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Wished For UK RL Setup


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I know everything comes down to money or the lack thereof. However, if that wasn’t an issue what would be an ideal setup in the UK? Here’s mine.

SL: 16 teams, eight going into a finals series and the bottom side playing the top team from the Championship in a one off match. The winner remains or enters SL next season. Any newly promoted side gets a one year exemption from the playoff match if they came last. The second to bottom would then fulfill that role.

Championship: 16 teams divided geographical into two conferences. They would play all teams in their conference twice and once against those in the other conference. The points table for each conference would be kept separate. At the end, the top side from each conference would playoff for the right to play a SL side in an attempt to gain promotion.

League One: No longer required.

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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4 minutes ago, RayCee said:

I know everything comes down to money or the lack thereof. However, if that wasn’t an issue what would be an ideal setup in the UK? Here’s mine.

SL: 16 teams, eight going into a finals series and the bottom side playing the top team from the Championship in a one off match. The winner remains or enters SL next season. Any newly promoted side gets a one year exemption from the playoff match if they came last. The second to bottom would then fulfill that role.

Championship: 16 teams divided geographical into two conferences. They would play all teams in their conference twice and once against those in the other conference. The points table for each conference would be kept separate. At the end, the top side from each conference would playoff for the right to play a SL side in an attempt to gain promotion.

League One: No longer required.

What are you doing with the remaining 3 UK teams and the 2 French ones?

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1 minute ago, Barley Mow said:

What are you doing with the remaining 3 UK teams and the 2 French ones?

The French ones would be in SL and any other sides not able to fit into the structure would join lower regional divisions.

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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3 minutes ago, RayCee said:

The French ones would be in SL and any other sides not able to fit into the structure would join lower regional divisions.

So (based on current standings) the League 1 expansion clubs in the south of England and West Wales, plus Oldham would be expelled from the (semi-)professional game.

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6 minutes ago, Barley Mow said:

So (based on current standings) the League 1 expansion clubs in the south of England and West Wales, plus Oldham would be expelled from the (semi-)professional game.

If that was the criteria for acceptance into the new Championship, but I think other factors should decide that. Bear in mind Barley, this is a general plan, such details as to who would be part of it wasn’t the way ai was angling the thread.

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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1 minute ago, RayCee said:

If that was the criteria for acceptance into the new Championship, but I think other factors should decide that. Bear in mind Barley, this is a general plan, such details as to who would be part of it wasn’t the way ai was angling the thread.

Nonetheless, your proposal would result in 5 clubs being expelled from the professional game, whoever they ended up being.

Whatever the structure, it should be able to include all of the current clubs.

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Just now, Barley Mow said:

Nonetheless, your proposal would result in 5 clubs being expelled from the professional game, whoever they ended up being.

Whatever the structure, it should be able to include all of the current clubs.

Expelled is an emotive word. There are teams in League 1 that are a long way from being professional in set up, struggling to be semi-pro. You’ve made your point, so let’s see what others think. 

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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I think all these plans should be sent to IMG. 

Show them what they are up against. 😁😉

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2 minutes ago, doc said:

I think all these plans should be sent to IMG. 

Show them what they are up against. 😁😉

They have already sent me a pm saying well done. 😇

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My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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The amount of teams in a division matters little, it is the make-up of their fixtures that matters more. Doing what we do now, having two competitions (a league competition and the Cup) and playing everyone home and away and/or playing loop games in the same tepid, drawn out and unduly lengthy league competition is just rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. If the answer to any informal discussion or serious evaluation into the sport is continuing with twenty-seven weekly rounds of the same league competition, we’ve not learnt anything over the past however many structure changes we’ve had and will be destined to repeat history. 

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1 hour ago, RayCee said:

I know everything comes down to money or the lack thereof. However, if that wasn’t an issue what would be an ideal setup in the UK? Here’s mine.

SL: 16 teams, eight going into a finals series and the bottom side playing the top team from the Championship in a one off match. The winner remains or enters SL next season. Any newly promoted side gets a one year exemption from the playoff match if they came last. The second to bottom would then fulfill that role.

Championship: 16 teams divided geographical into two conferences. They would play all teams in their conference twice and once against those in the other conference. The points table for each conference would be kept separate. At the end, the top side from each conference would playoff for the right to play a SL side in an attempt to gain promotion.

League One: No longer required.

Whilst I see where you're coming from, it feels like your money no object scenario only covers the existing club structure. Personally I'd like to see a open pyramid system with clubs spread across the UK (and beyond), with a similar structure to soccer, in that there are no limitations to geographical size, and that there is a structure to allow national competition to progress to regional (e.g. Euro Cup) and potentially onto a world wide competition. 

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18 minutes ago, gazza77 said:

Whilst I see where you're coming from, it feels like your money no object scenario only covers the existing club structure. Personally I'd like to see a open pyramid system with clubs spread across the UK (and beyond), with a similar structure to soccer, in that there are no limitations to geographical size, and that there is a structure to allow national competition to progress to regional (e.g. Euro Cup) and potentially onto a world wide competition. 

I covered what I know but my knowledge of the game in the UK would not allow me to go further.

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My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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Posted (edited)
46 minutes ago, Jughead said:

The amount of teams in a division matters little, it is the make-up of their fixtures that matters more. Doing what we do now, having two competitions (a league competition and the Cup) and playing everyone home and away and/or playing loop games in the same tepid, drawn out and unduly lengthy league competition is just rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. If the answer to any informal discussion or serious evaluation into the sport is continuing with twenty-seven weekly rounds of the same league competition, we’ve not learnt anything over the past however many structure changes we’ve had and will be destined to repeat history. 

Currently the Championship is two divisions in one. SL teams play each other too often. The idea I posted to address those two issues. In that sense, numbers do matter.

This 27 match structure I presume is based on what Sky wanted and paid for. It’s too long IMO but whoever pays the piper calls the tune.

Edited by RayCee

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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9 hours ago, RayCee said:

I know everything comes down to money or the lack thereof. However, if that wasn’t an issue what would be an ideal setup in the UK? Here’s mine.

SL: 16 teams, eight going into a finals series and the bottom side playing the top team from the Championship in a one off match. The winner remains or enters SL next season. Any newly promoted side gets a one year exemption from the playoff match if they came last. The second to bottom would then fulfill that role.

Championship: 16 teams divided geographical into two conferences. They would play all teams in their conference twice and once against those in the other conference. The points table for each conference would be kept separate. At the end, the top side from each conference would playoff for the right to play a SL side in an attempt to gain promotion.

League One: No longer required.

TBH, a 'money no object' proposal that actually reduces the number of clubs is not one that I'd ever support.

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Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, RayCee said:

I know everything comes down to money or the lack thereof. However, if that wasn’t an issue what would be an ideal setup in the UK? Here’s mine.

MONEY NO OBJECT


Super League – 14 teams, top 5 play offs leading to Grand Final champion, two relegation spots


National Championship – 14 teams, automatic promotion for champion, clubs 2-5 play off in straight SF then F (home games played at highest ranked side), two relegation spots


National One – 14 teams (no, I don’t know either – existing clubs plus development sides from some SL clubs possibly) – – highest ranked first XIII is promoted automatically, next four play off. If winner is from top 6 then promoted, if not then not.


And then:
Heartlands (Yorks/Lancs/Cumbria/Cheshire) – much the same as now only with increasing numbers because, with our money, we’re actually spending on development officers, league admin and the like


Addition to the above would be to create/support/add to distinct Northeast Academy that would play in the upper echelons of NCL with feeder teams in other Yorkshire leagues


Second addition would be a North Wales Academy that does the same only with Lancashire/NW leagues

 

Outside those areas:

Elite Six Conference (all created ‘clubs’ that are essentially development academies possibly beefed up with reserve/old pros from elsewhere [number limits on both etc])
-    London & SE
-    (East) Midlands
-    East of England
-    South West
-    South Wales
-    Central (West and South Midlands)
10 game season for committed RL players with potential to play at the highest levels. Grand Final. No P&R with anything else.


Regional leagues supported by actual money and development officers – much like the RL Conference – with three distinct groups:
Premier – Aiming for 14+ game season. Expected to have a stable ground situation, actual volunteers, player pool. All confirmed before being included.
Conference – Aiming for 8-10 game season
Merit – Casual and recreation play

Reality not included.

Edited by gingerjon

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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Just now, gingerjon said:

two relegation spots

Since relegation is the sacred Yellow Idol on the Road to Timbuktu why not 4-5 relegation spots?

That way all the Championship clubs with ambition and the fans who feel cheated would be sorted in one fell swoop.

7 hours ago, RayCee said:

This 27 match structure I presume is based on what Sky wanted and paid for.

I cannot say this for certain but I'm pretty sure this was based entirely on what chairmen saw as a minimum for economic survival.

In which case we're lucky the season doesn't start on Jan 1st and isn't about 86 games long.

Mind you, it would mean more Helen Skelton so the punditry would be improved.

 

 

 

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8 hours ago, RayCee said:

Currently the Championship is two divisions in one. SL teams play each other too often. The idea I posted to address those two issues. In that sense, numbers do matter.

This 27 match structure I presume is based on what Sky wanted and paid for. It’s too long IMO but whoever pays the piper calls the tune.

If you’re going to keep a 27 game regular season, it matters little whether you then decide to have ten, twelve or fourteen teams. The games ills are not resolved by two more teams in Super League and the loss of loop fixtures any more than they are if they go for ten teams playing everyone three times or doing what we already do now with twelve. 

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10 hours ago, RayCee said:

The French ones would be in SL and any other sides not able to fit into the structure would join lower regional divisions.

So I'm assuming your not a fan of the UK teams you would kick out.

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If money was no option:

 

- buy all of the English Premiership RU clubs and the 4 welsh regional to get instant geographic coverage 

- convert clubs to RL clubs

- re-educate the RU on their new team and the advantages of our code     Admittedly this could take as while but if they had no other rugby to watch this could be overcome 

- By my reckoning with current SL teams that would give approximately 30 clubs around the country + France

- Set up 2 leagues. Would probably avoid the stereotype split.  Perhaps SL East and SL West

- play home and away games in own division leading to end of year cross division play offs and grand final 

- Marketing push to recapture the name “Rugby”

- North v South origin series

Not sure what to do with Twickenham.  Would probably just leave it any remaining minor RU teams to use.  
 

A money no object aggressive attack like this would probably lead to the likes of Edinburgh Glasgow Munster and Leinster applying for membership.  Bingo.  A European Super League 

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20 minutes ago, headtackle said:

If money was no option:

 

- buy all of the English Premiership RU clubs and the 4 welsh regional to get instant geographic coverage 

- convert clubs to RL clubs

- re-educate the RU on their new team and the advantages of our code     Admittedly this could take as while but if they had no other rugby to watch this could be overcome 

- By my reckoning with current SL teams that would give approximately 30 clubs around the country + France

- Set up 2 leagues. Would probably avoid the stereotype split.  Perhaps SL East and SL West

- play home and away games in own division leading to end of year cross division play offs and grand final 

- Marketing push to recapture the name “Rugby”

- North v South origin series

Not sure what to do with Twickenham.  Would probably just leave it any remaining minor RU teams to use.  
 

A money no object aggressive attack like this would probably lead to the likes of Edinburgh Glasgow Munster and Leinster applying for membership.  Bingo.  A European Super League 

You obviously don't need the money because rugby union is living in your head rent free.

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Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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Posted (edited)
49 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

You obviously don't need the money because rugby union is living in your head rent free.

That's true of all legends in their own lunch time.

And if it wasn't for things like the wonderful Helen Skelton we wouldn't know the difference!

Edited by Oxford
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12 hours ago, RayCee said:

The French ones would be in SL and any other sides not able to fit into the structure would join lower regional divisions.

Are the French clubs permanently in SL? So no relegation for the French clubs?

If so with the protected promoted club that could possibly mean the forth  bottom placed club would be subject to playing in your relegation winner takes all game.

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Are the French clubs permanently in SL? So no relegation for the French clubs?

If so with the protected promoted club that could possibly mean the forth  bottom placed club would be subject to playing in your relegation winner takes all game.

Steady on Harry, it's just a hashish infused hookah pipe dream.

Not the real thing.

Edited by fighting irish
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