Wolves sign Josh McGuire

[Snowys Backside]

My word,

There are some ignorant posters on here !

I thought the days of waving bubble gum wrappers in the crowd and watching Wurzel Gummage had long gone !

Let McGuire play next week FFS. It’s just a slip of the tongue. Lock the thread ! 

[Chrispmartha]

1 hour ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Then next time a wife goes to the hospital with her face stoved in the doctor will say don't worry these injuries will soon heal,it could be worse he could have called you names.

We're getting OT here but I think that's naïve in the extreme.

Mental/emotional damage can be just as bad and last longer than physical damage.

[Dave T]

3 minutes ago, Saint Toppy said:

Thats not the specific post I responded to. Dave T stated that this verbal abuse offence sits outside all of his previous offences - it clearly doesn't ! Prior to this latest 12 match ban there have been 3 previous instances of him abusing players or officials.

He also has quite a lengthy list of bans & fines for on-field and off-field offences throughout his career.

When talking about 'this' I was referring to the situation. We were clearly talking about these two incidents as linked. Nobody had forgotten about his 7 game ban, it was discussed extensively here. 

I can see one ban for dissent - he was sin-binned and received a one-match ban. What was the other offence? He was fined for touching a ref.

So, what you are saying is that a player with a 14 year NRL career, with experience at the very top levels (Origin and Kangaroos) - has next to no experience of this kind of offence before he signed at Wire. Glad we agree.

[ELBOWSEYE]

2 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

We're getting OT here but I think that's naïve in the extreme.

Mental/emotional damage can be just as bad and last longer than physical damage.

Is certain people saying thats OT when it shows how statements can be seen from various stances, people write statements and they see how they think other people will read it, but it can be read totally different.

You and OF see the statement as highlighting that mental abuse can in certain circumstances be more long lasting than physical abuse, but all I wrote is that is not as black and white and showed an example where it showed the opposite. Reality is both can have long lasting effects.

[Damien]

10 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

We're getting OT here but I think that's naïve in the extreme.

Mental/emotional damage can be just as bad and last longer than physical damage.

As the majority of suicides are linked to mental rather than physical health then it is very fair to say that the affects of mental and emotional damage can be far reaching. You just never know how someone is feeling and all it takes is that one thing to push them over the edge. As the game now prides itself on the action it has taken regarding mental health it is only right that it sends a strong signal.

[Gavin Harrison]

2 hours ago, RP London said:

As you say the thing with free speech is that we all have the right to it, do we have the right to abuse others just for the colour of their skin, their sexual preference or their opinion? Does Free Speech include talking provable nonsense? To say that someone is inferior just because of their sexual orientation or skin colour or hair colour.. is that free speech?

Free Speech is a funny old thing and has never and will never truly exist. People should not be allowed to just stand up and spout absolute nonsense  without being challenged, and sometimes you just have to say "look just stop" if you are an organisation and not have "free speech" thrown as a defence. If someone is shouting that gravity doesnt exist and that all elephants were purple people tend to just walk away. However, if someone does that in a pub or a theatre or a lecture hall and the reaction is that people arent going to turn up, spend their money and keep the business afloat, then surely it is the right of that venue to say "no your not going on" and not be accused of "cancel culture" etc.. it is just the consequences of free speech in action, because the venue surely has free speech and that includes actions in this case.

Rugby is the same, you have the freedom to say what you want but not that and not here, and surely that is ok.

Free Speech is not under threat, what some people want is a Freedom of Speech without Challenge and to be told they are right no matter what rubbish comes out of their mouth.. and that should never be allowed.  (this forum is excellent before anyone says anything)

Spectaculary fantastical tangential irrelevance in there. Good work.

[Gavin Harrison]

19 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

We're getting OT here but I think that's naïve in the extreme.

Mental/emotional damage can be just as bad and last longer than physical damage.

From a single comment from one man to another on a rugby field?

Now who is going OT here....

[Phil]

4 minutes ago, Gavin Harrison said:

From a single comment from one man to another on a rugby field?

Now who is going OT here....

He made a comment about Charnley’s son who I believe is autistic how are any of you on here defending this? 

[OriginalMrC]

This has nothing to do with free speech. 

This has nothing to do with being 'woke'. 

This has nothing to do with modern players being soft. 

This is not a decision based on one person's word against another. 

This was quite rightly a disciplinary matter involving a player who had already committed the same offence this season! Stop letting your tribal loyalties or your 'anti-woke' stance cloud your judgements! 

[RP London]

1 hour ago, Gavin Harrison said:

You're absolutely right, they are incomparable.

Punching someone unconscious then punching them again as they lay unconscious, leading ro concussions, psychological problems & ending a career pales in to insignificanace compared to an insult.

My bad.

yes because insults never lead to people being excluded or to psychological issues and suicide do they.. no never.. 

(and, as I said, I think they got the punsihment for Ben Flower wrong... but dont let that get in the way)

Edited June 7 by RP London

[Gavin Harrison]

16 minutes ago, Damien said:

As the majority of suicides are linked to mental rather than physical health then it is very fair to say that the affects of mental and emotional damage can be far reaching. You just never know how someone is feeling and all it takes is that one thing to push them over the edge. As the game now prides itself on the action it has taken regarding mental health it is only right that it sends a strong signal.

It's a quantum leap of epic proportions to introduce mental health & suicide in to this. The most OT post yet.

[Gavin Harrison]

4 minutes ago, Phil said:

He made a comment about Charnley’s son who I believe is autistic how are any of you on here defending this? 

Who is defending McGuire here?

[Phil]

Just now, Gavin Harrison said:

It's a quantum leap of epic proportions to introduce mental health & suicide in to this. The most OT post yet.

Nope, the most OT post stated it was just “hurty words” 

[Phil]

Just now, Gavin Harrison said:

Who is defending McGuire here?

Lots of people 

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, Phil said:

Lots of people 

That's not really true Phil.

There are a very small handful here maybe, support for him is more prominent on the depths of Twitter.

[RP London]

6 minutes ago, Gavin Harrison said:

It's a quantum leap of epic proportions to introduce mental health & suicide in to this. The most OT post yet.

you do know OT means Off Topic and not Over The Top which is OTT dont you?

[Saint Toppy]

34 minutes ago, Dave T said:

So, what you are saying is that a player with a 14 year NRL career, with experience at the very top levels (Origin and Kangaroos) - has next to no experience of this kind of offence before he signed at Wire. Glad we agree.

Just the 3 previous offences, but hey I guess in your world 3 previous offences for verbal abuse counts as next to nothing. Given this latest one is now his 5th offence for verbal abuse, just how many more do you want him to rack up before you stop defending him as being a complete idiot who never learns ?

[Dave T]

I don't think it is appropriate personally for us to discuss the alleged comments specifically here. We know the rumours, it should just be left there. 

What is relevant is the point about verbal abuse around protected characteristics vs hurty words.

The sport has very much gone down the route of not tolerating verbal abuse and taking it serious, I personally welcome that, I can understand others thinking it is OTT, even though I 100% disagree with them.

Similarly, I don't think it is too helpful to compare to physical violence, we have plenty of discussions around disciplinary for violent acts, unfortunately the sport has decided to water down punishments here. But there are loads of threads for us to discuss that.

McGuire was found guilty of these two incidents, he has ben held accountable, he is banned, hopefully moved on from my club and we all get on with our lives. 

[Dave T]

Just now, Saint Toppy said:

Just the 3 previous offences, but hey I guess in your world 3 previous offences for verbal abuse counts as next to nothing. Given this latest one is now his 5th offence for verbal abuse, just how many more do you want him to rack up before you stop defending him as being a complete idiot who never learns ?

Which 3 offences from before he signed for Wire? I've asked you, but you won't answer, so it's making the discussion difficult, but that's on you.

I can find one ban for verbals in the NRL. Where are the other two? That's a genuine question. You are saying he has history, but appear to want to keep it a secret.

 

[Phil]

7 minutes ago, Dave T said:

That's not really true Phil.

There are a very small handful here maybe, support for him is more prominent on the depths of Twitter.

Fair comment, a few people 

[ELBOWSEYE]

20 minutes ago, Phil said:

Lots of people 

I not read many posts actually supporting McGuire, even Warrington fans think he is stupid and has been a poor signing and I have not Found any support for him not having his contract termination.

[RP London]

14 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I don't think it is appropriate personally for us to discuss the alleged comments specifically here. We know the rumours, it should just be left there. 

What is relevant is the point about verbal abuse around protected characteristics vs hurty words.

The sport has very much gone down the route of not tolerating verbal abuse and taking it serious, I personally welcome that, I can understand others thinking it is OTT, even though I 100% disagree with them.

Similarly, I don't think it is too helpful to compare to physical violence, we have plenty of discussions around disciplinary for violent acts, unfortunately the sport has decided to water down punishments here. But there are loads of threads for us to discuss that.

McGuire was found guilty of these two incidents, he has ben held accountable, he is banned, hopefully moved on from my club and we all get on with our lives. 

agree 100% with this.

[Jughead]

This kind of thread and incident, of which we’ve seen a few in recent years (McGuire 1.0, Clubb etc), always shows the attitudes and beliefs of different people and always highlights to me that there is work still to be done societally to stamp out this kind of thing. 

We could talk about the RFL disciplinary and how they get x wrong in our points of view but the game taking a hard line on abuse is absolutely where we should be and what we should be doing. I do think many incidents cited here aren’t comparable anyway so I don’t think they have any relevance, personally. 

Edited June 7 by Jughead

[Phil]

3 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

I not read many posts actually supporting McGuire, even Warrington fans think he is stupid and has been a poor signing and I have not Found any support for him not having his contract termination.

Yes, I’ve already said a few rather than lots

[GUBRATS]

Let's all just cam down , nobody on here is defending him , some think the punishment doesn't really fit the crime , but overall everybody agrees , the bloke is a knob , we don't need him in our sport in this country 

Best to just leave it at that , this week's match threads are up , let's see some predictions and all forget about somebody not worth our time and thoughts