of our top division want Catalans out.

Also Catalans were chosen over Toulouse. Toulouse had more potential so it would appear it's the UK playing lip service.

PNG are basing their squad on local players. Aus could have rejected them but didn't PNG are reaping the benefits.

Meanwhile people here want to stop Ireland playing local talent in place of a heritage team which does sweet fa for international development.

You are right in Aus wanting a return on investment but everyone will benefit promoting other nations.

At least when Aus do it, it's not half arsed and effective.

We are too scared of the apprentice becoming better than the master! 

We find problems Aus find solutions.

Aus are looking forward, we want to shrink back to GB and play australia who have moved on and now want their own comps.

We should have done this year's ago. We should be playing France every year not the exiles not roses.

We should be playing Wales with our UK based team.

Not in Leigh in France and in Wales 

Once France and Wales are competitive start incorporating other European teams.

[17 stone giant]

7 hours ago, yipyee said:

Once France and Wales are competitive start incorporating other European teams.

I doubt that Wales will ever be competitive with England. The closest I remember them being was the 1995 World Cup, and even then they had several English born players in their team.

[yipyee]

15 hours ago, 17 stone giant said:

I doubt that Wales will ever be competitive with England. The closest I remember them being was the 1995 World Cup, and even then they had several English born players in their team.

Wales don't play their strongest team along with some Welsh norm players choosing to play for England.

The crusaders were only in SW for around 3 years and developed several SL quality players. 

Wales ARE competitive with England at school and junior level, playing Wales regularly will encourage the best players to turn up for the national team and hopefully bridge the gap from the juniors..

 

[17 stone giant]

1 hour ago, yipyee said:

Wales ARE competitive with England at school and junior level, playing Wales regularly will encourage the best players to turn up for the national team and hopefully bridge the gap from the juniors.

So what happens to the Welsh players after they become adults? Why don't they progress in the same way that the English players do? Surely they would get signed up by SL or whatever clubs, if they're as good as the English players?

[The Daddy]

England are reaping what they've sown. I've been saying for years that the rfl should forget about Australia and focus on assisting with the development of France and Wales. 

They still haven't learnt yet. 

[yipyee]

18 hours ago, 17 stone giant said:

So what happens to the Welsh players after they become adults? Why don't they progress in the same way that the English players do? Surely they would get signed up by SL or whatever clubs, if they're as good as the English players?

The cream will but the others probably slip to union.

Saints signed 2 SW players.

One made the first team, the other is playing union.

And that's the point. Only a few who can be plucked from an early age and beat the English players at the clubs acedemys make it.

Crusaders had a whole generation for very little time spent on them.

Most of this generation never play for Wales!!

Regular games vs England will produce money for Wales, money for Welsh players and an interest in RL for players to play and continue playing. 

Not all players want to live in NW England. Especially semi pro ones.

England had a chance and misfired in France and failed in Wales.

Lewis had the right idea but there was too much pressure from a few chairmen.

These actions have failed the national team.