Dilemma

[Bullmania]

15 minutes ago, Roger York said:

To be honest I haven’t either apparently it was for kicking the ball out but I didn’t see it on the video. It was a strange one though because York didn’t celebrate and Bradford didn’t complain bizarre really

Even when lilley picked it up only other thing I thought was AJ hit him from side and it’s ended up been accidental offside so a york penalty. Like you say very odd both sets players didn’t react either way to it.

[andyacko]

It's only a guess, but I think as Myles went to put the ball down, Wallace's foot contacted the ball, probably inadvertently but it was really strange as it certainly wasn't grounded properly. Deffo touch judge intervention.

We'll take it!  

[JonT]

32 minutes ago, Bullmania said:

Who’s kicked it out from there it’s impossible and who’s walloped him in head when he walked away after he was told to swing his arm as he landed akward where from that you would do. Has AJ is trying turn him to prevent the score so he’s landing on his arm shoulder why to me even in fast motion he’s tried to throw it out with a offload knowing he’s going lose control. We can all have a opinion but will never know the facts like spainish knight said who knows with that ref.

The next couple of frames seem pretty clear to me. 

As Harrison is grounding the ball it's kick away. Look at Wallace's foot/leg and the direction of travel of the ball. And as for the lack of reaction - was that not more due to the fact the ref blew up almost immediately as, and fair play to the Bull's players who could immediately see that Harrison was in trouble, the concern was with the potential condition of the York player who'd taken a blow to the head.

[andyacko]

Top marks, Mr Miklauskas.

[HaxbyKnight]

1 minute ago, andyacko said:

Top marks, Mr Miklauskas.

He has always been popular at York. Best referee in the league. Well he was on Sunday. 

[Bullmania]

21 minutes ago, JonT said:

The next couple of frames seem pretty clear to me. 

As Harrison is grounding the ball it's kick away. Look at Wallace's foot/leg and the direction of travel of the ball. And as for the lack of reaction - was that not more due to the fact the ref blew up almost immediately as, and fair play to the Bull's players who could immediately see that Harrison was in trouble, the concern was with the potential condition of the York player who'd taken a blow to the head.

That’s not kicked away balls hit leg or has arm his legs are going the momentum in the direction he’s going. 
 

wasn’t walloped in the head walks of after and it’s his arm shoulder that he’s moving about the one that his full weight will have landed on which will been a sore landing.

this didn’t effect the outcome but it was never a try either I was more disappointed in your last try two forwards on him to let him turn and dive over letting go like that is criminal. But also got what they deserved that second half I’ve no idea why they bothered coming out they did nothing.

bradfords biggest loss is sereyaro then have a new half partnership Connor at full back the full spines changed York just did enough for the win. Both times we’ve played you been horror shows from us if we now make play offs there lucky won’t do anything either I think london the play off dark horses.

[AB Knight]

6 hours ago, Bullmania said:

I’ve still no idea how the first York try was given not one york player celebrated Harrison through the ball back lilley caught it hands on head by York players. Then had a chat gave it not one celebration just York players confused talking with the ref asking why it’s a try

Out of interest how do you know that the York players were asking the ref why it was a try? You’re hardly on top of the action at Odsal, and I don’t think Gledhill has yet hooked up players with mics!

[Bullmania]

2 minutes ago, AB Knight said:

Out of interest how do you know that the York players were asking the ref why it was a try? You’re hardly on top of the action at Odsal, and I don’t think Gledhill has yet hooked up players with mics!

From the videos posted online could see confusion in the ranks. Both teams mind. At the game I said it was no try straight away with where the ball ended up and the fact was no celebrations from the players and york fans singing we thought we’d scored. The all moment was confusion but that’s what Scott whatever his name brings to the park confusion for both teams. 

[Simon Hall]

24 minutes ago, Bullmania said:

At the game I said it was no try straight away with where the ball ended up

But it was a try.

[The Phantom Horseman]

No axe to grind either way as a neutral, the first time I saw the video footage I thought it was a strange decision to award a penalty try.

However I then went to Settings on the YouTube footage and slowed the speed down to 0.25 and it's crystal clear that Harrison was reaching out to touch down and the ball was clearly kicked out of his hands, that's why it shot away to the side, there's no way the ball shoots out like that if he just dropped it.

I'd add that the ref could hardly have been in a better position. Having watched it in slow-motion, he got the decision absolutely right in my opinion.

[POR]

6 hours ago, HolmeKnight said:

Isn't a penalty try normally an eight-pointer with an extra kick in front of the posts?

NO H only If a player fouls an opponent who is touching down for a try, then a penalty kick at goal shall be taken from in front of the goal posts after the attempt to convert the try from where it's scored

 

[HolmeKnight]

15 hours ago, POR said:

NO H only If a player fouls an opponent who is touching down for a try, then a penalty kick at goal shall be taken from in front of the goal posts after the attempt to convert the try from where it's scored

 

In other words, fouled in the act of scoring or fouled to prevent scoring. Obviously I can see the difference but don't understand why one is considered worse than the other.

[POR]

39 minutes ago, HolmeKnight said:

In other words, fouled in the act of scoring or fouled to prevent scoring. Obviously I can see the difference but don't understand why one is considered worse than the other.

It's not about which one is worse or foul play H it's all about punishing the team that's been naughty

First things first H despite all and sundry calling it a  penalty try York didn't score a penalty try against the bulls 

let me explain

SCENARIO 1

York lad  didn't score a try so ref could not award one BUT ball knocked out of his hand by Bulls so in opinion of ref he would have scored if that didn't happen so awarded a try kick at goal end of story York NO penalty try

 The try was given to punish Bulls indiscretion 

SCENARIO 2

York lad scores try and instead of bulls lad kicking out ball kicks York lad instead  ref sees that as foul play so he awards York the try they scored kick at goal NO end of story York given another kick in front of goal York YES penalty try

The penalty kick would be given  to punish Bulls indiscretion 

What that all means is if owt happens the Ref has to punish the offending side so he can either award a try that hasn't been scored or a penalty after one has been scored HE can't do both

[JonT]

Full game is now up on Bulls Youtube channel.

 

[Fevrover]

On 12/09/2023 at 10:31, andyacko said:

It's only a guess, but I think as Myles went to put the ball down, Wallace's foot contacted the ball, probably inadvertently but it was really strange as it certainly wasn't grounded properly. Deffo touch judge intervention.

We'll take it!  

So would Bradford other way round.

[The Phantom Horseman]

5 hours ago, POR said:

 

First things first H despite all and sundry calling it a  penalty try York didn't score a penalty try against the bulls 

let me explain

SCENARIO 1

York lad  didn't score a try so ref could not award one BUT ball knocked out of his hand by Bulls so in opinion of ref he would have scored if that didn't happen so awarded a try kick at goal end of story York NO penalty try

 

 

Isn't that literally the definition of a penalty try?
From the laws of the game
Penalty try (d) the Referee may award a penalty try if, in their opinion, a try would have been scored but for the unfair play of the defending team. A penalty try is awarded between the goal posts irrespective of where the offence occurred.

[Nearenough]

the bloke with the whistle did not award a penalty try. there was no penalty kick so he cant have done. so he awarded a try as he believed the ball was grounded by york and no foul had occured. he should have awarded a penalty try as the player grounding the ball was fouled in the act of scoring by havin the ball kicked from his hand.

[The Phantom Horseman]

4 hours ago, Nearenough said:

the bloke with the whistle did not award a penalty try. there was no penalty kick so he cant have done. so he awarded a try as he believed the ball was grounded by york and no foul had occured. he should have awarded a penalty try as the player grounding the ball was fouled in the act of scoring by havin the ball kicked from his hand.

There seems to be a misunderstanding of the rules here.

As stated above, "the Referee may award a penalty try if, in their opinion, a try would have been scored but for the unfair play of the defending team."

After a penalty try, the team awarded the try just takes the conversion attempt as normal (in front of the posts, of course, as that's where all penlty tries are awarded). There's no extra penalty attempt afterwards.

You and the previous poster seem to be mixing this up with the "offence against the try scorer" rule (colloquially known as the 8-point try), which relates to instances where foul play occurred as the player is scoring the try - ie he still managed to touch down despite being fouled. In that instance, the conversion is taken (from a point level with where the try was scored), followed by the penalty in front of the posts.

Edited September 14, 2023 by The Phantom Horseman

[Expatknight]

2 hours ago, The Phantom Horseman said:

There seems to be a misunderstanding of the rules here.

As stated above, "the Referee may award a penalty try if, in their opinion, a try would have been scored but for the unfair play of the defending team."

After a penalty try, the team awarded the try just takes the conversion attempt as normal (in front of the posts, of course, as that's where all penlty tries are awarded). There's no extra penalty attempt afterwards.

You and the previous poster seem to be mixing this up with the "offence against the try scorer" rule (colloquially knwon as the 8-point try), which relates to instances where foul play occurring as the player is scoring the try - ie he still managed to touch down despite being fouled. In that instance, the conversion is taken (from a point level with where the try was scored), followed by the penalty in front of the posts.

you are correct, many people get confused with this even though it is quite simple really.

[Nige Arro]

On 12/09/2023 at 12:13, Bullmania said:

Who’s kicked it out from there it’s impossible and who’s walloped him in head when he walked away after he was told to swing his arm as he landed akward where from that you would do. Has AJ is trying turn him to prevent the score so he’s landing on his arm shoulder why to me even in fast motion he’s tried to throw it out with a offload knowing he’s going lose control. We can all have a opinion but will never know the facts like spainish knight said who knows with that ref.

Bulls fans are just like remainers.

Can't believe they lost

[AB Knight]

On 12/09/2023 at 13:47, Bullmania said:

From the videos posted online could see confusion in the ranks. Both teams mind. At the game I said it was no try straight away with where the ball ended up and the fact was no celebrations from the players and york fans singing we thought we’d scored. The all moment was confusion but that’s what Scott whatever his name brings to the park confusion for both teams. 

Confusion yes, but unless you’re a player/trainer/water carrier who was on the pitch then you have no idea what the York players are asking the ref - they could be saying anything such as can you watch out for high tackles sir, for example.

In the same way watching the highlights Flanagan was wafting his arms a lot and kept saying things to the ref, the biased amongst us might assume he was asking for a penalty (which isn’t his style, of course)....but on the other hand he might just be telling the ref he can’t wait for his end of season holiday in Lanzarote when he can go swimming.

[HaxbyKnight]

And to round it off Baitierie has picked up a one match ban.