RLWC Attendance-O-Meter

[Sammo]

I live between Arsenal tube station and the steps up to the stadium. About an hour before the match I had to check I hadn’t got the kickoff time wrong as it was so quiet outside the front door. Even compared to a midweek Arsenal cup match it was quiet. I struggle to believe there were 40k there…

[Toby Chopra]

1 minute ago, Sammo said:

I live between Arsenal tube station and the steps up to the stadium. About an hour before the match I had to check I hadn’t got the kickoff time wrong as it was so quiet outside the front door. Even compared to a midweek Arsenal cup match it was quiet. I struggle to believe there were 40k there…

Different crowd coming from different places. Holloway Road between High&I and the stadium was busy with fans from midday onwards.

Crowd felt closer to 40 than 30 for me, definitely more than half full. But what the announced number means we'll never know, given all the mucking around they've done. 

[HawkMan]

Pubs were probably full over North London as Tottenham were also at home and sold out. Kick off at Tottenham was 3pm, so plenty of Spurs fans have a pre match drink in areas like Islington,  Finsbury Park, Holloway, then go to ground, I've done it myself. 

Btw- I can't remember ever having a big game at BOTH Arsenal and Tottenham at the SAME TIME. Police must have given it the OK,  they obviously either knew the crowd at Arsenal would be below average or of course you need less policing at RL.

Edited November 13, 2022 by HawkMan

[crashmon]

1 hour ago, SouthLondonRL said:

I thought around 40K seemed right, although I'm basing that on being at a season ticket holder at Crystal palace who regularly get 26K. The pubs were busy all around the ground. 

I took 3 newbies, one even missed a West Ham game to come along. The first half atmosphere was flat, however the second half was amazing. My friends were had a great day, posted about the event on social media and asked when the next international was. All agreed it was a better day out than at Twickenham. My friends are those that enjoy a day out at an international event. We all go to the cricket, the NFL etc and even what I thought was a steep 70quid ticket ro sit behind the sticks didn't put them off. 

He lies the problem, I cannot tell them when the next international is in London. I honestly think I can double the number if London gets a New Zealand game next year. 

This is a key point here...

But you would get 80K at twickenham for England vs Andorra friendly at rugby Union (andorra play in euro north div 2 so 3 tiers below 6 nations). Yet for a WC semi final you get 30K in League

Reason why,

1) We don't play enough internationals

2) When we do play them we stick them all in the heartlands and none in the south where your new audience is

until you fix 1 and 2 crowds will continue to die

[Black Country Wire]

38 minutes ago, crashmon said:

This is a key point here...

But you would get 80K at twickenham for England vs Andorra friendly at rugby Union (andorra play in euro north div 2 so 3 tiers below 6 nations). Yet for a WC semi final you get 30K in League

Reason why,

1) We don't play enough internationals

2) When we do play them we stick them all in the heartlands and none in the south where your new audience is

until you fix 1 and 2 crowds will continue to die

England got £70k plus at Wembley for a game against San Marino so you do wonder if the RLWC organisers thought bung on an England game and it'll be full.

Who knows? Obviously something needs to be done differently.

[St Reatham]

3 hours ago, moorside roughyed said:

Or we could just accept that the game isn't that popular and use smaller venues so it doesn't look as embarrassing.

That’s pretty much what I’m now thinking. There’s nothing wrong in not getting crowds for International games like other sports. It’s about being realistic.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Black Country Wire said:

England got £70k plus at Wembley for a game against San Marino so you do wonder if the RLWC organisers thought bung on an England game and it'll be full.

Who knows? Obviously something needs to be done differently.

Most Londoners genuinely don't know league is a thing and demographic changes will only exaggerate that

 

 

Edited November 13, 2022 by Leonard

[crashmon]

1 minute ago, Leonard said:

Most Londoners genuinely don't know league is a thing

100% correct, but they will follow England, IF you dont change £100 for the tickets, and IF you play more internationals in London

[moorside roughyed]

4 minutes ago, St Reatham said:

That’s pretty much what I’m now thinking. There’s nothing wrong in not getting crowds for International games like other sports. It’s about being realistic.

Exactly

[Exiled Wiganer]

1 hour ago, Toby Chopra said:

Different crowd coming from different places. Holloway Road between High&I and the stadium was busy with fans from midday onwards.

Crowd felt closer to 40 than 30 for me, definitely more than half full. But what the announced number means we'll never know, given all the mucking around they've done. 

I agree. As I mentioned above, the arsenal regular i was with thought 35k plus. We do seem to have a lot of new posters who are experts in international RL’s shortcomings. Often with reference to the Vichies… I have been staggered by the frequency with which people on this thread accuse people of lying.

[Exiled Wiganer]

15 minutes ago, Leonard said:

Most Londoners genuinely don't know league is a thing and demographic changes will only exaggerate that

 

 

10% of greater Londoners is over 1,000,000 people. 

London figures very prominently in the list of top attendances for our game. 

The least of our problems today is the size of the London RL market. 

[St Reatham]

In terms of the Emirates crowd, why do some people think 40k (or even 30k) is a bad crowd? Why should the crowd be higher? What did the WC organisers do to gain interest? What has rugby league done, in general, to gain interest in London? It’s not Field of Dreams.

[Exiled Wiganer]

4 minutes ago, St Reatham said:

In terms of the Emirates crowd, why do some people think 40k (or even 30k) is a bad crowd? Why should the crowd be higher? What did the WC organisers do to gain interest? What has rugby league done, in general, to gain interest in London? It’s not Field of Dreams.

Historically, 40k is a fantastic crowd for any international game of RL. There may be some on here unhappy about it, or peddling baseless assertions about “fake crowds”, but you just need to look at international attendances to know it’s a superb crowd. 

[pahars]

45 minutes ago, St Reatham said:

That’s pretty much what I’m now thinking. There’s nothing wrong in not getting crowds for International games like other sports. It’s about being realistic.

So considering England have averaged around 30,000 for games against Samoa x2, France, Greece and PNG this tournament at top prices, where would you hold a three test series against Aus or NZ? 

[Dave T]

22 minutes ago, St Reatham said:

In terms of the Emirates crowd, why do some people think 40k (or even 30k) is a bad crowd? Why should the crowd be higher? What did the WC organisers do to gain interest? What has rugby league done, in general, to gain interest in London? It’s not Field of Dreams.

We got 67k last time in London for the semi final. That was a double header, but unlikely to add too many in November, and it was against NZ which is a booster. 

We don't do enough internationally anywhere in the country, but London generally does get a Test match in every series. 

But, criticism as eve, should not be focused on the customers, Londoners or Northerners. It isn't their job to fill the grounds. 

[Dave T]

7 minutes ago, pahars said:

So considering England have averaged around 30,000 for games against Samoa x2, France, Greece and PNG this tournament at top prices, where would you hold a three test series against Aus or NZ? 

We have a very tried and tested formula of London, Yorks and Lancs. 

My personal preference for an Ashes (highest demand) would be:

Wembley, Arsenal, Spurs

Etihad, Anfield, Old Trafford

Elland Rd, St James Pk

[St Reatham]

4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

But, criticism as eve, should not be focused on the customers, Londoners or Northerners. It isn't their job to fill the grounds. 

That’s exactly what I think.

[St Reatham]

3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

We have a very tried and tested formula of London, Yorks and Lancs. 

My personal preference for an Ashes (highest demand) would be:

Wembley, Arsenal, Spurs

Etihad, Anfield, Old Trafford

Elland Rd, St James Pk

I’d go with with smaller stadiums, and try to sell them out. Sell outs would potentially create future demand as people wouldn’t want to miss out? That would require a proper International calendar, years in advance though, and I’m sure someone will tell me that’s totally the wrong way to generate future interest.

[Guest]

20 minutes ago, Dave T said:

We have a very tried and tested formula of London, Yorks and Lancs. 

My personal preference for an Ashes (highest demand) would be:

Wembley, Arsenal, Spurs

Etihad, Anfield, Old Trafford

Elland Rd, St James Pk

I think STP is now definitely on the map.

[Dave T]

12 minutes ago, St Reatham said:

I’d go with with smaller stadiums, and try to sell them out. Sell outs would potentially create future demand as people wouldn’t want to miss out? That would require a proper International calendar, years in advance though, and I’m sure someone will tell me that’s totally the wrong way to generate future interest.

That just takes us back to 2001 and we've moved on from that. 

I think with the Etihad, Elland Rd and London for an Ashes you'd average 40k.

For other nations, I think the 25k grounds like Hudds, Wigan, Bolton, maybe Hull etc are right. 

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, Leonard said:

I think STP is now definitely on the map.

It's a nice sized ground, great facilities and great location in the city. 

I'd gone off it because of less than enjoyable Magic Weekends, but the opener this year was outstanding and was the star of this men's WC to be honest. 

[Chrispmartha]

14 minutes ago, St Reatham said:

I’d go with with smaller stadiums, and try to sell them out. Sell outs would potentially create future demand as people wouldn’t want to miss out? That would require a proper International calendar, years in advance though, and I’m sure someone will tell me that’s totally the wrong way to generate future interest.

But we’ve seen even in this tournament England can Attract multiple crowds of 30-40k plus, why limit that to 20-25k stadiums.

Id really like to see a proper Ashes series again, when was the last time that happened?

Id have them at

Wembley/tottenham

St James Park/Elland Road

Etihad/Old Trafford

 

All 3 would get 40k plus crowds 

[St Reatham]

And this all ties in nicely to the fact that no one knows for sure when England are playing next, and where. The World Cup organisers had many years to sell out the Emirates, and failed, so why not somewhere smaller in London? 30-40k capacity?

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, St Reatham said:

And this all ties in nicely to the fact that no one knows for sure when England are playing next, and where. The World Cup organisers had many years to sell out the Emirates, and failed, so why not somewhere smaller in London? 30-40k capacity?

I have a feeling if you have a 30k stadium you will get 20k.

Emirates or Spurs shows ambition and both are great grounds (Wembley is too big for me).

You go 30k then it doesn't smack of must see.

Chelsea could be an option - but I think Emirates is ideal for travel links.

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, Dave T said:

That just takes us back to 2001 and we've moved on from that. 

I think with the Etihad, Elland Rd and London for an Ashes you'd average 40k.

For other nations, I think the 25k grounds like Hudds, Wigan, Bolton, maybe Hull etc are right. 

I think Hudds and Hull need to be canned. They have a lot of previous.

I would rather Coventry or even Sheffield again.