Am I right about the game?

[EssexRL]

I am, I hope, an open minded chap but looking at all that has happened recently it seems to me, in stark contrast to 6-7 years ago, that the sport has decided to essentially focus solely on where SL is played (or nearby*). If one is asked - what is the game doing to support RL in the south or Cumbria, or Wales or Scotland or London, the answer is "nothing". It seems a real disconnect that IMG were bought in to help is think about the future but we end up with a future that is a (much) narrower version of the present? 

Is this fair?

*It feels that Broncos promotion doesn't fit the narrative and the ridiculous grading criteria, particularly in respect of catchment area, means that London is unlikely to have a major presence in the sport after next year,

 

[Coco]

I have mentioned this, I don't understand the grading criteria. I also feel that the game has made a terrible decision signing with IMG. 

We do need to support areas like London / Cumbria / Yorkshire / Lancashire / North East, this criteria does not. We seem to have lost our identity about being a rugby league family.  We need to strengthen what we are. We are losing a lot of fans, from traditional areas and not gaining any ones. 

We don't seem to have any plans for the future. We need to strengthen what we have, and not want we don't have. I do respect the views of others here, but we have been losing a lot of what we are. 

We are being told that there are plans, and if you see IMG and the RFL vision for the game, it's a joke. The international plans currently is also a joke. We are losing our roots. 

[FileyBulldog]

28 minutes ago, EssexRL said:

I am, I hope, an open minded chap but looking at all that has happened recently it seems to me, in stark contrast to 6-7 years ago, that the sport has decided to essentially focus solely on where SL is played (or nearby*). If one is asked - what is the game doing to support RL in the south or Cumbria, or Wales or Scotland or London, the answer is "nothing". It seems a real disconnect that IMG were bought in to help is think about the future but we end up with a future that is a (much) narrower version of the present? 

Is this fair?

*It feels that Broncos promotion doesn't fit the narrative and the ridiculous grading criteria, particularly in respect of catchment area, means that London is unlikely to have a major presence in the sport after next year,

 

You have nailed it there, I mean look at Cornwall basically being "bullied" into withdrawing from the 1895 Cup because they want to keep the sport up North. Honestly it seems like the only fans that are flying the flag for IMG as the great saviour are fans of protected Super League teams. This IMG rating is purely for the top Super League clubs and does little to help Championship and League One clubs at all. I don't see League One being here a year from now (I hope I am wrong). Telling clubs in the Championship and League One that they will never be good enough for the Super League despite winning league titles and grand finals because they don't fit into what they want the Super League to look like helps the sport how exactly? I get that in most sports you need to invest to get success however how are these ratings systems going to attract investors, how is the little help from the RFL to the lower league clubs going to attract investors?

[Gav Wilson]

Of course, none of the issues lamented in the opening three posts are because of IMG but they've become the easiest stick to beat the game with I suppose.

IMG were brought in specifically BECAUSE of these issues.

[glossop saint]

17 minutes ago, FileyBulldog said:

You have nailed it there, I mean look at Cornwall basically being "bullied" into withdrawing from the 1895 Cup because they want to keep the sport up North. Honestly it seems like the only fans that are flying the flag for IMG as the great saviour are fans of protected Super League teams. This IMG rating is purely for the top Super League clubs and does little to help Championship and League One clubs at all. I don't see League One being here a year from now (I hope I am wrong). Telling clubs in the Championship and League One that they will never be good enough for the Super League despite winning league titles and grand finals because they don't fit into what they want the Super League to look like helps the sport how exactly? I get that in most sports you need to invest to get success however how are these ratings systems going to attract investors, how is the little help from the RFL to the lower league clubs going to attract investors?

If you are saying that you want the gradings to be more based on catchment, work done converting locals to RL and potential player and fan pool then I agree. Get Newcastle, London and a South Wales club in SL in the next couple of years. Good thinking.

If you want P and R so that clubs in the heartlands can use their advantages of having a large supply of players, often produced by other clubs, on their doorstep so they can focus spending their money on those players and not their infrastructure to win promotion and not grow the game then I do not agree.

[Mathius Hellwege]

no

[Midlands hobo]

15 years ago maybe just a bit more the RL conference was booming teams all over the south were popping up. Granted there were alot of RU players trying to get fit but there seemed a genuine appetite.

It all appears to have fallen away a genuine opportunity to get players interested and pathways for open for junior teams to start up along side the seniors and produce the most important thing in the professional game. Fans 

[Whippet13]

13 minutes ago, Gav Wilson said:

Of course, none of the issues lamented in the opening three posts are because of IMG but they've become the easiest stick to beat the game with I suppose.

IMG were brought in specifically BECAUSE of these issues.

Plus IMG dont have any actual power or control - SL clubs still pull the strings, for example, we have Magic again next year when IMG wanted it (rightly or wrongly) scrapped.

[Archie Gordon]

29 minutes ago, Gav Wilson said:

Of course, none of the issues lamented in the opening three posts are because of IMG but they've become the easiest stick to beat the game with I suppose.

IMG were brought in specifically BECAUSE of these issues.

I suppose IMG may just be unlucky with their timing. 6 x tests along the M62 in 2023. Cornwall eased out of the 1895 Cup. Skolars gone from L1. Even if they're just unlucky, you'd be hard pressed to show evidence that IMG has been interested in anything other than SL.

 

[Coco]

I am not just blaming IMG, I also blame the RFL and the international board. I just find it disgraceful how we are treating our fans.  I am not just blaming IMG, I also blame the RFL and those that make decisions on the international scene.

The decisions that have been made including signing with IMG, will only lose more fans. We are losing fans in our heartlands. I am a supporter of Promotion and relegation, I am also a supporter of teams that are based in towns. What decisions that have made for the sport, will only increase the loss of fans. Rugby League is a family sport, it has its own identity, which we have lossed. 

These plans they have followed and have developed will only mean the loss of more fans, and not gaining any new ones. 

[FileyBulldog]

Just now, Coco said:

I am not just blaming IMG, I also blame the RFL and the international board. I just find it disgraceful how we are treating our fans.  I am not just blaming IMG, I also blame the RFL and those that make decisions on the international scene.

The decisions that have been made including signing with IMG, will only lose more fans. We are losing fans in our heartlands. I am a supporter of Promotion and relegation, I am also a supporter of teams that are based in towns. What decisions that have made for the sport, will only increase the loss of fans. Rugby League is a family sport, it has its own identity, which we have lossed. 

These plans they have followed and have developed will only mean the loss of more fans, and not gaining any new ones. 

Losing fans in our heartlands, you put it better than me, I would say we are losing them in our s***loads and doing nothing to bring them back or attract new ones.

[JohnM]

7 minutes ago, FileyBulldog said:

Losing fans in our heartlands, you put it better than me, I would say we are losing them in our s***loads and doing nothing to bring them back or attract new ones.

Ignoring for a moment that you are mistaken, what is your solution?

[LeeF]

10 minutes ago, Coco said:

I am not just blaming IMG, I also blame the RFL and the international board. I just find it disgraceful how we are treating our fans.  I am not just blaming IMG, I also blame the RFL and those that make decisions on the international scene.

The decisions that have been made including signing with IMG, will only lose more fans. We are losing fans in our heartlands. I am a supporter of Promotion and relegation, I am also a supporter of teams that are based in towns. What decisions that have made for the sport, will only increase the loss of fans. Rugby League is a family sport, it has its own identity, which we have lossed. 

These plans they have followed and have developed will only mean the loss of more fans, and not gaining any new ones. 

So what do you think should be done 

[FileyBulldog]

4 minutes ago, JohnM said:

Ignoring for a moment that you are mistaken, what is your solution?

Tell me in what way does IMG help Championship, League One and below clubs when the money doesn't exist for those clubs to improve their ratings?

[JohnM]

Just now, FileyBulldog said:

Tell me in what way does IMG help Championship, League One and below clubs when the money doesn't exist for those clubs to improve their ratings?

 have you read all the documentation associalted with the Re-imagining project? 

[FileyBulldog]

Just now, JohnM said:

 have you read all the documentation associalted with the Re-imagining project? 

And you are sold on all that are you? Could I ask where you club ranked?

[Coco]

What is the answer? Firstly it's just my opinion we need to distribute the money the sport receives more evenly. Clubs in the championship and league 1 need more support, financially. I would also like to have 20 team Super League. The likes of Toulouse / Wakefield / Featherstone / Bradford / York / can be sustainable in Super League. Oldham are making a lot of noise in the press. Happy to hear the return of them. That's made me really happy. When I first started watching rugby league, Oldham was part of the Premiership.

I would like to return to our original name The Rugby League Premiership. We hire a firm that understands our sport and ask them to help the club's keep and attract new fans. We return to our roots. We give clubs help, with their financial needs. Help them develop their academies. We become a more financial sustainable league. 

Please understand, this is just my opinion. Don't all get excited, and not looking for an argument. Please share your thoughts. Sponsorship should be for all the family. Not just one club. Oh, yeah those that know my views, I would also like a state of Origin series, as well as a France v Wales series. A family helps each other, we also look out for other. This has all been lost. The sport used to bring the family together. It all seems to lost. 

[Griff]

17 minutes ago, Coco said:

What is the answer? Firstly it's just my opinion we need to distribute the money the sport receives more evenly. Clubs in the championship and league 1 need more support, financially. I would also like to have 20 team Super League. The likes of Toulouse / Wakefield / Featherstone / Bradford / York / can be sustainable in Super League. Oldham are making a lot of noise in the press. Happy to hear the return of them. That's made me really happy. When I first started watching rugby league, Oldham was part of the Premiership.

I would like to return to our original name The Rugby League Premiership. We hire a firm that understands our sport and ask them to help the club's keep and attract new fans. We return to our roots. We give clubs help, with their financial needs. Help them develop their academies. We become a more financial sustainable league. 

Please understand, this is just my opinion. Don't all get excited, and not looking for an argument. Please share your thoughts. Sponsorship should be for all the family. Not just one club. Oh, yeah those that know my views, I would also like a state of Origin series, as well as a France v Wales series. A family helps each other, we also look out for other. This has all been lost. The sport used to bring the family together. It all seems to lost. 

Rugby League Premiership was our original name?

When was this?

[Damien]

14 minutes ago, Coco said:

What is the answer? Firstly it's just my opinion we need to distribute the money the sport receives more evenly. Clubs in the championship and league 1 need more support, financially. I would also like to have 20 team Super League. The likes of Toulouse / Wakefield / Featherstone / Bradford / York / can be sustainable in Super League. Oldham are making a lot of noise in the press. Happy to hear the return of them. That's made me really happy. When I first started watching rugby league, Oldham was part of the Premiership.

I would like to return to our original name The Rugby League Premiership. We hire a firm that understands our sport and ask them to help the club's keep and attract new fans. We return to our roots. We give clubs help, with their financial needs. Help them develop their academies. We become a more financial sustainable league. 

Please understand, this is just my opinion. Don't all get excited, and not looking for an argument. Please share your thoughts. Sponsorship should be for all the family. Not just one club. Oh, yeah those that know my views, I would also like a state of Origin series, as well as a France v Wales series. A family helps each other, we also look out for other. This has all been lost. The sport used to bring the family together. It all seems to lost. 

A 20 team SL with clubs sharing approximately 700k each isn't going to be too super, would have clubs that cant even be full time and wouldn't be sustainable for many clubs.

The Rugby League Premiership was never the name to decide the league championship either.

[glossop saint]

23 minutes ago, Coco said:

What is the answer? Firstly it's just my opinion we need to distribute the money the sport receives more evenly. Clubs in the championship and league 1 need more support, financially. I would also like to have 20 team Super League. The likes of Toulouse / Wakefield / Featherstone / Bradford / York / can be sustainable in Super League. Oldham are making a lot of noise in the press. Happy to hear the return of them. That's made me really happy. When I first started watching rugby league, Oldham was part of the Premiership.

I would like to return to our original name The Rugby League Premiership. We hire a firm that understands our sport and ask them to help the club's keep and attract new fans. We return to our roots. We give clubs help, with their financial needs. Help them develop their academies. We become a more financial sustainable league. 

Please understand, this is just my opinion. Don't all get excited, and not looking for an argument. Please share your thoughts. Sponsorship should be for all the family. Not just one club. Oh, yeah those that know my views, I would also like a state of Origin series, as well as a France v Wales series. A family helps each other, we also look out for other. This has all been lost. The sport used to bring the family together. It all seems to lost. 

Can you clarify what you mean by 'return to our roots'? Does that include London? South of France? South Wales? The original rebel clubs of 1895? As resident in Stockport that would be great news.

[ATLANTISMAN]

1 hour ago, Whippet13 said:

Plus IMG dont have any actual power or control - SL clubs still pull the strings, for example, we have Magic again next year when IMG wanted it (rightly or wrongly) scrapped.

I can see magic ending up at Elland Road:((((

[EssexRL]

1 hour ago, Mathius Hellwege said:

no

Fair enough. Tell me what you think will change my mind - I really want to believe the best 

[EssexRL]

1 hour ago, LeeF said:

So what do you think should be done 

As a RL die hard living in north London where it will take me nearly two hour to get to Broncos who what ever they do next year probably won’t be in SL the year after and whose last international (WC aside) was 5 years ago - what should I do? Ifs RL a sport for people who live in 3-4 counties of England?

[Coco]

By ignoring our roots, I mean our identity as a Rugby League Family. Our teams in our heartlands. There are clubs that are sustainable in a new Rugby League Premiership. We have lost too many fans. Yes London, South of France are included. Wales are included. Doncaster is also included, once they are financially sustainable. 

I have noticed certain clubs are only interested in their interests, these clubs have actually caused the game to lose too many fans. We have lost  many fans and have not gained any new ones. Featherstone Vs Castleford was a game to watch. Then you add Wakefield to the mix and it's great rivalry. Bradford Vs Leeds. Then you put in Halifax and that was a great rivalry. 

We seem to have lost what made the identity of the sport. The sport had its own identity, family values and great rivalry and friendship. These have been lost. 

[EssexRL]

13 minutes ago, Coco said:

By ignoring our roots, I mean our identity as a Rugby League Family. Our teams in our heartlands. There are clubs that are sustainable in a new Rugby League Premiership. We have lost too many fans. Yes London, South of France are included. Wales are included. Doncaster is also included, once they are financially sustainable. 

I have noticed certain clubs are only interested in their interests, these clubs have actually caused the game to lose too many fans. We have lost  many fans and have not gained any new ones. Featherstone Vs Castleford was a game to watch. Then you add Wakefield to the mix and it's great rivalry. Bradford Vs Leeds. Then you put in Halifax and that was a great rivalry. 

We seem to have lost what made the identity of the sport. The sport had its own identity, family values and great rivalry and friendship. These have been lost. 

I have a more expansionist view than you but I think you hit the nail on the head. Is the future about a West Yorkshire derby or about including people like me?  Putting it crudely at the moment the future feels a lot more about maximising the potential of a West Yorkshire game than raising engagement with the game in East London! (There is a separate debate about whether we are delivering that - in my view - narrow vision, eg many watch Bulls, Halifax, Dewsbury, Giants etc ?) I’m not sure looking back is the best way forward. 

Edited November 12, 2023 by EssexRL