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Fear Of Relegation


RayCee
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That old chestnut again, p/r vs licensing.

Interestingly, Tony Smith said having no relegation last year (when KR looked the poorest team in SL) gave the club the springboard to mount this year's successful campaign. 

He said ""(Having no relegation) allows players to play with more freedom, make some more mistakes, not be so conservative...I think sports teams can often be over-coached and try not to lose, rather than go out there and win". He seems to put that down to a fear of being relegated. 

https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-league/58723963

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My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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1 minute ago, Robin Evans said:

Please.... I beseech you..... not another thread on this....

Lord take me now!

You could have spared yourself the anguish by reading the title and resisting the urge. 

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My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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31 minutes ago, RayCee said:

That old chestnut again, p/r vs licensing.

Interestingly, Tony Smith said having no relegation last year (when KR looked the poorest team in SL) gave the club the springboard to mount this year's successful campaign. 

He said ""(Having no relegation) allows players to play with more freedom, make some more mistakes, not be so conservative...I think sports teams can often be over-coached and try not to lose, rather than go out there and win". He seems to put that down to a fear of being relegated. 

https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-league/58723963

Is it the Tony Smith anti PR spiel time of the year already?

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20 minutes ago, Les Tonks Sidestep said:

Is it the Tony Smith anti PR spiel time of the year already?

Tbf the article isn't aimed at that but his opinion did come out on the subject. I think what he says has merit but it comes down to wanting the jeopardy vs clubs building without that fear. 

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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21 minutes ago, The Blues Ox said:

So with no fear of relegation what is Salford, Wakefield, and Huddersfield's excuse this season for been so poor?

Well as the article at the BBC said:

It didn't work last year. But the quality of player they've got this year has matched the ambition.

Building on something has to have some quality to go with it. Also coaching has a role. Plus the fact in any competition, someone has to be in the lower end of the table. I mean. do you expect every side to finish in the top half of the table? 

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My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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I sympathise with this view but arguably Hull KR’s relegation did them a favour in the long run. They are a much more progressive club on & off the field, and that hasn’t happened by accident.

Would KR be in the semi-finals now had it not been for relegation & rebuild? Not sure. Interesting one to ponder. 

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18 minutes ago, Gooleboy said:

Fair enough, but he spoke up when Huddersfield were certs for promotion!

And When Hudds should have been relegated, they took Sheffield with them and went down the pan again when relegated in 2001 with a massive Parachute payment !

The angel of the lord has shone on Huddersfield and Tony Smith in the past 20 years !

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9 hours ago, RayCee said:

 

Plus the fact in any competition, someone has to be in the lower end of the table. 

So an argument could be made if its the same teams finishing near the bottom of the table a lot, it might be better to give someone else a go rather than letting them continually letting them waste their funding with little or no progress?

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1 hour ago, The Blues Ox said:

So an argument could be made if its the same teams finishing near the bottom of the table a lot, it might be better to give someone else a go rather than letting them continually letting them waste their funding with little or no progress?

That could be achieved through licensing. 

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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12 hours ago, Chris22 said:

Interestingly enough, he did complain about it then! He has been very consistent in his thoughts on it to be fair.

BBC SPORT | Rugby League | Smith against promotion format

 

14 hours ago, Gooleboy said:

I can't remember him complaining about P&R when he got Huddersfield promoted.

This is the thing with some RL fan - they think everybody is interested in only themselves and an't possibly believe in something because they think it is right for the game. Gooleboy and the 4 posters who liked the post were factually wrong and demonstrate this assumption perfectly well.

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Smith has always held the same view on P&R. Possibly the most consistent voice on it within the game. Unlike some of the more vocal proponents of P&R, who start threatening legal action when it isn't playing out in their favour.

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I can confirm 30+ less sales for Scotland vs Italy at Workington, after this afternoons test purchase for the Tonga match, £7.50 is extremely reasonable, however a £2.50 'delivery' fee for a walk in purchase is beyond taking the mickey, good luck with that, it's cheaper on the telly.

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You could do this now but with a 16 team SL and let the 4 newcomers build in quality. It must be done on factual markers and I would propose regional academies centrally funded rewarding the amateur clubs when a player signs a SL deal.

stadium, Financial situation, average comparable gates, potential gates, 10 year result stats could be used to decide the 16 but I would also welcome a bond returnable in leaving for all applicants, if 16 clubs left £3m as a bond that should comfortably generate £5m pa to market the sport with any decent broker

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13 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

So with no fear of relegation what is Salford, Wakefield, and Huddersfield's excuse this season for been so poor?

They aren't "poor" Wakefield and Huddersfield  have won a number of games this season

Do you think Featherstone or Halifax would have done better than Salford??

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17 hours ago, RayCee said:

That old chestnut again, p/r vs licensing.

Interestingly, Tony Smith said having no relegation last year (when KR looked the poorest team in SL) gave the club the springboard to mount this year's successful campaign. 

He said ""(Having no relegation) allows players to play with more freedom, make some more mistakes, not be so conservative...I think sports teams can often be over-coached and try not to lose, rather than go out there and win". He seems to put that down to a fear of being relegated. 

https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-league/58723963

No relegation means a lot of dead rubbers towards the end of the season, but it gives the chance to development talent

Relegation means there is interest in both the top and the bottom of the league table, but less chance to develop young players

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23 minutes ago, The Future is League said:

No relegation means a lot of dead rubbers towards the end of the season, but it gives the chance to development talent

Relegation means there is interest in both the top and the bottom of the league table, but less chance to develop young players

How much interest does a relegation battle really generate though? 

I remember one year in which, by quirk of the fixture list, Wakefield and Castleford played in a 'survival Saturday' fixture, but beyond that, it doesn't really seem to capture the imagination of the public. I think the only MPG to sell-out was a promotion game in Toronto and it's not as if there is much evidence that the threat of relegation sustains attendances for clubs at the bottom end of the table. 

Edited by whatmichaelsays
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42 minutes ago, whatmichaelsays said:

How much interest does a relegation battle really generate though? 

I remember one year in which, by quirk of the fixture list, Wakefield and Castleford played in a 'survival Saturday' fixture, but beyond that, it doesn't really seem to capture the imagination of the public. I think the only MPG to sell-out was a promotion game in Toronto and it's not as if there is much evidence that the threat of relegation sustains attendances for clubs at the bottom end of the table. 

It has much interest for the broadcasters though.

Hkr v Salford had everything. 

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36 minutes ago, Robin Evans said:

It has much interest for the broadcasters though.

Hkr v Salford had everything. 

That was a one off playoff game, how much interest does a traditional relegation race generate throughout the season though? I personally have no desire as a neutral to watch bad teams (generally they dont have an entertaining style of play) through the course of a season. Relegation races only become interesting on the last day for me.

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