Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Bullish Giant Rhino

Second Canadian Team

Recommended Posts

On 28/02/2018 at 7:03 AM, Omott91 said:

On to the Knights, what you stated is absurd ''How about a rich man in Denver buys your club, calls it Denver Cowboys and ships your best 30 players over to North America to play in a Transatlantic Superleague''. Will never happen as the NRL would block it.

This is a gem. As soon as I suggest YOUR club is disbanded to facilitate a second North American club, you take immediate fright and declare that the NRL should save you from a North American takeover. Come on Omott, Knights are hardly that great an assett to the NRL. An Antipodean-American League will be brilliant, RL could take over the world, sacrifice yourself for us?;)

23 hours ago, RayCee said:

The benefits (Canada) and the USA will bring to the game. 

More fans turning up,  more revenue for the game, Greater TV and media opportunities, more money for the game. More international exposure for RL will become involved = more money for the game. 

Young Nth American athletes getting to know about RL and giving it a go. the potential is breathtaking. RL has an amazing opportunity before it. So much to gain and nothing to lose. 

That's one heck of a business plan, take that down to your bank for a loan. You appear to have disappeared inside your own head Ray. It's the last bit that get's me because actually the plan involves "losing" half of  Superleague here to North America to form the Transatlantic league.

Here is a fact for Omott. Perez said recently "When we started this journey, we knew that one team is not enough to yield what you need to yield from the market.To bring revenues, to really start bringing new money into the sport you've got to have multi-markets. Now that Toronto is up and running It's time to fulfil that destiny and get the next teams set up”. What we have to lose in Perez's own words is 5-6 English Superleague clubs from Superleague to make way for the North Americans. This will devastate us.

On 28/02/2018 at 7:47 AM, Roryfellinghamwebb said:

Is that such a bad thing? Between £150 000 to £300 000 for academies to rarely produce more than 1 or 2 top end players every couple of years. Hardly a production line. Why not accept that whilst academies have their place, they are not the magic allotments of talent. More talent can be nurtured in other ways and the money better spent on other development strategies. 

As the message slowly sinks in a Transatlantic game will kill us here, the counter debate get's more extreme. Are you really telling us that the Academy system is a failure, and that we can close it down for "other development strategies"  The SL clubs nurture the schools and junior game and accommodate the best kids through academies to create the bulk of our playing rosters. We don't have enough kids or academies playing so we top up with imports. We cannot lose several academies to accommodate North American "clubs" who won't develop players for 15-20 years if ever and will get all their best picked off by professional American RU.

As the snow falls outside my window, I reflect on these posts above that are so devoid of any reality, that maybe just maybe the more considered posters are getting it that a Transatlantic league won't work.

Edited by The Parksider

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/22/2018 at 3:14 PM, Bullish Giant Rhino said:

I know we've heard a lot about New York recently. But Eric Perez said a year or so back that he wanted a second Canadian team in League 1 in 2019. Clearly the ongoing debate about the structure of the leagues won't help, but where is this new team?

I've seen no news whatsoever and after all, this North American dream is as much Eric Perez as it will ever be anybody's! 

  So where is the Scarlet Pimpernel/Pied Piper of Rugby League?

What is happening at his first club?

https://www.thesportsman.com/articles/a-testing-time-for-toronto-wolfpack


     No reserves,but resilience,persistence and determination are omnipotent.                       

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50 minutes ago, The Parksider said:

Here is a fact for Omott. Perez said recently "When we started this journey, we knew that one team is not enough to yield what you need to yield from the market.To bring revenues, to really start bringing new money into the sport you've got to have multi-markets. Now that Toronto is up and running It's time to fulfil that destiny and get the next teams set up”. What we have to lose in Perez's own words is 5-6 English Superleague clubs from Superleague to make way for the North Americans. This will devastate us.

The quote is the only ‘fact’, right?

You have revealed some insightful points, but this isn’t one of your best. 

It’s quite obvious Perez’s own words did not state any super league clubs need ‘to make way for the North Americans’. 

TWP started in 2017. It might be a stretch for them to make super league in 2019. Maybe 2020 if things fall into place. 5-6 NA teams will not quickly appear at SL level. So there is time for existing clubs to innovate and compete. But regardless of NA, rugby league faces a huge challenge. Support and player numbers are dropping (a challenge only faced by many sports beyond rugby league). Historic clubs are dying, and that started long before TWP. Compared to other global sports and entertainment options rugby league is not in a position of power. It’s barely a blip. 

That matters. It matters for today’s casual fan. It matters for tomorrow’s fan because, most importantly, it matters for tomorrow’s athlete. Athletes want exposure and opportunity. Fans want to watch the best athletes. 

Rugby League needs a shot in the arm. It needs something to inspire current and future athletes to lob on down to the local academy, whether in Salford, Cumbria or Toronto and make a career from it. 

North America seems to be that something at the moment. Toulouse, PNG Hunters, a possible Fiji team, Serbia, even London in the lower grades are all good examples of things happening in new and exciting directions. Tonga and Fiji at the World Cup. RLWC 2025 in the US. But they haven’t captured the imagination of players and fans like TWP or the NYC bid. The time spent on the approval of NA bids indicate the RFL are doing reasonable diligence. There will be challenges. There will be heartache. There will be success stories, some of which might even come from the heartlands. I’m all for this NA experiment. 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎27‎/‎02‎/‎2018 at 9:27 AM, TheReaper said:

Real good discussion of the second Canadian location here guys. NY real estate, immigration, player development and league structure... Those all really help decide between the hammer and MTL.

Well done everyone.

 

Where do you guys think a Hamilton team would play? THF and Mac seem the two best options.

Assuming Bob Young/Tiger-Cats involvement, you'd think they'd want THF to fill more dates at the stadium. However all the legal battles between the team, contractors, and levels of government might be an obstacle. It seems like it is for the proposed CPL team. And at 24k probably quite a bit larger than would be needed.

Ron Joyce Stadium at McMAster seats about 6k, all on one side, which would be plenty to start I would think. The MLL Hamilton Nationals played there, as well as the Cats temporarily, so the school is open to renting to pro teams. The permanent football lines could be an issue, and was new in 2016 so won't be replaced for a while.

 

Montreal has similar options, Saputo at 20k large again but has real grass. CEPSUM at U de M about 5k and turf. Not sure where else might be on the radar, assuming they wouldn't go even bigger and use Molson at McGill. Maybe any posters more familiar with the city can comment.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lot of reaction to a one "man" scare campaign here.

"If we allow North American clubs in the world will disappear and they eat babies!"

The only thing left is ....... they don't wash their hands after going to the toilet!

We have to have concerns about the implications of any change in our game but this is like panic buying at the local supermarket because it might snow in 2021.


“I would!”     

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't get the argument that teams from outside of the heartland will devastate UK RL. We don't even know how many sides will be playing in SL next year. The number of teams should grow as newbies come on board. And yes, there are enough players for more teams. 

  • Like 1

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, RayCee said:

I don't get the argument that teams from outside of the heartland will devastate UK RL.

What is it they say "Paranoia mind destroya?"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks like we have dodged a real bullet with NYC.

It appears that rugby union are going in there (MLR) run by an Irish conglomerate and tapping into the union club scene there.  

I strongly suspect that union (MLR) will come into Toronto very soon (2 or 3 years) so the WolfPack really needs to work hard to bed in and become 'established' on the sporting scene.

Taking on union in these limited 'rugby' markets would be suicide IMO, so fair dos in going for MTL.


Rugby League: Alive and Handling

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 27/02/2018 at 4:33 PM, Krzzystuff said:

a bit of info on what TWP are planning for player development, more details to come.

https://www.torontowolfpack.com/2018/02/27/toronto-wolfpack-expand-partnership-manchester-metropolitan-university/

“We have a responsibility to use our status as the first professional rugby club in North America to grow the game wherever possible. The relationship with Manchester Metropolitan University will allow us to show talented high school and University athletes in Canada a clear route into the professional game.”

Further details around the Wolfpack’s development pathway will be released over the coming months, including separate plans for ages 6-11, 11-16 and 16-18 year olds. These will be mirrored in Canada and the UK with Wolfpack 1st team players taking an active role in coaching across the pathway on both sides of the Atlantic.

“In Canada we need to ensure we are working with all ages and abilities to grow our game. Our key focus this summer in Toronto will be on inspiring children to enjoy the benefits of rugby participation and encouraging more adults into the game” Lidbury concluded.

 

You're running before you can walk again. The pathway to the professional game doesn't exist yet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Celt said:

Looks like we have dodged a real bullet with NYC.

It appears that rugby union are going in there (MLR) run by an Irish conglomerate and tapping into the union club scene there.  

I strongly suspect that union (MLR) will come into Toronto very soon (2 or 3 years) so the WolfPack really needs to work hard to bed in and become 'established' on the sporting scene.

Taking on union in these limited 'rugby' markets would be suicide IMO, so fair dos in going for MTL.

What do you mean we've dodged a bullet ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, jpmc said:

What do you mean we've dodged a bullet ?

Yawn are doing this! kick and clap are moving in! what time does the rugby start are in the process of .........

'Fraidy cat stuff from the people who brought you the yawnion Gruffalo! and I wouldn't ever start from here!

Be afraid, be very afraid!

 

self-destruction-imminent-please-evacuate-facility-sign-animated-gif.gif.97aa57822db8f07bdb965df2eaa29a45.gif5a991294b627d_giphy34.gif.240b09cfbf9202a8c2b3b81714c0d967.gif


“I would!”     

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 01/03/2018 at 8:57 AM, The Parksider said:

As the message slowly sinks in a Transatlantic game will kill us here, the counter debate get's more extreme. Are you really telling us that the Academy system is a failure, and that we can close it down for "other development strategies"  The SL clubs nurture the schools and junior game and accommodate the best kids through academies to create the bulk of our playing rosters. We don't have enough kids or academies playing so we top up with imports. We cannot lose several academies to accommodate North American "clubs" who won't develop players for 15-20 years if ever and will get all their best picked off by professional American RU.

As per my post, I am saying that academies have their place but do not produce player after player. They also let players down on the educational side. Is a £300k academy worth it? I'm saying no. Do they nurture schools and the junior game? You obviously have no experience of junior rugby, no, they take whichever players they feel like with minimal 'development days'. 

Should each club have them? At this moment in time, the regional academies are adequate. 

10 hours ago, SL17 said:

You're running before you can walk again. The pathway to the professional game doesn't exist yet.

Not sure how the pathway doesn't exist here SL17? It's already been released...school - university - reserves - 1st team. Same for both sides of the Atlantic with Manchester Metropolitan and Toronto Universities having exchange programs for Canadian students. It seems they are choosing this route as this is the generally accepted North American development route and which, in light of what I've posted above, I think is a great way to go. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, jpmc said:

What do you mean we've dodged a bullet ?

Well my understanding (i have not read every post on the thread) was that New York was a potential venue, but is no longer being considered?

As such, I thought this is positive, as putting a 'pro' Rugby League team in there running out against Gloucester Students, Hemel Hempstead and South Wales etc would lose out in a head to head with a professional rugby union franchise.  The 'rugby' community in New York will (I think) jump in to support the new union team and their backers appear to be very knowledgable indeed, and focussed on getting good people on board.

So... my real fear was that RL would not gain a foothold in NY, and the team would die quickly.

Edited by Celt
  • Like 1

Rugby League: Alive and Handling

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...