Anti-Dual Reg Fans, get ready to get angry

[Jughead]

18 minutes ago, Gav Wilson said:

5 is the limit.

They have a squad of 21 (two on loan). Green is injured, and McDonnell & Dixon are banned.

They're struggling to raise a team by round 4, that's not a great look for one of the supposed best teams in the comp.

It’s not but that’s their fault that they only have a 21 man squad, not the fault of DR. 

[Simon Hall]

30 minutes ago, Jughead said:

It’s not but that’s their fault that they only have a 21 man squad, not the fault of DR. 

They'd have a bigger squad if they weren't able to make use of DR though, so it is the fault of DR really.

[David Shepherd]

7 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

Championship clubs and fans should be thankful for the Super League players they are able to play. Although I don’t think dual registration should be allowed in the play offs or Grand Final. 

As I'm sure Leeds are grateful to Fev for helping them pad out their reserves team.

[DEANO]

4 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

It’s not, Dewsbury have the option to play him, nobody is forcing them, it’s their decision.

Lol

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

9 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

As I'm sure Leeds are grateful to Fev for helping them pad out their reserves team.

Absolutely, big thanks to Featherstone Rhinos 

[Jughead]

45 minutes ago, Simon Hall said:

They'd have a bigger squad if they weren't able to make use of DR though, so it is the fault of DR really.

No one has forced them into the use of DR and they had a £400k parachute payment a few months ago. Maybe if they hadn’t spent copious amounts on getting an anti-vax NRL player in, twenty-one could be twenty-two or twenty-three. 

It’s the fault of Leigh’s nobody else’s that they have a twenty-one man squad. 

[Gav Wilson]

Just now, Jughead said:

No one has forced them into the use of DR and they had a £400k parachute payment a few months ago. Maybe if they hadn’t spent copious amounts on getting an anti-vax NRL player in, twenty-one could be twenty-two or twenty-three. 

It’s the fault of Leigh’s nobody else’s that they have a twenty-one man squad. 

Yeah, they did all that because they had the easy option of DR with the current reigning triple SL champions to fall back on. How are you not understanding this?

[Jughead]

3 minutes ago, Gav Wilson said:

Yeah, they did all that because they had the easy option of DR with the current reigning triple SL champions to fall back on. How are you not understanding this?

And the current reigning triple SL champions are under no obligation to provide any players to Leigh, if they decide so it’s entirely Leigh’s fault for planning for an eventuality they have zero control of. That said, it’s completely plausible that Beaumont’s planned for this, he planned for promotion straight back to Super League and nearly liquidated the club. 

[Gav Wilson]

Just now, Jughead said:

And the current reigning triple SL champions are under no obligation to provide any players to Leigh, if they decide so it’s entirely Leigh’s fault for planning for an eventuality they have zero control of. That said, it’s completely plausible that Beaumont’s planned for this, he planned for promotion straight back to Super League and nearly liquidated the club. 

Well this is true and is actually a good point - if it comes down to it next week, as a York fan I'm hoping Saints send Leigh 5 lads who absolutely don't want to be there... a la Jamie Shaul in 2013! 

[RP London]

3 hours ago, fighting irish said:

 

 

I'm not a fan of dual registration, (not in this form anyway) but if you've got to allow it, then we should organise it on a draft basis, with players released to the draft and the lowest team in the league having first pick (and so on).

This reduces the possibility of a top team, like Featherstone ''loading up'' with Super League players, (just because they have a cosy relationship with Leeds) towards the seasons end.

It will more likely raise standards right across (and level out) the competition, for the benefit of everyone, including spectators making for more keenly contested matches from top to bottom. 

Quite like this idea.. not sure how easy it would be but could be interesting, once they are with one club they are with them for the season too? Or a pot every week?

[fighting irish]

14 minutes ago, RP London said:

Quite like this idea.. not sure how easy it would be but could be interesting, once they are with one club they are with them for the season too? Or a pot every week?

Thank you for your response. I've not given it a great deal of detailed thought, but i like it because, i believe its a ''whole game'' approach, rather than the usual dog eat dog, divisive methods we usually employ/encourage.

I can see obvious advantages of two clubs like Leeds and Featherstone cooperating/collaborating in the DR system but feel that this limited engagement has the potential to skew the competition unfairly and tends to be divisive.

Other clubs, without the benefit of this kind of cosy relationship would surely come to resent those that do. I don't believe seething resentment and accusations of unfairness or favouritism engender cooperation in other matters, thereby reinforcing the tendency to put club first before the game as a whole.

I think it would be far better if that (player sharing) kind of cooperation existed across the entire league (hence the draft proposal) thereby improving relationships from top to bottom and east to west. Knowing you're not getting shafted week in week out, will no doubt make the poorer clubs more willing to set aside short term selfish needs/desires for the long term good of the game. 

To answer your specific point, i think the draft could be drawn up anew every week (by Tuesday say) with available players and the ''picks'' made say, by Thursday.  We'd have to factor in a players right to refuse (which is not an insignificant issue) but i still think the idea has merit. 

[Robin Evans]

It does make me chuckle that more fev players have gone to Leeds rather than t'other way round.

Dual reg my fat wobbly old ginger botty

[Jughead]

If you’re Leeds, why would you want your play going to bottom of the league when Leeds have had a relationship with Featherstone for the past however many years that seemingly works for all parties? How do you justify that? Why only the Championship? Wouldn’t West Wales gain more from having youngsters from St Helens and Wigan than a Championship side? Why do we neglect League One sides in this?

I think a draft is unnecessary Americanisation for the sake of it and not really a solution to any of this. 

[paulwalker71]

5 hours ago, Simon Hall said:

They aren't though.

Who isn't?

[Simon Hall]

10 minutes ago, paulwalker71 said:

Who isn't?

I’m not sure on everyone else, but I know York aren’t doing DR this year. 

[Angelic Cynic]

York City Knights were dual registered with Hull KR in 2018 to assist them to win promotion to The Championship.

It seems,no surprise,that the system was introduced at the behest of Super League clubs.

Wigan,who don't want any money going outside Super League, initially linked with South Wales.

https://www.therhinos.co.uk/2013/02/10/rfl-clarifies-dual-registration-timelines/

If it suits Super League clubs,and one or two others,the system will remain.

[Marauder]

12 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

Championship clubs and fans should be thankful for the Super League players they are able to play. Although I don’t think dual registration should be allowed in the play offs or Grand Final. 

The players being sent out by super league clubs on dual reg wouldn't be super league players if dual reg was stopped tomorrow, simply because the super league clubs wouldn't have the finances to retain the players;

[Marauder]

3 hours ago, Jughead said:

If you’re Leeds, why would you want your play going to bottom of the league when Leeds have had a relationship with Featherstone for the past however many years that seemingly works for all parties? How do you justify that? Why only the Championship? Wouldn’t West Wales gain more from having youngsters from St Helens and Wigan than a Championship side? Why do we neglect League One sides in this?

I think a draft is unnecessary Americanisation for the sake of it and not really a solution to any of this. 

How would the draft work

[Jughead]

3 minutes ago, Marauder said:

How would the draft work

No idea, it’s not my idea, but I can’t really see much point in it. 

[fighting irish]

1 hour ago, Marauder said:

How would the draft work

There's a brief outline explanation in a post of mine, a little earlier on.

The point is to try to get the game to act in unison and develop a 'whole game' solution to the problem of Super League having too many players and eliminate the feeling that DR is an unfair system/solution, which tends to favour certain (the better) championship clubs and increase the Pareto (principle) effect in the championship.

Furthermore, the resentment such favour engenders tends to divide the clubs rather than breed a spirit of cooperation right across the pro game.

I'd be eager to hear your thoughts on the idea?

[fighting irish]

4 hours ago, Jughead said:

If you’re Leeds, why would you want your play going to bottom of the league when Leeds have had a relationship with Featherstone for the past however many years that seemingly works for all parties? How do you justify that? Why only the Championship? Wouldn’t West Wales gain more from having youngsters from St Helens and Wigan than a Championship side? Why do we neglect League One sides in this?

I think a draft is unnecessary Americanisation for the sake of it and not really a solution to any of this. 

Thank you for commenting on the idea.

It's rooted (the idea) in the principle of delayed gratification, that putting up with a little inconvenience in the short term, might yield greater benefits, in the long term.

The players might not relish going to Barrow rather than Featherstone (at first) but in the long run, the idea will show the clubs that even  though we vie for the trophies each season, from an existential point of view, we're all in this together.

We are competitors superficially but we should remember that we are utterly dependent on each others continued existence (and strength) in order to support our own.

It has nothing to do with America, my (new) friend. 

[Robthegasman]

Surely it should be compulsory for Super League clubs to have a full and proper reserve grade.In fact I think it should be a part of being a Super League club to have a reserve team for the young up and coming players to have a pathway and for returning injured players to get back to match fitness.

As for Dual Registration I am not entirely convinced it is the right thing. I feel that it can sometimes be detrimental to Championship club players.Now to me I think it might be better if Super League clubs were to loan out some of their players to give them the feel of regular first team rugby league.

[paulwalker71]

3 hours ago, Simon Hall said:

I’m not sure on everyone else, but I know York aren’t doing DR this year. 

Fair enough

I mean obviously not everyone can - there are only 10 English clubs in SL and 14 clubs in the Champ so there aren't enough to round anyway

York have been with Hull KR in the past, if I remember right but if you're going solo this year, good luck to you.

[fighting irish]

9 minutes ago, paulwalker71 said:

Fair enough

I mean obviously not everyone can - there are only 10 English clubs in SL and 14 clubs in the Champ so there aren't enough to round anyway

York have been with Hull KR in the past, if I remember right but if you're going solo this year, good luck to you.

With a draft system Paul, they could all benefit because the lower placed clubs get first pick from the draft and players from each Super League club, would end up in different clubs. Spreading the ''benefits'' of the short term player loans, right across the championship.

[Marauder]

2 hours ago, fighting irish said:

There's a brief outline explanation in a post of mine, a little earlier on.

The point is to try to get the game to act in unison and develop a 'whole game' solution to the problem of Super League having too many players and eliminate the feeling that DR is an unfair system/solution, which tends to favour certain (the better) championship clubs and increase the Pareto (principle) effect in the championship.

Furthermore, the resentment such favour engenders tends to divide the clubs rather than breed a spirit of cooperation right across the pro game.

I'd be eager to hear your thoughts on the idea?

Cooperation doesn't go with greed and fear, I'm wondering how on limited funding a club would develop a youngster to have him snatched away in a draft situation, my first thoughts why bother to invest time and money for some other club to reap what you've sown.