Wolves sign Josh McGuire

[RP London]

7 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

No worries just a bit of humour when lots of posters are getting irate, I am from Leigh (when I moved to Warrington they said that was a disability). Did you hear the comment or read about as after like the rest of us, because I doubt you left LSV in an angry state after the match especially if you were unaware of it. On McGuire I don't disagree with your view of him it maybe my age because I have had a disabled brother (wheelchair bound his whole life) disabled (mentally) relatives who were and some  still are season ticket holders but any comments insulting them I would directly respond and if no apology deal with it, like I say it maybe my age as I don't get as offended as younger people.

see this is the thing.. you would directly respond.. that is what Charnley did in the way that he could.. He cant just stand there and have a slanging match or worse without potentially getting himself into serious trouble. Therefore he responds by reporting it. 

The RFL have decided (rightly in my opinion) that this sort of thing has no place in an inclusive game and therefore have thrown the proverbial book at him for a 2nd offence (after he was supposed to have some education on the matter).

Sometimes age is definitely a thing in that what used to get thrown around a playground is no longer acceptable but we are used to hearing it in a playground.. I agree with you that language and what is insulting has got "softer" ie what we had as mainstream is not accepted now. But I also accept that time moves on and the same was probably said by our parents (although more around corporal punishment etc). What the RFL have to look at is "what will keep the new generation away" not "what do the older generation think is acceptable" and I think they are making the right call here. 

[Tim Streets tache]

Makes me laugh how many Rugby League fans long to go back to the days of casual racism, ringworm, gravy butties and not telling mum about the cheeky priest.

[Dunbar]

44 minutes ago, Leonard said:

If someone at work made a dementia joke, I wouldn't consider getting them suspended for 3 months.

But hey ho.

If someone at work made a joke about dementia then I would probably be OK about it (clearly depends on context).

But if someone made a joke about my mother suffering from dementia then it is a very different story.

There is a clear and obvious difference. 

[RP London]

15 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

I might if I had a specific policy in place against it, and then had sent said employee on an educational course about it after an incident just a few months prior. And then he denied guilt of saying it this time.

If (I suspect when) he gets sacked I think that would be a very useful post for him to read to explain it!

[Snowys Backside]

13 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

No worries just a bit of humour when lots of posters are getting irate, I am from Leigh (when I moved to Warrington they said that was a disability). Did you hear the comment or read about as after like the rest of us, because I doubt you left LSV in an angry state after the match especially if you were unaware of it. On McGuire I don't disagree with your view of him it maybe my age because I have had a disabled brother (wheelchair bound his whole life) disabled (mentally) relatives who were and some  still are season ticket holders but any comments insulting them I would directly respond and if no apology deal with it, like I say it maybe my age as I don't get as offended as younger people.

No offence taken. 
 

I get ribbed a lot living in Warrington but always proud of my roots but I love living there. 
 

I didn’t go to the game as I was on Holiday but as soon as my Wire informant told me what was alleged, he was livid and he knew I would be. 
 

Like any major event, the dust will settle but lessons need to be learnt here and bigotry flushed out. 
 

Rugby League is a wonderful sport and professional sportsmen and women have in in their blood to engage the fan base of all types. This incident has really damaged the brand of Warrington Wolves and this guy needs help because he obviously doesn’t know right from wrong. 
 

It’s a pity the RFL didn’t fine him 40k He would be looking over his Castlemain XXXX in Stockton Heath because I think this would be the only way to make this guy realise what he has done. 
 

He will probably go home a wealthy man with Warrington stating something different to appease the fans. 

[Barry Badrinath]

4 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

If someone at work made a joke about dementia then I would probably be OK about it (clearly depends on context).

But if someone made a joke about my mother suffering from dementia then it is a very different story.

There is a clear and obvious difference. 

if someone was specificly targeting you/me in this example, making a joke, or a derogatory phrase, in an attempt to upset me or get me to lash out, which is essentially whats happened in the JM/JC example, i'd definitely be reporting it to my management.

 

a very VERY clear difference

[ELBOWSEYE]

5 minutes ago, Snowys Backside said:

No offence taken. 
 

I get ribbed a lot living in Warrington but always proud of my roots but I love living there. 
 

I didn’t go to the game as I was on Holiday but as soon as my Wire informant told me what was alleged, he was livid and he knew I would be. 
 

Like any major event, the dust will settle but lessons need to be learnt here and bigotry flushed out. 
 

Rugby League is a wonderful sport and professional sportsmen and women have in in their blood to engage the fan base of all types. This incident has really damaged the brand of Warrington Wolves and this guy needs help because he obviously doesn’t know right from wrong. 
 

It’s a pity the RFL didn’t fine him 40k He would be looking over his Castlemain XXXX in Stockton Heath because I think this would be the only way to make this guy realise what he has done. 
 

He will probably go home a wealthy man with Warrington stating something different to appease the fans. 

Post of the day 

[Dave W]

22 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

Everything is Brexit's fault, haha...

I think you've missed the point about cause and effect

[OriginalMrC]

All these young people get offended so easily today. I remember the good old days when you could abuse anyone without any consequences at all. Those days were great. I'd love to go back to those days. 

Now where did I put my (rose tinted) spectacles.... 

[StandOffHalf]

6 minutes ago, Dave W said:

I think you've missed the point about cause and effect

I didn't think too deeply. Brexit is blamed for a lot of things.

[ELBOWSEYE]

10 minutes ago, OriginalMrC said:

All these young people get offended so easily today. I remember the good old days when you could abuse anyone without any consequences at all. Those days were great. I'd love to go back to those days. 

Now where did I put my (rose tinted) spectacles.... 

Humour please stop 

There was always consequences, if it occurred on the field it was usually violent. I agree society is clamping down on abuse but now there are sections that look for ways to be offended then proceed to abuse the people accused.

[DemonUK]

1 hour ago, andyscoot said:

Thankfully he's not been convicted of a crime.

He has (if he did it) however broken a code of conduct he agreed to when he decided to be professional rugby league player in this country and that private organisation can dish out fines/bans as they want. Pretty sure he still gets his wages, so he isn't being deprived of a living either.

Not sure why the only real defence is "it wouldn't bother me so it shouldn't bother anyone". Well done, insults don't affect you, have a pat on the back. Victim blaming rubbish.

It is against the law to discriminate against anyone because of:

• age
• gender reassignment
• being married or in a civil partnership
• being pregnant or on maternity leave
• disability
• race including colour, nationality, ethnic or national origin
• religion or belief
• sex
• sexual orientation

So if he has said what he is alleged to have said (haven't seen anything official) then I would have to disagree that he has only broken a Rugby League Code of Conduct

Equality Act 2010

[LeytherRob]

15 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Humour please stop 

There was always consequences, if it occurred on the field it was usually violent. I agree society is clamping down on abuse but now there are sections that look for ways to be offended then proceed to abuse the people accused.

Are you really trying to argue that was better? We're a sport that markets itself with inclusivity at the forefront, players making comments relating to disability is incredibly counterproductive to that when trying to push things like LDRL, PDRL and the wheelchair game. If you want to blame someone, blame Josh Maguire for clearly not learning his lesson last time, despite undergoing education on the matter. It's really not that hard to go 80 minutes of RL without throwing out that kind of language.

[Wolford6]

It seems to me that this offence could be penalised as a "bringing the game into disrepute" offence and/or "unsporting conduct" with fixed penalties depending on the scale of the  offence.

However, it could then be challenged by a player as "restraint of trade" by the RFL or Superleague.  All in all, it's a bit of a legal minefield.

My best solution would be for the miscreant to be given a three-match ban (official) and being completely cold-shouldered by the rest of the squad and management during those three weeks (unofficial but effective).

[ELBOWSEYE]

Just now, LeytherRob said:

Are you really trying to argue that was better? We're a sport that markets itself with inclusivity at the forefront, players making comments relating to disability is incredibly counterproductive to that when trying to push things like LDRL, PDRL and the wheelchair game. If you want to blame someone, blame Josh Maguire for clearly not learning his lesson last time, despite undergoing education on the matter. It's really not that hard to go 80 minutes of RL without throwing out that kind of language.

Not at all, I just answered a comment that said there were no consequences. Please read all the post and what I was responding too. As with most responses to the posts on this topic people have already decided I support McGuire when I have not wrote any support.

[RigbyLuger]

12 minutes ago, Wolford6 said:

It seems to me that this offence could be penalised as a "bringing the game into disrepute" offence and/or "unsporting conduct" with fixed penalties depending on the scale of the  offence.

However, it could then be challenged by a player as "restraint of trade" by the RFL or Superleague.  All in all, it's a bit of a legal minefield.

As part of his employment, he agrees to adhere to the rules of his club and the sport. If he doesn't want to do that, that's his fault. Same with taking drugs, betting on the sport, punching people...

[RP London]

16 minutes ago, Wolford6 said:

It seems to me that this offence could be penalised as a "bringing the game into disrepute" offence and/or "unsporting conduct" with fixed penalties depending on the scale of the  offence.

However, it could then be challenged by a player as "restraint of trade" by the RFL or Superleague.  All in all, it's a bit of a legal minefield.

My best solution would be for the miscreant to be given a three-match ban (official) and being completely cold-shouldered by the rest of the squad and management during those three weeks (unofficial but effective).

To be fair looking at the law he may want to be careful of the "legal minefield" as I dont think he will have as good a map as either the RFL or Warrington when you look at the law on discriminatory language. 

[Wolford6]

2 minutes ago, RP London said:

To be fair looking at the law he may want to be careful of the "legal minefield" as I dont think he will have as good a map as either the RFL or Warrington when you look at the law on discriminatory language. 

Reportedly, he denied saying it ... so maybe there's no corroborating evidence. Who knows?

[StandOffHalf]

20 minutes ago, Wolford6 said:

It seems to me that this offence could be penalised as a "bringing the game into disrepute" offence and/or "unsporting conduct" with fixed penalties depending on the scale of the  offence.

However, it could then be challenged by a player as "restraint of trade" by the RFL or Superleague.  All in all, it's a bit of a legal minefield.

My best solution would be for the miscreant to be given a three-match ban (official) and being completely cold-shouldered by the rest of the squad and management during those three weeks (unofficial but effective).

A bit of sense amidst the over-reaction!

[RP London]

2 minutes ago, Wolford6 said:

Reportedly, he denied saying it ... so maybe there's no corroborating evidence. Who knows?

He did, but then many convicted felons deny the crime. The official report is still to be published but do we think the RFL would punish without more corroborating evidence from what I remember of the first offense it was the ref and other players who corroborated it. 

[LeytherRob]

1 hour ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Not at all, I just answered a comment that said there were no consequences. Please read all the post and what I was responding too. As with most responses to the posts on this topic people have already decided I support McGuire when I have not wrote any support.

Pretty much all of your criticism has been aimed at Leigh and specifically Charnley for reporting what Maguire has said, rather than Maguire himself so i don't think it's unreasonable for anyone to assume you to have some level of support to Maguire.

[LeytherRob]

47 minutes ago, Wolford6 said:

Reportedly, he denied saying it ... so maybe there's no corroborating evidence. Who knows?

There's a chance it was picked up on one of the microphones even if the ref didn't hear it at the time. Without being at the tribunal and knowing what evidence was given it's all just speculation though. I'd be surprised if they dished out 12 games based purely on the word of one player though.

[ELBOWSEYE]

1 minute ago, LeytherRob said:

Pretty much all of your criticism has been aimed at Leigh and specifically Charnley for reporting what Maguire has said, rather than Maguire himself so i don't think it's unreasonable for anyone to assume you to have some level of support to Maguire.

You have obviously not read all my posts, but what you choose to take out of posts is up to you.

[Just Browny]

Case notes. 

https://www.rugby-league.com/governance/rules-and-regulations/disciplinary/disciplinary-case?case=17385

[RigbyLuger]

Warrington's legal person saying "the outcome would have an impact on the reputation of both players that were involved" is interesting. How does it impact on the reputation of Charnley if he reports unacceptable language to a match official? He's a "tell tale" or something else from the school yard?