What are IMG's strategy for RL in Wales?

[Pie tries]

10 hours ago, Madrileño said:

Not very popular at all.

Despite what Pie Tries posts about some sort of fraternity of "working class cousins"  your average Welsh person couldn't care less about Rugby League.

There is no evidence whatsoever that the current generation of young people in Wales have any serious interest in rugby league - yet Pie Tries insists that they "love it" despite having zero examples of how they show this love.  

You’re being deliberately  obtuse. You can’t prove wales don’t like RL.

without trotting out plotted history of wales and RL - it has a proud tradition in RL. Black welshmen, plus the rest coming north has all engineered interest. Go ask Jiffy if he ‘loves’ RL - he does !!
Games in wales have been well attended over the years. Thousands came up for the WC semi final - agree football taking over (as it is most places). U16s given it a good go, very well supported - no problem recruiting players. Schools will Uni fly give it a go, the game played strongly in the Unis.

There isn’t the institutional bias that exist in England, less of a public school ‘keep them in their place mentality’. 
 

The Welsh simply not had opportunity to play TGG in sufficient numbers. It’s my opinion a team in Cardiff with the right roots would success, no easy fix just hard work. 
 

simply saying ‘they don’t’ is ludicrous 

[steve oates]

16 minutes ago, Pie tries said:

Get more and more Welsh lads playing the game, 

Massive numbers of "Lads" have stopped playing soccer, RU and RL. 

The reality is "more and more" lads have abandoned all three codes of "football"

I guess the OP who started this thread then ran away is just playing his normal silly games....... 

[steve oates]

On 25/10/2022 at 11:14, The Daddy said:

I noted in IMG's proposals that London and France were targeted as strategic areas of development. 

Was Wales mentioned in the proposals? Wales has huge potential still, they just need one backer similar to a Derek Beaumont to drive the sport forward there. 

You laid the bate and ran away as usual. Happy with yourself now??

[Sports Prophet]

5 minutes ago, steve oates said:

So you would kick down the ladder our Northern clubs with a long history of survival, and who have helped to make RL a game rich northern owners and northern people will fund, play and watch in decent numbers, with enthusiasm, for some sort of dream? 

With a plan like this very quickly REAL Northern backers and real RL fans will walk away from the game. The problem with so called expansionists they can easily dream up new clubs, but can't comprehend the massive damage fast tracking them would do over the heads of Clubs that actually work and do the business......

The fact of the matter is, the professional sports industry has outgrown so many of these clubs. Sport is littered across all codes with examples of professional clubs not keeping up with the rest and falling.

You use the term “decent numbers” when referring to the clubs. I’m sorry, in this day and age top tier professional sports, some of the SL crowd figures are damn pitiful. So please don’t cast all clubs with the “decent numbers” pitch.

Now in a brave new world, one that aims for successful big city clubs in locations that have a realistic chance of success due to population, financial footprint and profile, there may be a few casualties. Maybe not. Maybe the existing clubs can all exist with the addition of two new clubs. I have certainly advocated for a 14 team SL. But by setting a target of 2 new big city British club for the 2026 season, it gives IMG and the RFL suitable time to find financial backing for two new franchises and also allows some of the existing “Real Northern” clubs to drastically improve their delivery of RL both on and off the pitch to give themselves a chance of a seat at the table of a new era.

[JonM]

50 minutes ago, Pie tries said:

It’s my opinion a team in Cardiff with the right roots would success, no easy fix just hard work. 

If I had to pick a town or city in the UK to put a professional rugby league club into, Cardiff would be literally the last place on the list. When I lived there, I could watch an international (soccer or rugby union) a dozen or more times a year. Nearly 20 000 people watch Cardiff City every week in the championship. The rugby union team has been up to 15000 average crowd (now down to 7 or 8000 I think). There's county cricket in summer, plus the Welsh Fire Hundred teams. Cardiff Devils is one of the best supported ice hockey teams in the country. It's probably the most crowded sports marketplace in the country - and it's not a particularly large or wealthy place either.

South Wales is one of the few places in the UK where "rugby" conceivably has first pick of sporty kids - alongside places like Wigan/ Leigh, Castleford/Wakefield and maybe some of Gloucestershire and Cornwall. There's plenty of scope for junior clubs, academies, picking up the people who didn't quite make it in union and offering them an alternative pathway. And there's plenty of scope (as there is everywhere else in the UK) to grow participation via women/girls, wheelchair, touch/tag, beach tournaments and so on.

None of those things is where I'd expect IMG to be involved - they should be focusing on revenue - media rights, sponsorships, bums on seats.

Edited October 26, 2022 by JonM

[Gerrumonside ref]

Shouldn’t we be helping North Wales Crusaders?

Perhaps asking them what they think?

 

[Madrileño]

1 hour ago, Pie tries said:

You’re being deliberately  obtuse. You can’t prove wales don’t like RL.

That's the difference.

I did provide proof. You did not.

You have now provided an example of 1 guy.... "Jiffy loves it" Oh well then, the whole country clearly loves it if 1 guy who used to play rugby league does....

As I pointed out already, only a few hundred of them turn up for games when their national team plays. 

They have 2 semi professional teams: West Wales, (based in their 'rugby' heartland) who had a "crowd" of 50 people in a Challenge Cup game in 2020  and only 100 against Hunslet in 2021. The second club, Crusaders, play right next door to the rugby league Region, so of course attract more English fans: they will get 5 or 600 people to most games. 

Their amateur mens league has 6 teams - only 3 of whom completed their 10 game season. There is no women's league, and hardly any children playing the game.

But yeah.... keep talking about " black welshmen" in the 1960s. That's a sure sign that Wales loves rugby league

[Midlands hobo]

WRL to take over the management of cru and WWR. Underwritten by RFL/SL. RFL/SL with what WRL can cobble together to fund an academy set up along the M4. Probably Bridgend. This provides a pathway to the WWR and Cru and eventually they could drop in a pro team off the back of these two as feeder clubs.

An academy system providing a pathway to championship/(1) level is a 10 year project. At the end either you have support for a SL franchise or SL has a claw into the valleys talent pool. 

 

The sad thought is looking at Gil Dudson. Elliot kear Ben flower and the like. Imagine what's been lost in the last decade.

[Tommygilf]

4 hours ago, Harry Stottle said:

That word has been knocking about for a very long time with France and much longer with London Tommy, it will be very interesting to see how IMG propose to convert London's potential into an actuality.

There is another thread at the moment which is discussing the next TV contract, whatever IMG are hoping to initiate in our sport it will be inextricably linked with the outcome of the those contracts discussions with whoever and the monies that can be acheived.

That's not really a zinger is it Harry?

[gingerjon]

49 minutes ago, Madrileño said:

There is no women's league,

Cardiff Demons are back to back WSL South champions.

[Madrileño]

3 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Cardiff Demons are back to back WSL South champions.

True. 

There is however no women's league for Welsh teams. 

[Tommygilf]

35 minutes ago, Madrileño said:

True. 

There is however no women's league for Welsh teams. 

Does there need to be?

[Madrileño]

7 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Does there need to be?

No! Not at all.

I was just illustrating that, contrary to what Pie Tries says, Wales clearly does not "love rugby league". Hardly anyone in the country plays or watches it. 

[Midlands hobo]

11 minutes ago, Madrileño said:

No! Not at all.

I was just illustrating that, contrary to what Pie Tries says, Wales clearly does not "love rugby league". Hardly anyone in the country plays or watches it. 

I live in Warwickshire and i could easily say the same about England. Nobody outside of the M62 is interested or cares and only a few thousand turn up to watch local derbies. 

Lets see what happens with the world cup final TV figures. England RU are I believe playing the all blacks at exactly the same time the. We can gauge the national interest.

[gingerjon]

20 minutes ago, Madrileño said:

No! Not at all.

I was just illustrating that, contrary to what Pie Tries says, Wales clearly does not "love rugby league". Hardly anyone in the country plays or watches it. 

Wales ain't a big place. There aren't going to be too many sports with a deep pyramid of teams playing in a national structure.

Even a couple of semi professional teams, a cluster of men's sides and a single women's team puts rugby league ahead of a fair few other sports with international profiles.

[steve oates]

3 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

Which club is that? Because WWR getting pumped 100 nil and losing any decent player because they don’t pay isn’t really what people are talking about here. 

Any serious Welsh club would have to have yes a minimum of Welsh players in the 17 (7 or 10 say) but have those lads play with quality non welsh players so they can grow and develop in a competitive team.

The OP talked about  "Wales has huge potential still, they just need one backer similar to a Derek Beaumont to drive the sport forward there". 

So do you believe this or not??  The OP hasn't been back since he claimed Wales had "Huge Potential". Which sounds like a wind up to me. What do you say to his opening gambit???

[steve oates]

10 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Wales ain't a big place. There aren't going to be too many sports with a deep pyramid of teams playing in a national structure.

But the OP, "The Daddy" said "Wales has huge potential still, they just need one backer similar to a Derek Beaumont to drive the sport forward there".  Given he has failed to engage in his own thread one can assume it was a wind up and your post has probably crushed this one until next time.....

[gingerjon]

Anyway, using the World Cup as leverage, boys and girls sessions going on in Blackwood and Port Talbot.

You can spot someone who knows what they're talking about by how they pronounce the second place there.

https://wrl.wales/start-the-journey-to-playing-for-wales

[Madrileño]

41 minutes ago, Midlands hobo said:

I live in Warwickshire and i could easily say the same about England. Nobody outside of the M62 is interested or cares and only a few thousand turn up to watch local derbies. 

Agreed. The English don't "love" rugby league IMO, which makes his assertion that the Welsh do, even more clueless. 

[SuperNoob]

IMG said they would focus on the game in the UK & limit Non-UK clubs to 2 so I would assume growing the game in Wales, Scotland & to some extent in Ireland is on the agenda else they would have just said Non-English clubs. For France & England to grow, they need more teams up North not too far & historically Union/League playing countries such as Ireland, Wales, Scotland, Spain & Italy. 

[steve oates]

9 hours ago, SuperNoob said:

IMG said they would focus on the game in the UK & limit Non-UK clubs to 2 so I would assume growing the game in Wales, Scotland & to some extent in Ireland is on the agenda 

I can assure you IMG are totally unable to "grow the game" in any places they don't play it now.

The last real attempt was some years ago when Sports England funded development officers , and they managed to get some people interested, and then the money ran out, and they all went back to their Rugby Union clubs......

If enthusiastic development officers on the ground can't do it, a few men in suits won't be able to do it that's for sure.

 

[fighting irish]

2 hours ago, steve oates said:

I can assure you IMG are totally unable to "grow the game" in any places they don't play it now.

The last real attempt was some years ago when Sports England funded development officers , and they managed to get some people interested, and then the money ran out, and they all went back to their Rugby Union clubs......

If enthusiastic development officers on the ground can't do it, a few men in suits won't be able to do it that's for sure.

 

I agree with your last statement, although it's not strictly true.

The development officers were doing it, but the initiative was killed off (finance pulled) and the game went into recession.

If the initiative had been maintained we would have seen significant growth by now.

Newcastle are showing how it can be done, we just need to replicate what they are doing elsewhere.

 

[GeordieSaint]

The key with Wales is not the ability to set up new clubs, in particular a SL club. It’s the development pathway where talent can be filtered into existing professional structures; this includes scouting of young RU players with potential. The more routes the better. 

[Damien]

50 minutes ago, GeordieSaint said:

The key with Wales is not the ability to set up new clubs, in particular a SL club. It’s the development pathway where talent can be filtered into existing professional structures; this includes scouting of young RU players with potential. The more routes the better. 

While that should happen it will always limit the amount of Welsh players that make it to the top. Not every player wants to go North either. Wales needs decent semi-professional clubs (at least) too.

[GeordieSaint]

23 minutes ago, Damien said:

While that should happen it will always limit the amount of Welsh players that make it to the top. Not every player wants to go North either. Wales needs decent semi-professional clubs (at least) too.

Agreed. That’s framework is already in place hence I didn’t mention it. We are obsessed by growing SL clubs; I don’t think that is needed nor potential viable in South Wales (without a significant long term investor).