How to rebuild Scottish RL?

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, Young Blood said:

Wales Scotland and even Ireland all in same boat Union is dominant code with soccer. Maybe have a Super League team based in each of those countries will draw interest. 

Ireland has its own sports as well. There's over 2000 GAA clubs across the island. Compared to 209 for union. Soccer has a lot more clubs than the GAA but is less popular. A Super League club in Ireland isn't viable. The only hope for Ireland is if league and union somehow merge one day to create a single code. Better to focus on countries like Greece or Jamaica where union is weak.

[SydneyRoosters]

28 minutes ago, Young Blood said:

Wales Scotland and even Ireland all in same boat Union is dominant code with soccer. Maybe have a Super League team based in each of those countries will draw interest. 

Don’t even try put Wales in the same boat as those other two.

[Young Blood]

27 minutes ago, SydneyRoosters said:

Don’t even try put Wales in the same boat as those other two.

Why is that please educate me.

[SydneyRoosters]

51 minutes ago, Young Blood said:

Why is that please educate me.

Wales has been a rugby league heartland since the sport begun. They have a produced multiple all time greats, contributed to a good chunk of Great Britains World Cup winning teams,  And even reached the semi finals by themselves twice. There squad this World Cup is 50% Domestic born compared to Scotland and Irelands who have 4 and 1 Domestic born players respectively. Wales is a known area that can produce first grade talent unlike Scotland and Ireland who are both incredibly amateur with a very very small amount of rugby league clubs.

[Young Blood]

10 minutes ago, SydneyRoosters said:

Wales has been a rugby league heartland since the sport begun. They have a produced multiple all time greats, contributed to a good chunk of Great Britains World Cup winning teams,  And even reached the semi finals by themselves twice. There squad this World Cup is 50% Domestic born compared to Scotland and Irelands who have 4 and 1 Domestic born players respectively. Wales is a known area that can produce first grade talent unlike Scotland and Ireland who are both incredibly amateur with a very very small amount of rugby league clubs.

Do you think a Super League team in Cardiff should be introduced?  Shame their population is so small, and probably are losing all three games this year.

[Big Picture]

5 hours ago, SydneyRoosters said:

Not entirely, But from what I’ve heard Rugby league has was first played in Scotland in 1904. If they Had interest in the sport I’m sure it would’ve been shown already. We need to stop chasing imaginary stuff that will likely Never come to fruition. Instead we should be focusing on Wales, A lost rugby league Heartland who have produced some of the all time greats. 2 Time Semi-Finalists and provided a good chunk of players in all Great Britain sides.

Interest was shown, but was knocked back by the small time mindset of British RL:

[SydneyRoosters]

5 minutes ago, Young Blood said:

Do you think a Super League team in Cardiff should be introduced?  Shame their population is so small, and probably are losing all three games this year.

100% in 2011 we had the Celtic Crusaders, A club based in Wrexham that reached the super league for 1 year. They were very important to Welsh Rugby league, Producing a lot of great Super league players Gil Dudson, Eliot Kear, Ben Flower, Lloyd White Etc.

Currently there are 2 Welsh teams in League 1 (3rd Tier) one of which (North Wales) we’re in the race for promotion however they don’t seem to have much interest in developing Welsh talent. The other one, West Wales Raiders have been the worst team in League 1 for a long time now and consistently get embarrassed by 80-100 score lines. Luckily they are very keen on Welsh development with most of there squad is from wales, However the squad is not very good and none came close to making the Wales squad besides Joe Burke. 

Unless something changes Wales main focus needs to be youth development and getting youngsters in Super League. They have recently made a partnership with Salford to give Welsh players a pathway to super league, Just a fews months ago a young Welsh kid called Joseph Cooper-Franklin Debuted for Salford so it looks pretty successful. 

But yes a new team in Cardiff would help if it was done right, unlike the other Welsh clubs currently.

[Sports Prophet]

I think it’s the same requirement for anywhere that wants to grow.

Firstly, the game needs exposure. You cannot get excited or enjoy what you don’t see.

I am fully committed to the notion that international growth, is dependent on the exposure of the sport on a day to day, week to week basis. The only vehicle that RL and most sports have for this is the professional club game.

With that exposure, comes enjoyment and interest. This converts into various participation opportunities such as spectating, playing and administering.

People often refer to the soccer or RU WCs as the events that inspires new players. There is no point inspiring people to play, if there is no opportunity to play. There is less likely to be opportunity to play, if there is a lack of interest. There is less likely to be interest, if there is not enough exposure.

I have long advocated that the best vehicle to grow the sport in new areas is to prioritise the delivery of the week to week professional game to be an entertaining spectacle, more so than 4-6 week international events/series.

Edited October 22, 2022 by Sports Prophet

[lucky 7]

1 hour ago, Big Picture said:

Interest was shown, but was knocked back by the small time mindset of British RL:

Possibly a golden opportunity missed all them years ago

[lucky 7]

8 hours ago, welshmagpie said:

I’ve turned the game off. It’s nothing more than a training run for Australia and it’s tough to see how far Scotland have fallen since the Brough/McCormack days.

I’d love to see them rebuild and re establish themselves but to do that things have to get better at home for them. What would you do? I appreciate money is a huge obstacle and without it very little can be done.

They failed to field a team in the U19 Euros this year, they only named 15 players for an U16 game against England too.

I don’t believe investment of time and energy into the adults game is all too worthwhile as the chances of it being a viable player pathway to improve the national team and very, very slim.

Taking a leaf out of Wales’ book would be a good starting place. Develop teams at U14 and U16 age groups and get children playing RL regularly either through fixtures or camps and festivals.

I’d establish a west Scotland and east Scotland program one based around Glasgow one based around Edinburgh. Hold regular training sessions to really drill the RL fundamentals into U14-16 year olds. This requires only a few coaches who can be supplemented by quality in the guis Rod guest coaches/Scottish pros like David Scott or Dale Ferguson etc.

These programs instantly give a player pool to select an U16 squad from, complemented further through ‘open trials’ or similar.

The next step is to establish a link to a SL academy or a championship club. A club like Barrow maybe or Newcastle Thunder given their proximity to the border. 

How many of the Scottish squad were born and raised in Scotland?

How many of the Scottish squad have played for a Scottish Rugby League club?

I think ALL TEAMS at the NEXT world cup should have a minimum of  5 players born in the country they are playing for and a minimum of 5 playing in there country's competition.

 

[SydneyRoosters]

8 minutes ago, lucky 7 said:

How many of the Scottish squad were born and raised in Scotland?

How many of the Scottish squad have played for a Scottish Rugby League club?

I think ALL TEAMS at the NEXT world cup should have a minimum of  5 players born in the country they are playing for and a minimum of 5 playing in there country's competition.

 

Facts, it’s an absolute joke how teams like Scotland are at the World Cup.

[Sports Prophet]

10 minutes ago, SydneyRoosters said:

Facts, it’s an absolute joke how teams like Scotland are at the World Cup.

What do you propose then?

You can’t represent the country of your grandparent? That’s a pretty common rule in world sport. 

[SydneyRoosters]

1 minute ago, Sports Prophet said:

What do you propose then?

You can’t represent the country of your grandparent? That’s a pretty common rule in world sport. 

I Propose No heritage players too give all teams an even playing field and reward nations that develop players.

It is a common rule in all sports but no other sport on the planet overuses it as much as us. In every sport on planet earth, the players who play for the country are all mostly from the country. Expect Rugby League

In this World Cup only 42% of players are playing for the country they are born in, compared to union at 77%. It is an absolute joke, if we want to develop the international game we have to do it properly not this absolute joke.

The whole reason that international sport exist is so countries can show off the best sporting talent, that is not happening here Australia and England are doing it for them.

[Sports Prophet]

1 hour ago, SydneyRoosters said:

I Propose No heritage players too give all teams an even playing field and reward nations that develop players.

It is a common rule in all sports but no other sport on the planet overuses it as much as us. In every sport on planet earth, the players who play for the country are all mostly from the country. Expect Rugby League

In this World Cup only 42% of players are playing for the country they are born in, compared to union at 77%. It is an absolute joke, if we want to develop the international game we have to do it properly not this absolute joke.

The whole reason that international sport exist is so countries can show off the best sporting talent, that is not happening here Australia and England are doing it for them.

I appreciate the sentiment and inclined to agree that it can look a little comical.

In saying that, I doubt many people from Greece, Italy, Lebanon, Jamaica, Tonga, Samoa, Cook Islands see it the same way as you do. The greater contingent of the non-pacific nations will hardly even know the matches are on. If they do happen to watch a game, I doubt they will even realise most their players are Australian anyway. So we need to be careful we are not making rules to head off perceived embarrassment, when the only one who is conscious of the matter is ourselves.

The target most definitely should be a minimum 60% born/representation ratio, but to completely abolish heritage rules used far and wide in the sporting world isn’t the answer.

[Sports Prophet]

2 hours ago, lucky 7 said:

 

I think ALL TEAMS at the NEXT world cup should have a minimum of  5 players born in the country they are playing for and a minimum of 5 playing in their country's competition.

 

What do you anticipate that proposal to achieve?

[Gomersall]

To build or rebuild something you have to have foundations in place first.

[GUBRATS]

7 hours ago, Young Blood said:

Wales Scotland and even Ireland all in same boat Union is dominant code with soccer. Maybe have a Super League team based in each of those countries will draw interest. 

While not the worst idea , we just cannot afford to do it 

[Death to the Rah Rah's]

11 hours ago, gingerjon said:

A grant for two development officers - one based around Glasgow, the other covering Edinburgh and the Borders - and support for kit and equipment, for a period of five years.

That would be where I'd start.

See how that goes and then see what the real foundations are.

Hasn’t that been done before on more than one occasion, and it’s been the usual crack of interest disintegrating as soon as the 5 year period ends?

for a game with limited resources we should be looking to utilise development officers where there’s a chance of developing the sport, not wasting resources just to rock a box for sport England 

[gingerjon]

6 minutes ago, Death to the Rah Rah's said:

Hasn’t that been done before on more than one occasion, and it’s been the usual crack of interest disintegrating as soon as the 5 year period ends?

for a game with limited resources we should be looking to utilise development officers where there’s a chance of developing the sport, not wasting resources just to rock a box for sport England 

Sport England wouldn't be involved, what with it being Scotland.

And, that would rather be my point. We seem to want either shortcuts or instant results or both. That will never happen.

What's needed, whatever is done, is patience, money, hard work, resources and a bit of luck.

That's always what's needed.

[Tommygilf]

Scotland need help, and any strength needs to be built on. I've said it before but my massive bug bear that the 2013-2016 Scotland squad success wasn't built on at all.

To me this (and other similar nations) is where the RFL have to step up. England are the only nation with the connections and support to get the funding towards these NGBs. We can do it, its in our interests to do it, we need to do more of it.

[Tommygilf]

"No history in the game"

Go tell me where the first Great Britain Captain to lift the World Cup was from. We only have two anyway, and neither were English!

[Jughead]

There’s some proper knee jerk nonsense in here. 

If the answer to Scotland’s issue is to only draw players from their small domestic game, I don’t want to be a part of it. That’s dangerous, unappealing and will result in 84-0 being deemed a “close” game, if/when they come up against more developed nations. 

[The Future is League]

2 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

What do you anticipate that proposal to achieve?

The Likes of Ireland, Scotland etc developing their own players

[Sports Prophet]

17 minutes ago, The Future is League said:

The Likes of Ireland, Scotland etc developing their own players

Why would removing heritage eligibility help Ireland and Scotland develop their own players? I don’t get the logic.

[The Future is League]

7 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

Why would removing heritage eligibility help Ireland and Scotland develop their own players? I don’t get the logic.

More game time in internationals