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I think we need a good dose of rain.  I believe we are due rain for most of this week.  I think we need it.  People won't be as tempted to go out if it rains.  They may go mad in their houses but they won't be tempted to have BBQs or travel to the beach or whatever.  That may help with the lockdown as clearly it's fraying at the edges.

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Well... after 66 days in ICU my sister's fella who was described as being as near to death as can be without dying.... has made it. He's home. Half the fella he was.... and the virus has ravaged his l

I'm not putting up with this goading of a volunteer moderator who does a sterling job on my behalf generally on here, but especially recently when I was ill for almost a month with what might well hav

Well my sister's fella is making very small steps in the right direction. From being described as as near to death without being dead, he's now sat up, off dialysis and yesterday was breathing on

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8 hours ago, DoubleD said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/04/24/government-tells-uk-businesses-time-get-back-work/amp/
 

Further evidence of the narrative changing. June recommencement is looking increasingly likely 

Don't get too excited...

However, a return to action still depends on the government's five tests being met, especially an increase in testing, and meeting social distancing guidelines.

The meetings are viewed as preparatory, and intended to avoid a further delay to seasons being resumed once approval is granted, rather than a sign that it was imminent. Indeed, there is an acceptance that the plans being put in place may not end up being implemented for months if progress elsewhere is not made.

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8 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

Sweden is an example of a country that has implemented social distancing and has generally followed the rules.

Flattening the curve for them was possible that way. 

Yeah they've been so successful that they've only had 2.5 times as many deaths as the combined total of all the other Scandinavian countries with a death rate per capita between 3 and 7 times that of their neighbours. 

Edited by Les Tonks Sidestep
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16 minutes ago, Les Tonks Sidestep said:

Yeah they've been so successful that they've only had 2.5 times as many deaths as the combined total of all the other Scandinavian countries with a death rate per capita between 3 and 7 times that of their neighbours. 

Thats the implications of social distancing without a lockdown. I never actually said successful, I suggested it as an example of how a country following rules without armed intervention (like there is in Spain and Italy) vs a country with a population not following those rules. 

It seems their healthcare system has been able to cope. Until there is a vaccine deaths are an inevitable reality sadly. Flattening the curve is just jargon for spreading out the number of people in hospital at any one time. Their statistics also crucially include those dying in elderly homes and account for 50% of their death rate - something which not all countries including our own . It appears the migrant community, of which Sweden's is double that of Norway's for example, is disproportionately affected - as it is in most places in the world.

They've also not had anything like as much of the associated costs of shutting down their economy, as the USA with huge unemployment and Britain with Government furlough have found for example. They think they can carry on with social distancing as the primary method to deal with the virus because they think their population will adhere to it.

My original point was that the exit from this will depend on how much it is believed our population will adhere to any new rules as lockdown is inevitably loosened. In Sweden they've planned for the reality that the rest of the world faces that we will have to come out of lockdown at some point and changed their lives to fit that reality. Norway and Germany after a period of lockdown are now following suit.

The aim is to limit the reproduction of the virus to less than 1. 

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13 hours ago, gazza77 said:

I've seen about 10 motorbikes through our village today, which is more than on a usual Saturday afternoon. I'd expect at least some are keeping off the main roads to keep below the radar. Obviously I can't comment on where they were all going, or if the journey was essential, however if suspect in the case of the two I saw with pillions(one of which was a child), it's likely a leisure trip. Likewise the the group of four together. 

It's doubly infuriating for me. Other than the obvious ignoring of guidelines, for me it's rubbing my face in it, given I'm itching to go out on my own bike, but won't until restrictions are lifted. 

A few bikes round here but not many. 

1. Lincs Blood Bikes (1 mate rides for them,  another is coodinator)

2. Various schemes for prescription deliveries etc to vulnerable and housebound people (2 mates)

3. Travel to and from work - lots of people still at work - legitimate shops, hospital laundries,  etc

 

Four legs good - two legs bad

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9 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

Thats the implications of social distancing without a lockdown. I never actually said successful, I suggested it as an example of how a country following rules without armed intervention (like there is in Spain and Italy) vs a country with a population not following those rules. 

I know you get this but it's surprising how many people don't: there are enforced restrictions in Sweden. There are a lot of loopholes and the enforcement isn't Guardia Civil level but there's still a fair bit.

As far as I know there's also no sport going on at all.

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Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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This is an interesting perspective on what's happening in Germany now some shops have been allowed to reopen: https://www.ft.com/content/10e9b3fd-8e36-4cae-b1c0-b08fcc4a3c11

TL:DR - no one is shopping.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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14 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

No , ban the lot 

Harsh maybe, ? but as a non bike enthusiast I wasn't sure if there were different rules.

But once again I am surprised that people are surprised about people being outside. There has been a minor uplift in motor vehicle use according to the stats, which will obviously be more marked in som areas, but travel is still massively down on normal levels. 

As the weather is nicer it is no surprise that some people may use their bikes. 

People need to not get so angry about people social distancing. 

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17 minutes ago, JohnM said:

A few bikes round here but not many. 

1. Lincs Blood Bikes (1 mate rides for them,  another is coodinator)

2. Various schemes for prescription deliveries etc to vulnerable and housebound people (2 mates)

3. Travel to and from work - lots of people still at work - legitimate shops, hospital laundries,  etc

 

Indeed. Plenty of legitimate reasons to ride your bike. 

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2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Harsh maybe, ? but as a non bike enthusiast I wasn't sure if there were different rules.

But once again I am surprised that people are surprised about people being outside. There has been a minor uplift in motor vehicle use according to the stats, which will obviously be more marked in som areas, but travel is still massively down on normal levels. 

As the weather is nicer it is no surprise that some people may use their bikes. 

People need to not get so angry about people social distancing. 

I get the feeling that If it goes #### up people like me will get the brunt of the blame for it. I’m going to work and keeping to social distancing rules as I should be. Yet every day listening to the radio you get mixed messages as if half the country don’t know what the rules are. Every traffic report starts with no major issues as you’d expect with only key workers on the road. Well no it’s not only key workers it’s any worker that can keep to social distancing but absolutely can’t work from home. 

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19 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

I get the feeling that If it goes #### up people like me will get the brunt of the blame for it. I’m going to work and keeping to social distancing rules as I should be. Yet every day listening to the radio you get mixed messages as if half the country don’t know what the rules are. Every traffic report starts with no major issues as you’d expect with only key workers on the road. Well no it’s not only key workers it’s any worker that can keep to social distancing but absolutely can’t work from home. 

Quite so. I do, though, believe most people do know the rules. The rules are clear. It's the media that is raising peoples expectations of an easing of lockdown thus creating uncertainty. 

I've watched Sky Sophy Ridge and BBC Breakfast this morning totally misrepresent the situation, as did Rachel Burden on BBC. The lockdown in France, Spain, Italy is more severe and more rigorously enforced than here, so any easing there starts from a stricter regime. In Spain, for example, kids under 14 have been confined to their homes. 

We are at a critical point in this outbreak and any easing could be disastrous and it is the duty of the media to reflect this. Yes. ask challenging questions but at the same time realise your responsibilities to the truth. 

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Four legs good - two legs bad

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54 minutes ago, Omott91 said:

A few hours ago in Western Australia they eased the first restrictions, allowing a number of people up to 10 to gather again.  

From what I can gather they've had hardly any restrictions already, I’m quite shocked Australias figures are so low to be honest!

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47 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

From what I can gather they've had hardly any restrictions already, I’m quite shocked Australias figures are so low to be honest!

In one sense it isn't surprising really as Australia is a big empty island thousands of miles from anyone and so in that sense they have an easier time of it when compared to more densely inhabited and travelled areas of the world, like Europe.  However, they escaped the early waves of the Spanish Flu and then were hit with the third wave (I think) in 1919.  So just because they are having a relatively easy time of it at the moment doesn't mean they will escape untouched.  I hope they do, for the sake of their people, but it is a bit early to say they've got away with it (not that you were saying that!).  

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3 hours ago, JohnM said:

Quite so. I do, though, believe most people do know the rules. The rules are clear. It's the media that is raising peoples expectations of an easing of lockdown thus creating uncertainty. 

I've watched Sky Sophy Ridge and BBC Breakfast this morning totally misrepresent the situation, as did Rachel Burden on BBC. The lockdown in France, Spain, Italy is more severe and more rigorously enforced than here, so any easing there starts from a stricter regime. In Spain, for example, kids under 14 have been confined to their homes. 

We are at a critical point in this outbreak and any easing could be disastrous and it is the duty of the media to reflect this. Yes. ask challenging questions but at the same time realise your responsibilities to the truth. 

I think the media as a whole has been dire throughout this experience so far.  No explanation of the fact - an actual fact - that other countries in Europe were hit earlier than us and so obviously their lockdowns are going to be lifted sooner than ours.

Apparently now we weren't quick enough to lock down.  Yet apparently also everyone wants to leave lockdown.  So which was it?  We were too late or we have been locked down too long?  Imagine trying to get everyone to stay indoors even longer than we have done already.  And the media would have been contrary and irresponsible at both ends too, as they have been anyway.

And of course we were a police state only a couple of weeks ago because PC Plod was trying to enforce the lock down.  Then they were basically told not to bother and now people are doing as they please.

Must be a nightmare governing this country.  

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14 minutes ago, Saintslass said:

 

Apparently now we weren't quick enough to lock down.  Yet apparently also everyone wants to leave lockdown.  So which was it?  We were too late or we have been locked down too long?   

They are two independent things. 

And who wants to leave? Like genuinely, you should provide evidence of that claim. 

Wanting to know what the options for how to exit lockdown is not the same as thinking lockdown should end now. Not in the slightest. 

Obviously the idiots like Alison Pearson and Katie Hopkins are pushing for end to restrictions, but that isn't everybody. 

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1 minute ago, Dave T said:

They are two independent things. 

And who wants to leave? Like genuinely, you should provide evidence of that claim. 

Wanting to know what the options for how to exit lockdown is not the same as thinking lockdown should end now. Not in the slightest. 

Obviously the idiots like Alison Pearson and Katie Hopkins are pushing for end to restrictions, but that isn't everybody. 

To be fair to Saintslass, the media are reporting that there mass of people wanting to ease the restrictions. You cannot blame people for accepting much of what they read.

"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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2 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

To be fair to Saintslass, the media are reporting that there mass of people wanting to ease the restrictions. You cannot blame people for accepting much of what they read.

I'm not accepting anything the media is saying so stop projecting.  I was simply repeating what the media has been saying.  They have been irresponsible (and often blatantly stupid) from early on.

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7 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

To be fair to Saintslass, the media are reporting that there mass of people wanting to ease the restrictions. You cannot blame people for accepting much of what they read.

Where is that Bob? 

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8 minutes ago, Dave T said:

They are two independent things. 

And who wants to leave? Like genuinely, you should provide evidence of that claim. 

Wanting to know what the options for how to exit lockdown is not the same as thinking lockdown should end now. Not in the slightest. 

Obviously the idiots like Alison Pearson and Katie Hopkins are pushing for end to restrictions, but that isn't everybody. 

You see the word 'apparently'?  It refers to the media.  I wasn't claiming anyone wants to leave.  I was claiming 'apparently' everyone wants to leave, because that is what the stupid media is now saying.

You are being deliberately obtuse to create an argument where it does not exist.

Oh, and how is your last sentence NOT political by the way?

Where is gingerjon?

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