Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Scott Sinfield

Any reason St Helens and Hull Fc don't have any second name?

Recommended Posts

I always thought the most ridiculous was Wakefield's.  Why add a third word to an already excellent and historically relevant name?  Dropping 'Wildcats' was an excellent move!

  • Like 9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, Wiltshire Warrior Dragon said:

I always thought the most ridiculous was Wakefield's.  Why add a third word to an already excellent and historically relevant name?  Dropping 'Wildcats' was an excellent move!

The Trinity bit was actually removed.  The Wildcats moniker and logo was awful. Still see a few unfortunate tattoos about.  

Had the three Wakefield area clubs merged, Trinity would have been an excellent name for the new entity.  

Edited by Wollo Wollo Wayoo
  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1

This world was never meant for one as beautiful as me.
 
 
Wakefield Trinity RLFC
2012 - 2014 "The wasted years"

2013, 2014 & 2015 Official Magic Weekend "Whipping Boys"

2017 - The year the dream disappeared under Grix's left foot.

2018 - The FinniChezz Bromance 

2019 - The Return of the Prodigal Son

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Damien said:

As far as I recall clubs were basically forced to have the cheesy American style name added at the start of Super League. St Helens were exempt as their town name practically encompasses their nickname.

No one was forced and St Helens were definitely introduced as St Helens Saints on the TV at the time - whether anyone actually called them that or not.


Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The idea that this was something new inflicted on the game by SL is a nonsense. Sports clubs and yes even rugby league clubs have used tags - nicknames whatever you want to call them since day dot.

Things changed in 1991 when a n astute new board at Keighley decided to rebrand the club as Keighley Cougars and rename the ground as Cougar Park, a much more marketable name than Lawkholmers.

The rebrand caught the Keighley public's imagination and games became events.

This hadn't gone unnoticed  elsewhere but the ever conservative rugby league were slow to catch on to embrace what was a revolution in club marketing.

with the formation of Super League it was put to the clubs that they should make themselves more marketable to a wider audience by adopting better 'nicknames' than they already had, ones that could be used as marketing tools.

8 out of 12 clubs adopted new names in the first year of SL, St. Helens stuck with Saints and Workington stuck with Town, Wigan and Halifax remained as just that.

Wigan adopted Warriors as a marketing brand in 1987, the shirt that season had an imprint of a Warriors head but the badge just carried the name Wigan Rugby League it was a few years later that the club used the name  Wigan Warriors. Halifax became Blue Sox as recommended by  Nigel Wood, enough said.

1982/83 Season listed nicknames of clubs.

Barrow - Shipbuilders

Batley - Gallant Youths

Blackpool - Milers

Bradford Northern - Northern

Bramley - Villagers

Cardiff City - Blue Dragons

Castleford - Glassblowers

Doncaster - Dons

Featherstone Rovers - Colliers

Fulham - Londoners

Halifax - Thrum Hallers

Hull - Airlie Birds

Hull KR - Robins

Keighley - Lawkholmers

Leeds - Loiners

Oldham - Roughyeds

Rochdale Hornets - Hornets

St. Helens - Saints

Salford - Red Devils

Swinton - Lions

Wakefield Trinity - Dreadnoughts

Warrington - Wire

Whitehaven - Haven

Widnes -- Chemics

Wigan - Riversiders

Workington Town - Town

York - Wasps

Not listed with a nickname are Carlisle,  Dewsbury, Huddersfield (Fartowners), Hunslet (Parksiders) and Huyton.

Edited by Padge
  • Thanks 1

Visit my photography site www.padge.smugmug.com

Radio 5 Live: Saturday 14 April 2007

Dave Whelan "In Wigan rugby will always be king"

 

This country's wealth was created by men in overalls, it was destroyed by men in suits.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Eddie said:

I’ve always assumed it’s distinguish themselves from Hull KR. 

Yes that's what I first assumed, yet they are still referred to "FC" by commentators in a game in which KR have no involvment and so no need to make that distinction. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Eddie said:

The Chemics was a great nickname, so much better than Vikings. 

You can't sell cuddly 'Chemics'.

 


Visit my photography site www.padge.smugmug.com

Radio 5 Live: Saturday 14 April 2007

Dave Whelan "In Wigan rugby will always be king"

 

This country's wealth was created by men in overalls, it was destroyed by men in suits.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Padge said:

You can't sell cuddly 'Chemics'.

 

They could sell cuddly Fiddlers Ferry towers. 

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, wiganermike said:

Hull did adopt a nickname, they were Hull Sharks during the late 90s. They were in financial trouble (or heading for it) when they were merged with the original Gateshead Thunder club. The resultant club stayed based in Hull and dropped the Sharks moniker which was unpopular anyway, reverting to the historic Hull FC. Other clubs such as Halifax, Oldham and Whitehaven also dropped their soubriquets.

As Man of Kent said St Helens having already been long known as the Saints had no need to come up with a new marketable nickname and possibly didn't stick it on the end as a club name beginning with Saint and ending in Saints would look a little silly when written down. I don't think Workington Town ever added a new nickname either.

I have friends who to this day still have the Hull sharks badge tattooed 

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Padge said:

1982/83 Season listed nicknames of clubs.

Featherstone Rovers - Colliers

This was always a nickname imposed from outside by journos etc, in nearly 50 years supporting Fev I don't think I've ever heard any of our fans or anyone connected with the club calling us "the Colliers". It's not even a term you'd hear often anyway (nobody ever talks about the 1984 colliers' strike after all).

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, gingerjon said:

No one was forced and St Helens were definitely introduced as St Helens Saints on the TV at the time - whether anyone actually called them that or not.

I remember reading various articles at the time saying that it was and a couple of years later actually spoke to Peter Deakin at Bradford, Dave Swanson at Wigan the person over marketing at Leeds, whose name escapes me, quite extensively on what they had implemented and why as part of my dissertation. Peter Deakin was great and the Leeds person was great. Both full of great ideas and plans and it was fairly obvious why those clubs had the success with the name change and associated marketing that they had. I cant say I was that impressed with Dave Swanson or what Wigan were doing and it perhaps shows that it was never embraced there in the same way.

This exert says that pseudo-American nicknames were instituted at the request of BSkyB. I cant copy from the page but you can see for yourself:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=zWf4AAAAQBAJ&pg=PT132&lpg=PT132&dq=pseudo-american+team+nicknames&source=bl&ots=8ng0Idr-lb&sig=ACfU3U02srPqwT1BLdkhH7WXRJoMgVG9ZQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiVq66735LpAhVkMewKHTglAw8Q6AEwAHoECAoQAQ#v=onepage&q=pseudo-american team nicknames&f=false

 

Edited by Damien
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Eddie said:

The Chemics was a great nickname, so much better than Vikings. 

I agree, but when I was a bit sniffy and dismissive of 'Vikings' as the Widnes nickname on another thread some time ago, I was taken to task - quite rightly, it transpired - because there apparently is some Viking history in the Widnes area.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Wollo Wollo Wayoo said:

The Trinity bit was actually removed.  The Wildcats moniker and logo was awful. Still see a few unfortunate tattoos about.  

Had the three Wakefield area clubs merged, Trinity would have been an excellent name for the new entity.  

True, but 'Holy' or 'Unholy'!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the thread intimates the main reason - there are official nicknames that are part of the title, and there are other nicknames/appellations etc. that are in common use. 

In the example of St Helens, they have been known as the Saints since the dark ages; it's simply unnecessary to add Saint to St (Saint).

In the example of Hull FC, simply using Hull would leave potential confusion with the other Hull, particularly for those more loosely connected with RL.  As I guess the fans are happy with the FC, there's no need for Sharks or whatever.

It has been commented that Wire and Chemics would not work in the official names, but the current situation allows these traditional names to be used alongside the newer nicknames which have some popularity. Everyone can be happy.

Passage of time seems to determine which nicknames stick. The Rhinos and Tigers seem to be here to stay, but Wildcats and City Reds are gone forever I guess.

I wonder what are the most likely nicknames to disappear next.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The Phantom Horseman said:

This was always a nickname imposed from outside by journos etc, in nearly 50 years supporting Fev I don't think I've ever heard any of our fans or anyone connected with the club calling us "the Colliers". It's not even a term you'd hear often anyway (nobody ever talks about the 1984 colliers' strike after all).

 

I can remember Fev were gunna be called The Pirates which  wasn't well received but there was plenty of merchandise with the Pirate logo on them. 

Edited by MADREDNIGE

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Mr Smeaton said:

I remember the late Peter Deakin returning to his grassroots club St. Anne’s in 1995 and he had some merchandise in his car from America and he introduced the club to purchase polo shirts and caps. After a few months he moved to Bradford and he suggested that the club change their name to the Bulls. And the rest is history. He did a similar job at Saracens with the Fez. 

I knew Peter when he played as a youngster with St.Anne's and then went on the play for Great Britain at amateur level. He was always publicity-minded and was involved with several initiatives to try and raise the profile of the game even before his assosciation with Bradford. In fact he was also one of the helpers in distributing the first ever editions of "Open Rugby", now known as "Rugbv League World".

In his memory the Man-of-the-Match award in the Rugby Union Premiership Final (similar to the Lance Todd Trophy) is called the "Peter Deakin Medal"

Edited by RL does what Sky says
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why can't Hull be officially called "Hull Airlie Birds" ?  They have the mascot so why not the name ?

Yes they no longer play on Airlie Street but neither does the town of Oldham still produce top hats with a rough felt on the top of them and hence their nickname derived from "Rough Heads".

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said:

We (Saints) were St Helens Rangers till the 1880’s, which sounds so odd. 

Why...Queens Park Rangers,Glasgow Rangers? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The Phantom Horseman said:

This was always a nickname imposed from outside by journos etc, in nearly 50 years supporting Fev I don't think I've ever heard any of our fans or anyone connected with the club calling us "the Colliers". It's not even a term you'd hear often anyway (nobody ever talks about the 1984 colliers' strike after all).

 

Nobody ever called Wigan The Riversiders but that was their 'official' nickname. SImilar with Halifax being Thrum Hallers, supporters would just call them Fax.

The first Wigan team was named Wigan Wasps, these names have been around for years, some worked, Rochdale Hornets, most didn't. This sort of stuff is not a product of SL.

 

 

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1

Visit my photography site www.padge.smugmug.com

Radio 5 Live: Saturday 14 April 2007

Dave Whelan "In Wigan rugby will always be king"

 

This country's wealth was created by men in overalls, it was destroyed by men in suits.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, koli said:

Why...Queens Park Rangers,Glasgow Rangers? 

Nothing against Rangers, it just seems strange having something extra on top of St Helens.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Damien said:

I remember reading various articles at the time saying that it was and a couple of years later actually spoke to Peter Deakin at Bradford, Dave Swanson at Wigan the person over marketing at Leeds, whose name escapes me, quite extensively on what they had implemented and why as part of my dissertation. Peter Deakin was great and the Leeds person was great. Both full of great ideas and plans and it was fairly obvious why those clubs had the success with the name change and associated marketing that they had. I cant say I was that impressed with Dave Swanson or what Wigan were doing and it perhaps shows that it was never embraced there in the same way.

This exert says that pseudo-American nicknames were instituted at the request of BSkyB. I cant copy from the page but you can see for yourself:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=zWf4AAAAQBAJ&pg=PT132&lpg=PT132&dq=pseudo-american+team+nicknames&source=bl&ots=8ng0Idr-lb&sig=ACfU3U02srPqwT1BLdkhH7WXRJoMgVG9ZQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiVq66735LpAhVkMewKHTglAw8Q6AEwAHoECAoQAQ#v=onepage&q=pseudo-american team nicknames&f=false

 

Not one single reference for any of that, pure supposition on the part of the Author. The Author mentions WIgan Warriors as an example, Wigan didn't add that at the start of SL.

How come Wigan and Halifax and Workington Town didn't run with it.


Visit my photography site www.padge.smugmug.com

Radio 5 Live: Saturday 14 April 2007

Dave Whelan "In Wigan rugby will always be king"

 

This country's wealth was created by men in overalls, it was destroyed by men in suits.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Eddie said:

Leeds Owls would be a great name ? 

If any team to be given that name it would have to be "Owldam" .. that was the orignal name of the town after it was formed near a wood where many owls nested. In fact, the mascot for Oldham Athletic is an Owl.

owl.jpg.bca3b0278b65cd0d2322ccd470e19242.jpg

Also Sheffield Wednesday FC are known as "The Owls".

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Padge said:

Not one single reference for any of that, pure supposition on the part of the Author. The Author mentions WIgan Warriors as an example, Wigan didn't add that at the start of SL.

How come Wigan and Halifax and Workington Town didn't run with it.

There were all sorts of dispensations at the start of Super League regarding a whole host of things. All teams had one come SL2 bar Saints.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.



×
×
  • Create New...