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Time to move the Grand Final (Merged Threads)


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14 hours ago, 17 stone giant said:

Etihad is going up to 62000 in around 2026, but that's still below most of the attendances the Grand Final gets.

I would keep it at Old Trafford for now. Man Utd fans put up with it for 19 plus matches a year, so I think RL fans can manage for just one match, especially when there is no serious local alternative.

Man Utd will probably sort out a new stadium/refurbishment in the next few years anyway.

Why is the Etihad's capacity being increased, is it for the away supporters? 🙂

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3 hours ago, Zilla Budgie said:

Why is the Etihad's capacity being increased, is it for the away supporters? 🙂

Dont be naughty and dont turn it into cross code 

 Soon we will be dancing the fandango
FROM 2004,TO DO WHAT THIS CLUB HAS DONE,IF THATS NOT GREATNESSTHEN i DONT KNOW WHAT IS.

JAMIE PEACOCK

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9 hours ago, Damien said:

It's not though. The 17 Grand Finals prior to the Covid/Catalans years all had a capacity exceeding 62k, including 7 that exceeded 70k.

Long time ago 17 years

..how about the last half a dozen years 

The average is 58604....not enough to sell out Ethiad 

The 'covid' final did not sell.out...it was poor because it was Catalan ...same for last year....

We can't discount Catalan ...they are very likely to reach the final....they are the new norm 

ABOVE ALL....in no GF ever has OT ever sold out....

This has a snowballing effect on the next year and so on  

Your argument about loyalty and consistency to not move to the Ethiad I understand (but disagree) 

Your  argument the Ethiad is not big enough is just not true ...it represents sthe perfect size to get the 'just sold out' sweet spot ....as well as being a MUCH better venue 

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4 hours ago, John bird said:

Etihad for the grandfinal and anfield and st James park for challenge cup final on rotation for me.

Why St James’ Park? Their League team has just pretty much folded, there’s no fan base up there and it’s much further for Heartlands and Southern fans to travel than Manchester. 

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The ideal scenario sees Old Trafford rebuilt.

Ideally in that time we would go wherever Manchester United go - be that remaining at OT during redevelopment or the Etihad. I wouldn't be averse to a Cardiff or London final though that said. The loyalty to Old Trafford has been worth it, its arguably one of the sports few long term partnerships.

This really hinges on Sir Jim Ratcliffe's ownership pushing the football club in that direction of redevelopment. If he can't get it going then there is going to come a point where it isn't good enough. I've sat in various parts of old trafford and whilst the bowl itself is very good, potentially the best in the country tied with Cardiff, the rest of the ground is really dire. Its very tired and the video on page 1 epitomises the state of things.

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21 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

Long time ago 17 years

..how about the last half a dozen years 

The average is 58604....not enough to sell out Ethiad 

The 'covid' final did not sell.out...it was poor because it was Catalan ...same for last year....

We can't discount Catalan ...they are very likely to reach the final....they are the new norm 

ABOVE ALL....in no GF ever has OT ever sold out....

This has a snowballing effect on the next year and so on  

Your argument about loyalty and consistency to not move to the Ethiad I understand (but disagree) 

Your  argument the Ethiad is not big enough is just not true ...it represents sthe perfect size to get the 'just sold out' sweet spot ....as well as being a MUCH better venue 

ABOVE ALL there have been 5 attendances north of 70,000 3 of which were over 72,000. They reduce the capacity because of the big screen. I disagree that there has never been a sellout.

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Posted (edited)
38 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

Long time ago 17 years

..how about the last half a dozen years 

The average is 58604....not enough to sell out Ethiad 

The 'covid' final did not sell.out...it was poor because it was Catalan ...same for last year....

We can't discount Catalan ...they are very likely to reach the final....they are the new norm 

ABOVE ALL....in no GF ever has OT ever sold out....

This has a snowballing effect on the next year and so on  

Your argument about loyalty and consistency to not move to the Ethiad I understand (but disagree) 

Your  argument the Ethiad is not big enough is just not true ...it represents sthe perfect size to get the 'just sold out' sweet spot ....as well as being a MUCH better venue 

17 years straight having an attendance over 62k is pretty consistent. 

Not sure why you'd base a strategy around Covid affected years and two years that include an overseas team. And attendances did show the game was affected in those years as was debated widely on here. Seems pretty flawed to me.

Grand finals have sold out at Old Trafford, that is false.

The last Catlans final was actually quite good and only a touch under the capacity of the Etihad at 58,137.

Edited by Damien
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1 minute ago, Gomersall said:

ABOVE ALL there have been 5 attendances north of 70,000 3 of which were over 72,000. They reduce the capacity because of the big screen. I disagree that there has never been a sellout.

There have certainly been sellouts.

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Posted (edited)
36 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

 ABOVE ALL....in no GF ever has OT ever sold out....

This has a snowballing effect on the next year and so on  

You only need to go back 6 and 8 finals to find the last two:

6 years ago:

As part of the pre-match entertainment for the 20th instalment of the Super League Grand Final, the sell-out crowd was treated to a Northern Soul medley to whet the appetite for kick-off. In hindsight it might have been wiser to plump for Motown because, as the Four Tops sang way back when, it’s the same old song once again for Leeds and their Old Trafford opponents.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/oct/07/castleford-leeds-super-league-grand-final-match-report

8 years ago:

It was a victory for rugby league before a 73,512 record attendance for a Grand Final at Old Trafford, despite the presence of England's union side just miles away playing Uruguay at the nearby Etihad Stadium.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/34457977

Edited by Damien
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49 minutes ago, Eddie said:

Why St James’ Park? Their League team has just pretty much folded, there’s no fan base up there and it’s much further for Heartlands and Southern fans to travel than Manchester. 

Same could be said for London.

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I think we must remember that not every stadium that we may want to play the Grand Final in would want us. Would Man City want us playing their in the middle of their season? I've seen nothing to suggest so.

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, Chris22 said:

I think we must remember that not every stadium that we may want to play the Grand Final in would want us. Would Man City want us playing their in the middle of their season? I've seen nothing to suggest so.

We know Man City in the past have been reluctant to allow RL games during the Football season and resisted attempts to play internationals there after we had one in the 4 Nations some years ago. Magic is a different beast as it isn't fixed but even that was actually changed to a later date when it moved to the Etihad so it would be after the Football season ended.

Edited by Damien
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Putting aside any issues around whether clubs want RL played during the season (loads of football clubs allow it when we try), the numbers of moving to a lower capacity ground may not be as challenging as some think. 

This is fag packet stuff as we don't know the exact numbers, but let's say the average income per ticker is £40, to move from an average of 70k to one of 56k would mean we'd have to replace c£560k of income, which is a tenner a ticket. Considering you'd have a little more scarcity, you'd have a better stadium, and more likely more sellouts leading to a better perception of the event, we should be confident of adding a tenner to the ticket. 

It's pretty standard to be at Old Trafford and have loads of corporate boxes empty, so I doubt there'd be an issue there. 

As much as I like the actual bowl for the game at Old Trafford, I do think we put up with too many negatives now - poor area, below average facilities, small pitch, poor technology etc. I don't think these things are worth continuing to put up with for history and atmosphere. I think it, and our Grand Final is looking dated now. 

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It has been a good partner to the game and is an iconic stadium. But it isn't so good that you couldn't countenance an alternative and, notwithstanding its more recent issues, the pitch is terrible for rugby league: short and dangerous.

If we could secure a 60k+ stadium near the M62 for 5+ years we should do it. As has been said there isn't one around at the moment, so OT it is. Our Grand Final is a great event and we should be bold about getting the best facilities for it.

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I can confirm 30+ less sales for Scotland vs Italy at Workington, after this afternoons test purchase for the Tonga match, ÂŁ7.50 is extremely reasonable, however a ÂŁ2.50 'delivery' fee for a walk in purchase is beyond taking the mickey, good luck with that, it's cheaper on the telly.

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1 hour ago, Gomersall said:

ABOVE ALL there have been 5 attendances north of 70,000 3 of which were over 72,000. They reduce the capacity because of the big screen. I disagree that there has never been a sellout.

72000 was not a sell out.....and it hasn't happened recently and won't again 

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1 hour ago, Damien said:

You only need to go back 6 and 8 finals to find the last two:

6 years ago:

As part of the pre-match entertainment for the 20th instalment of the Super League Grand Final, the sell-out crowd was treated to a Northern Soul medley to whet the appetite for kick-off. In hindsight it might have been wiser to plump for Motown because, as the Four Tops sang way back when, it’s the same old song once again for Leeds and their Old Trafford opponents.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/oct/07/castleford-leeds-super-league-grand-final-match-report

8 years ago:

It was a victory for rugby league before a 73,512 record attendance for a Grand Final at Old Trafford, despite the presence of England's union side just miles away playing Uruguay at the nearby Etihad Stadium.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/34457977

73512 was not a sell out....and  unlikely to be a number we hit again 

If you wanted a ticket you could always get one from the release if tickets to kick off

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2 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

73512 was not a sell out....and  unlikely to be a number we hit again 

If you wanted a ticket you could always get one from the release if tickets to kick off

How many have to be there for you to believe it’s a sellout? The capacity of OT is listed as 74,310. As I said, X amount of seats are lost to the big screen.

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

73512 was not a sell out....and  unlikely to be a number we hit again 

If you wanted a ticket you could always get one from the release if tickets to kick off

It was a sellout. I mean it was a record crowd and according to wiki

The sellout crowd of 73,512 at Old Trafford set a new Super League Grand Final attendance record, eclipsing the previous record of 72,575 established at the 2006 Super League Grand Final.[2] British indie rock band The Charlatans headlined the pre-match and half-time entertainment.[3]

If you wish to ignore that it is up to you.

Strange you ignore the other one that states a sellout with a lower crowd than this too. Obviously the total seats available varies due to entertainment etc.

Edited by Damien
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19 minutes ago, Gomersall said:

How many have to be there for you to believe it’s a sellout? The capacity of OT is listed as 74,310. As I said, X amount of seats are lost to the big screen.

I mean we can either believe every report on this or believe Bedfordshire Bronco:

This weekend's Super League Grand Final in Manchester will be watched by a record sell-out crowd at Old Trafford.

More than 73,000 tickets have been snapped up for the title decider between Wigan and Leeds on Saturday when the Rhinos will be attempting to secure the treble - having already won the Challenge Cup and League Leaders' Shield.

The previous best attendance for a Grand Final was 72,582 in 2006 when St Helens beat Hull.

Super League general manager Blake Solly said: "The last few weeks have been a brilliant time for rugby league in this country.

"We have seen the League Leaders' Shield won with the last play of the season, one of the greatest ever semi-final encounters and, as a result, a huge surge in demand for tickets.

"I am delighted there will be a full house to watch the game on Saturday between the two top teams in the Super League this year and I can't wait to watch what promises to be a great event."

https://www.skysports.com/amp/rugby-league/news/12196/10019806/sell-out-for-super-league-grand-final-at-old-trafford-on-saturday

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Damien said:

It was a sellout. I mean it was a record crowd and according to wiki

The sellout crowd of 73,512 at Old Trafford set a new Super League Grand Final attendance record, eclipsing the previous record of 72,575 established at the 2006 Super League Grand Final.[2] British indie rock band The Charlatans headlined the pre-match and half-time entertainment.[3]

If you wish to ignore that it is up to you.

Strange you ignore the other one that states a sellout with a lower crowd than this too. Obviously the total seats available varies due to entertainment etc.

Ok...let's say one sell out and one close out of 26 

Is that a good chance of it happening regularly? 

Especially now when the last 6 years have averaged under 60,000

Is a 1.5 chance out of 26 of a sell out worth crappy small seats, awful concourses, a generally horrid and dated / uncomfortable experience? 

Shouldn't we be calling out Man United for not maintaining the the stadium? Or should we be pathetically grateful ?

We choose the best option for me and one that fits our CURRENT expected size of crowd ....with maybe a few missing out for no booking early (which is a desirable situation to be in )

In the future if say a lot more fans missing out then you know what tough...make our best occasion a risk to book later....a risk people might miss out on...scarcity can be valued and ultimately increases value 

Or we put up with a shabby experience for our biggest occasion and let as many people as they want to book their tickets as late as they want 

Edited by Bedfordshire Bronco
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