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England starting 13 v NZ

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stevereed100

stevereed100

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Tomkins if fit! Do you mean fit to play or fit to be selected as Englands no1. Presume Shaul is on the wing to carry Tomkins handbag....is that all you think he is fit for?

As with last year why dont we name Tomkins in the squad, pay him, laud him and feed him and then let him cry off if it suits. If we dropped him he might be upset. Its not fair! Thats his cry not mine.

Or we could be honest, forget who he once was and pick on current form.

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Tommygilf

Tommygilf

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Tomkins if fit! Do you mean fit to play or fit to be selected as Englands no1. Presume Shaul is on the wing to carry Tomkins handbag....is that all you think he is fit for?

As with last year why dont we name Tomkins in the squad, pay him, laud him and feed him and then let him cry off if it suits. If we dropped him he might be upset. Its not fair! Thats his cry not mine.

Or we could be honest, forget who he once was and pick on current form.

Undoubtedly a fully fit Sam Tomkins is the best Fullback England has (I can't stand him most of the time so it takes a lot to say that), a good season from Shaul doesn't change that. However Shaul's performances do warrant note and just as Australia and NZ have done (most recently with Darius Boyd and RTS respectively) is play a good fullback on the wing.

Bateman again is quality, I just hope he hasn't got into a fight with another England team mate by the end of the year.

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Dave T

Dave T

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Atkins seemed to have burnt his bridges with McNamara which was strange considering he was forgiving of so many others.

Atkins has been excellent this year and is the kind of strong centre we need against Aussies and Kiwis - he does still jave errors in him though, but our choices for centre are limited.

Somebody above named Westwood, he's too old for that level now to have the impact that some of the younger lads can. Been great for England and Wire but he should now be a spectator during the 4N..

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Dunbar

Dunbar

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But would you pick him ahead of Sam Burgess at 13 - I definitely wouldn't

 

I think England are a stronger team with O'Loughlin at loose forward and Burgess as part of the front row rotation alongside Graham, Hill and George Burgess.

 

Sam Burgess can play a lot of minutes and is very mobile so there is the option of him staying out even when two of the other props are on but I don't see O'Loughlin and Sam Burgess being a binary choice.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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Barry Badrinath

Barry Badrinath

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Not a bad shout he's played well this year whenever I've seen him.

Just been awarded player of the month.

Been a lot of talk in the local press about how he's changed his approach this year,he went all in on pre season which has led to his pretty good form.

It also happens to be contract season, which I'm sure has nothing to do with it

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Dave T

Dave T

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I suppose this poses the question of which NRL based england players (if any) wouldn't get in the team.

I think there is debate around Hodgson and Cooper. Both are good enough, have shown this and played well for England, but we do have a lot of choice in their positions.

 

Joe Burgess didn't do a good enough job last year for England imho.

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Tommygilf

Tommygilf

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I think there is debate around Hodgson and Cooper. Both are good enough, have shown this and played well for England, but we do have a lot of choice in their positions.

Joe Burgess didn't do a good enough job last year for England imho.

I don't really disagree, suppose there is a question mark around whether Reed will be able to play too amd Widdop never seems to get a good write up on here.

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Saint Toppy

Saint Toppy

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I think there is debate around Hodgson and Cooper. Both are good enough, have shown this and played well for England, but we do have a lot of choice in their positions.

 

Joe Burgess didn't do a good enough job last year for England imho.

Burges hasn't had a good year this year either. Barely got any time in a struggling Roosters team and not really shone for Souths either

Of the others, Widdop has been pretty poor for the Dragons most of the year. Had the odd good game here & there but not much to shout about. Many Aussie commentators are saying he should be stripped of the captaincy as he can't seem to handle the extra pressure.

 

James Graham & Sam Burgess are pretty much a given that they'll be in the starting 13. You'd think Tom & George Burgess, Josh Hodgson, Elliot Whitehead, Zak Hardaker and Mike Cooper will almost certainly be in the squad as well, so that pretty much covers 8 of the squad places.

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Dunbar

Dunbar

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I would say James Graham, Sam Burgess, Josh Hodgson and Elliot Whitehead are absolutely nailed on for the team.  George Burgess is 99%.  I wouldn't be surprised to see Tom Burgess, Mike Cooper and Zac Hardaker made the squad but perhaps not the 17 while Joe Burgess and Greg Eden have no chance.

 

Gareth Widdop will no doubt be in the squad as would Jack Reed if fit but I guess they are in the category of English but never played in the English professional game (you could in fact say the same about George Burgess).

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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Lowdesert

Lowdesert

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I think there is debate around Hodgson and Cooper. Both are good enough, have shown this and played well for England, but we do have a lot of choice in their positions.

 

Joe Burgess didn't do a good enough job last year for England imho.

I've watched Hodgson all year and he is playing out of his skin and exudes confidence. No one to touch him in SL IMO.

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Dunbar

Dunbar

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Joe Burgess is very young - he has plenty of time to fulfil his undoubted potential.

Clark and Roby as hookers for my money.

Has Reed played well at Brisbane as we are weak in the centres?

 

Hodgson will be in the England squad and I expect him to be the starting 9.  He is the incumbent and improving all the time.  The main question is whether it is Roby or Clark alongside Hodgson.

 

Reed started the season well but is now injured.  The injury is very worrying and there are rumours that he may have to retire.  He will not be seen in the Autumn.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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GaryO

GaryO

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Joe Burgess is very young - he has plenty of time to fulfil his undoubted potential.

Clark and Roby as hookers for my money.

Has Reed played well at Brisbane as we are weak in the centres?

Considering your enquiry re Reed I take it you haven't seen much of the NRL this season EW.

In the games I have seen Canberra, about 10, Josh Hodgson has been nothing short of sensational at 9, he play's a different game to both Clarke and Roby and of the 3 his organising and distribution around the ruck wins him a place for me, all depends on how Bennett organises his pack and half's which will sway his decision. I would not be surprised to see Hodgson get the nod for one of the 9 spots as he offers an alternative offence whilst Clarke and Roby can be very similar.

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Tex Evans Thigh

Tex Evans Thigh

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Interesting discussion. There are a few places that are up for grabs and it will be interesting to see how NRL biased Bennett will be.

 

FB - Lomax seems to be coming into form but expect Hardaker to get the nod if he impresses at Penrith

WG - Hall and McGillvary 

CN - Christ knows

HV - Gale has been playing well as has Sneyd, Smith seems to up his game for England as well. Widdop will be one of the halves even though his form has been poor.

PR - Hill, Walmsley, rest from NRL

HK - Hodgeson is a must he is immense, Roby and Clarke to fight for impact hooker spot, at the moment I'd say Clarke

SR - Currie, Bateman, Whitehead

LF - SOL, still a top performer and leader

 

On the NRL guys I dont think Cooper is at the same level as some of the others, Joe Burgess should be nowhere near.

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Exiled Wiganer

Exiled Wiganer

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Am a bit confused about the criteria for now, but I would be pleased to see this team start the 4Ns (and am deferring to NRLers on Hodgson):

Tonkins - McGilvray - Watkins - Percival - Manfredi - Widdop - Williams - Taylor - Hodgson - Hill - S Burgess - Bateman - O'Loughlin

T Burgess - Currie - Graham - Clark

That'll win the comp, easy peasy.

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yipyee

yipyee

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Haven't done this for a while, but there's a lot of talent around. Just not sure about the halves...

Tompkins should be nowhere near unless he gets his head together fast

In the last 2 games:

Dropped balls high tackles running sideways looking for an offload I would think hardaker lomax and even grix is above him in the pecking order!

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