Covid loans

[iangidds]

I have just been reading about the RU English premiership clubs difficulties in paying back their loans, remind me did RL clubs get direct loans or was it the Rfl ? 

Who is liable for these loans ? 

I thought these would be gifts rather than loans from the Tory party but it seems Exeter took 2 covid loans from banks as well as the government.

[whatmichaelsays]

This provides some detail: https://www.rugby-league.com/article/56743/government-backing-for-rugby-league-in-coronavirus-crisis. These were always loans as far as I recall, but the RFL were quick to get their point across to the government given that they relied heavily on the "Workington Man" thing, and RL was one of the first sports to get any kind of support. It was one thing Rimmer did do well during his tenure. 

It makes out that the RFL secured the loans from HM Govt, and it was then on the respective clubs to apply to the RFL (presumably putting a business case together). 

Whether the clubs are "jointly and equally liable" or whether it is the RFL who is liable to HM Govt (and it being on them to persue any non-paying clubs) is probably not in the public domain. 

[iangidds]

35 minutes ago, whatmichaelsays said:

This provides some detail: https://www.rugby-league.com/article/56743/government-backing-for-rugby-league-in-coronavirus-crisis. These were always loans as far as I recall, but the RFL were quick to get their point across to the government given that they relied heavily on the "Workington Man" thing, and RL was one of the first sports to get any kind of support. It was one thing Rimmer did do well during his tenure. 

It makes out that the RFL secured the loans from HM Govt, and it was then on the respective clubs to apply to the RFL (presumably putting a business case together). 

Whether the clubs are "jointly and equally liable" or whether it is the RFL who is liable to HM Govt (and it being on them to persue any non-paying clubs) is probably not in the public domain. 

Ok thanks , seems like the RFU boys were taking large loans from the bank and Exeter who i thought were the flagshiip of how to run a RU club have liabilities of around 30 million pounds

[Griff]

Hard to say for sure, but it does look like some RL clubs took out Bounceback loans from what you can glean from their accounts.

[The storm]

1 hour ago, iangidds said:

I have just been reading about the RU English premiership clubs difficulties in paying back their loans, remind me did RL clubs get direct loans or was it the Rfl ? 

Who is liable for these loans ? 

I thought these would be gifts rather than loans from the Tory party but it seems Exeter took 2 covid loans from banks as well as the government.

Some union clubs are up to 70 million in debt

Playing billy big ###### with 5500 fans does not work 

[iangidds]

2 hours ago, The storm said:

Some union clubs are up to 70 million in debt

Playing billy big ###### with 5500 fans does not work 

Astonishing amounts of debt , long may it continue 

[ATLANTISMAN]

RU premiership clubs are in total s--t and its far worse than anyone on here realises.

The RU premiership is a complete financial basket case with no historic fan base (Just a fashion one over the last 20 years) as monty python said its a DEAD PARROT:)

There has never been a better time for outside investment in Rugby League.

 

Paul

 

[Futtocks]

5 hours ago, Griff said:

Hard to say for sure, but it does look like some RL clubs took out Bounceback loans from what you can glean from their accounts.

From memory, which may be inaccurate, the amounts were a fraction of the money demanded (and got) by RU clubs.

[sweaty craiq]

7 hours ago, iangidds said:

I have just been reading about the RU English premiership clubs difficulties in paying back their loans, remind me did RL clubs get direct loans or was it the Rfl ? 

Who is liable for these loans ? 

I thought these would be gifts rather than loans from the Tory party but it seems Exeter took 2 covid loans from banks as well as the government.

You thought loans were gifts, can you loan me your house please 

Any club who took one should be deducted central funds to pay it back

[Griff]

9 hours ago, Futtocks said:

From memory, which may be inaccurate, the amounts were a fraction of the money demanded (and got) by RU clubs.

We're posting about different things here.

Bounceback loans (or BBLs) were available to all businesses.

[Chrispmartha]

19 minutes ago, Griff said:

We're posting about different things here.

Bounceback loans (or BBLs) were available to all businesses.

And you could only get £50k max

[David Shepherd]

19 hours ago, Griff said:

Hard to say for sure, but it does look like some RL clubs took out Bounceback loans from what you can glean from their accounts.

BBL are a max of £50,000 though, in the grand scheme of things that's pocket change.

Very cheap money really.  Lots of folk in my trade (me included) took them not to survive, but to fund future investment.  Way, way cheaper than a normal bank loan.

[Chrispmartha]

29 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

BBL are a max of £50,000 though, in the grand scheme of things that's pocket change.

Very cheap money really.  Lots of folk in my trade (me included) took them not to survive, but to fund future investment.  Way, way cheaper than a normal bank loan.

I took one out, it was a no brainer, no personal guarantee and they didn’t even want proof of turnover.

[Midlands hobo]

19 hours ago, The storm said:

Some union clubs are up to 70 million in debt

Playing billy big ###### with 5500 fans does not work 

The recent house of commons hearings listed premier rugby debts including Worcester as 500million. Of which Exeter had the lowest.

 

[iangidds]

3 hours ago, Midlands hobo said:

The recent house of commons hearings listed premier rugby debts including Worcester as 500million. Of which Exeter had the lowest.

 

Wow thats huge debt, i remember a great quote when Union went professional

"You can make a small fortune from rugby as long as you start with a big one " seems very true.

[Pie tries]

The RU loans at Wasps and Worcester must be paid back - if clubs vanish - by RFU. Shameful the took mega Buicks despite knowing they were doing to the wall.

Credits the RFL for keeping our debt down….

[DACS]

I have to say I was a bit worried about the COVID loans ending up causing more problems than they solved, but it seems (touch wood) that RL clubs have generally managed them OK?

Seems that a lot of RU folks got deluded into thinking club RU was going to be huge just because international RU is.  Its the money from that side of things that no doubt enabled these clubs to borrow so much.

Utterly bonkers that some clubs were still seeking salary cap increases in a season when two clubs have gone bust. Just goes to show we're not the only sport where narrow-minded club at all costs focus is a problem.

[Griff]

7 hours ago, DACS said:

I have to say I was a bit worried about the COVID loans ending up causing more problems than they solved, but it seems (touch wood) that RL clubs have generally managed them OK?

Most clubs outside Superleague seem to have done well financially in the 2020 season.

[Sports Prophet]

Would love to see another established club go to the wall. Sale going bust would be a dream come true. Same for a smaller London club like Irish.

[Chrispmartha]

10 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

Would love to see another established club go to the wall. Sale going bust would be a dream come true. Same for a smaller London club like Irish.

bit harsh when its peoples livelihoods on the line

[Harry Stottle]

On 03/12/2022 at 13:10, Chrispmartha said:

I took one out, it was a no brainer, no personal guarantee and they didn’t even want proof of turnover.

So how is it payed back?

Is there a time scale involved or a percentage of profits perhaps?

[Chrispmartha]

6 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

So how is it payed back?

Is there a time scale involved or a percentage of profits perhaps?

It’s paid back like any other loan by a set monthly payment over 6 or 10 years, first year you didn’t have to make any payments but if you did they were interest free.

if you go bust and can’t pay, the government picks up the tab.

[JohnM]

1 hour ago, Chrispmartha said:

bit harsh when its peoples livelihoods on the line

They are not on the line, though. There are jobs galore over the M60 at the Trafford Centre.

[Midlands hobo]

Long commute from London 

[Midlands hobo]

8 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

Would love to see another established club go to the wall. Sale going bust would be a dream come true. Same for a smaller London club like Irish.

Irish, Bristol and Leicester are all pretty dubious in my opinion.